It is very disappointing for me to see the conduct of the Queensland teachers union and members over their pay dispute, and today's report of the union being "furious" at receiving a 4% payrise is the icing on the cake.

Some perspective in difficult financial times may quell some of this anger and belief that they are "entitled" to receive more.

In my company, since this time last year there has been 20% staff reductions across the board. Obviously that work has now been distributed among the remaining 80%.
Pay reviews (which incidently are usually much lower than 4%) are frozen for this financial year. As are bonuses, despite achieving performance measures.
And I'll get one argument out of the way, staff here are paid slightly below market rates, with the incentive of bonuses that can lift you above market rates for good performance.
My wife has a team of three workers in her job. She has had a full time employee go on maternity leave and she will not be replaced while she is off. There is no less workload, just less people to do it.
And this situation is repeated over and over among the majority of workplaces and businesses across Australia.

Yet, open the paper and you can see Qld teachers "furious" over their 4% pay rise. Perhaps the teachers could get in contact with the 20% of people who have lost their jobs from my company and explain to them how furious they are.

I think teachers should be made to get some perspective and work in industry for a few of their 12 weeks leave per year, most logically the industry they teach in. A little slice of reality may help them to understand that outside their world of teaching, everyone else also takes work home and works on weekends.
But the rest of Australia has a base of 48 weeks work/yr and 40 hrs/wk. Where teacher have 40 weeks work/yr and 30hrs/wk.

All government jobs should now be locked at max $52,000 a year.
Then give the benefits that can go with it (permancy.super,house,car etc)
Not much else I can or would say it is just pure greed.
Thanks have a good life from Dave

burbs

<< But the rest of Australia has a base of 48 weeks work/yr and 40 hrs/wk. Where teacher have 40 weeks work/yr and 30hrs/wk. >>

I agree with your assessment that this isn't the time to be pushing for unrealistic pay rises, but I must point out your ignorance on the hours worked by teachers. Unless you've worked in schools yourself or have a close relationship with someone who does, you're not qualified to cast the aspersions you have here.

I for one am a teacher who chooses to work on a casual basis, with all the disadvantages that entails, purely because I could not manage the relentless workload of full-time teaching, along with the demands of a family and running a household and all the while staying sane. A lot of teachers of course do manage, but for many others it comes at a cost somewhere along the line.

Few full-time teachers would work as little as 30 hours a week. Most work near double that, and more at times of reports and school camps etc.

The ten-week term might look appealing to an outsider, but for anyone who works in the system and experiences the constant rigour of working with large numbers of children, the need for an end-of-term break and recharge is obvious, and essential to coping with the demands of the job. A good proportion of those 'holiday' weeks is spent catching up on the myriad of tasks that don't get done during term and on preparations for the next school term or year. For most teachers, a large part of their break times are 'holidays' in name only.

<< .. everyone else also takes work home and works on weekends. >>

I know many others work long hours too, but not many take work home on the regular and consistent basis that teachers do. Lots of workers leave their job at the door. Few teachers have that luxury. For every hour of face to face teaching, there are two more spent in preparation, correction and miscellaneous associated tasks, much of that done at home.

Bronwyn,

Since you ask, both of my parents and my father-in-law have been teachers and I have 4 close friends currently teaching.

I am not suggesting that teachers don't do extra time. What I am suggesting is that so does the rest of the workforce, and I think a lot of teachers lack that perspective.

From your comments, substitute "constant rigour of working with large numbers of children" with "constant rigour of working with large number of customers or patients or cases"

You mention that few teachers do 30hrs/wk and most do double. That's true of the rest of the professional workforce as well. Some do the minimum. Most do more than that. Except other professions start at a much higher base hours.

To give you a comparion, if a teacher did the minimum, and worked 30hrs/wk, 40 wks/yr, they would work 1200 hours in a year. If an engineer did the minimum and worked 40hrs/wk, 48wk/yr they would work 1920 hours. That's a big gap.

I do wonder whether there would be less need to take work home and work in holidays if teachers attended school for a standard 8am-5pm day, plus longer when required, 48 weeks per year. This would align them more closely with other professions, but I am sure the unions and teachers would never let this happen.

Bronwyn
Amen!
While there are duds in every occupation I would remind Rehctub that most teacher have lengthy University training many have multiple qualification. School heads often have Doctorates plus.
Many of these additional qualification are achieved in their own time.

In many cases teachers have as much if not more qualification than the average GP.

My eldest has a masters and is a subject coordinator while on more than the minimum.
Has a home class of 35 year 10 (practising thuglets).
extensive class time,
co-ordination, curriculum and research duties.
administrative work,
on the school council and two other sub committees
open days, review meetings with often abusive/aggressive parents over their equally obnoxious more belligerent devil spawn.
camps, outings.
Did I mention the additional legal restrictions she faces that you don't?
Oh yes, by the way she can't fire anyone but is responsible for 10 teachers on her subject.

All in an suburban area that I avoid certainly at the times she goes home.

One teacher at that school was recently attacked. Another's home was vandalised by an disgruntled ex student. Despite all this she still tries to teach these ungrateful irks the basics they'll need to live. To her and most of her colleagues (she is by no means unique), like nurses its a vocation more than a job. Her time school time are effectively meaningless I guess she works close to 60 hrs a week.

BTW As an ex senior manager I wouldn't contemplate that much responsibility and agro for twice what she earns.

In short I think your uninformed generalised rant is well misplaced if only because you are lumping all teachers in the same smelly bucket.

Having said that, perhaps now isn't the best time to gain parity with other states...If these same teachers followed the money Qld Educational system would be in deep do do for teachers.

Examinator,

As I said to Bronwyn. I don't think teachers aren't doing extra time, just that the rest of the professional workforce is doing the same.

Actually I have university training. I am doing a Masters degree in my own time. And I work in an area with beligerent, abusive, potentially aggressive customers and a highly legislated environment, so I am very familiar with these challenges, as is the majority of the rest of the professional workforce.

The difference is I don't believe mine to be the only profession in that boat.

Happy to hear specifically where you think my comments are uninformed and generalised, but by voting as a majority to push for pay rises and go on strike, it's the teachers who have lumped "all teachers in the same smelly bucket."

If the teachers don't agree with the actions of the union, perhaps they could stand up and as the majority, tell the union how they want their interests handled. It is their union after all.