The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > General Discussion > Ten Thousand Boat People!

Ten Thousand Boat People!

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. ...
  6. 27
  7. 28
  8. 29
  9. Page 30
  10. 31
  11. 32
  12. 33
  13. ...
  14. 58
  15. 59
  16. 60
  17. All
Fourthly, it is just impossible as far as I can see, and CJ you seem to agree by way of not answering my repeated questions on this point; that we can accommodate a reasonably small or moderate number of asylum seekers in a highly humanitarian manner without spurring an enormous number of arrivals.

Fifthly, given this point, it makes eminent sense to curtail the onshore route completely and concentrate our efforts on our offshore refugee programs and other international aid programs.

Sixthly, if things are going to become a whole lot worse in terms of refugee movements, then we really do need to have our borders under control.

“I'm aware that my position is contradictory...”

A very frank statement! Surely if you have conflicting interests, then you have to sort out how to balance them so that they don’t conflict. You can’t just go on maintaining a contradictory position.

.
Pied Piper;

“Foxy:’Ludwig is suggesting is that we restrict the
numbers of ordinary immigrants - so that we can take
in more refugees. Perhaps that is something that
needs to be considered - as far as sustainability is
concerned.’

[GULP]”

Er um….what exactly do you mean?
Posted by Ludwig, Friday, 10 July 2009 8:49:30 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
“[GULP]

Er um….what exactly do you mean?”

I don’t feel stable, nah don’t take it like that… I mean any day I suspect Aussie being Aussie might say “Kiwi’s out!”. The views I see here don’t really separate immigrant from refugee and my own personal feelings don’t either. People are people and you should help them.

But I get a definite vibe about how in Australia no one is accepted unless a shackle dragger at one level or off the first fleet.

Do you think maybe all are worthy… do you think maybe humans should react to humans in a humanitarian way.

Antonios, You are right. At some point people might know this. No, it wont matter, you are right my friend.
Posted by The Pied Piper, Friday, 10 July 2009 11:46:46 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Ludwig, you seem to be missing my point. Australia's "inevitable" increased refugee intake and increased immigration will NOT happen in "isolation". The problem of displaced people will become so great that the developed nations will eventually be "forced", via necessity, to share the load. They will recognise that it's in THEIR interests to share the load. A STABLE world is in THEIR interests.

Over the past 20 or so years nations have become MUCH more aware of sustainability issues. In Australia, even my party the Liberals now recognise that our land needs to be managed on a sustainable basis (although there's still a few diminishing doubters amongst them), and thank God John Howard is gone.

Worldwide, in the coming decades, industry will be FORCED to change past practices via the force of "NECESSITY". The entire world is currently on that journey, and it will take decades to complete. Eventually there will be MUCH freer movement of people between countries, and the benefits will be obvious.

There's currently doomsday merchants on every street corner in our great country. Many of them see refugees and migrants as the "enemy". But I see a bright and wonderful future for this country and the rest of the world. A future based on sustainable farming and manufacturing practices, a future that WILL eventually be non reliant on coal, oil and nuclear power, out of "necessity". And the current polluting and destructive industry will attempt to fight on till the inevitable bitter end for them, but the clever businesses and corporations will change and adopt the new technology and practices when they realise sustainability is for "THEIR" long term benefit.

With changed practices, time and more open mindedness our country will eventually embrace refugees and migration as never before. Our population will soar, and because current resources are finite, newer technologies will lead the way to a SUSTAINABLE and bright future.

And the current doomsday merchants will be really p i s s e d off!
Posted by Master, Saturday, 11 July 2009 1:56:13 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Ludwig's finally coming clean:

<< ...even small numbers have over the last decade created a whole lot of tension in Australian society, a whole lot of political unrest, a huge taxpayer cost, etc. >>

Only because a significant proportion of the Australian electorate (including Ludwig and the various racists and xenophobes with whom he allies himself on this issue) have been receptive to the blatant dog-whistling engaged in by the Howard regime to attract the racist vote back from One Nation.

The rest of Ludwig's fears about asylum seekers consist entirely of supposition - this would have happened, that might come to pass, other stuff could occur etc etc. Ludwig parrots the expressed fears of the xenophobes who claim to be terrified that the humane treatment of a few thousand bona fide refugees who may arrive by boat will signal to the world that Australia is a 'soft touch', or some such paranoia.

I agree that it would be far preferable for all concerned if Australian Immigration authorities had some kind of viable system in place offshore to process applications from asylum seekers. While that is the case in parts of Africa, no such facilities currently exist for refugees from Iraq, Afghanistan, Sri Lanka etc, who end up falling prey to people smugglers. If there were, the people smugglers would go out of business.

Given that there is no "queue" for these people, Australia is legally and morally bound to accept bona fide refugees from such places, no matter how they get here.

Lastly, there is always an inherent contradiction between the interests of humans and that of the environment. In Australia, the environment has been going downhill since 1788, caused directly by the activities of people who've settled here from elsewhere. It always seems supremely selfish to me when the comparatively wealthy beneficiaries of previous settlement claim that there's no room for those invariably poor and brown people who have been displaced from there homes by no fault of their own.
Posted by CJ Morgan, Saturday, 11 July 2009 9:22:06 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
The Pied Piper
My friend I in an other thread I found you are speaking for goald coast, i think it is beter for you if stay in sydney, do not worry for the gutless!
I wrote in an other thread some thouhts for the need of a world government, including the problem of refugees, migrants etc Foxy said Bravo!Brilliantly said!Your best posts yet.http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=2915&page=2
I am an internationalist.
Do not worry we will not leave them to expell you! You are the best australians!
I said? you if you think a web site will be usefull to you I can register a domain name for you, tell me what name you prefer and if you prefer it com, org, net etc I can find a server to host it, I can install the scripts, advice to you how to write the pages and sent the password to you, change it and the side is yours. Do not worry I will promote and optimize your web site, I am very good on it.
Your business-services do not need high expences, it is more public relations and promotion. For my business I need at least $100.000 per year rent, employee, ads, and my income from my work and the sunday market is not more than $65.000 per year and I am afraid to take the risk, although I have huge stock of products.(I buy bulk from auctions).
Be happy my friend
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide
Posted by ASymeonakis, Saturday, 11 July 2009 10:10:57 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Antonios

Promoting unlimited immigration will push human populations beyond the ability of Australia’s land and water to sustain them. You appear to regard yourself as an expert on Australia’s immigration programme, without knowledge of the country’s state of the environment.

Australia has the lowest precipitation of any of the world’s inhabited continents. Seventy percent of Australia is either arid or semi arid land.

You flippantly state that Australia can continue plundering another resource for its water needs – the ocean. However, the marine environment, essential for the eight countries with coastlines on the waterway in the Arabian (or Persian) Gulf which depend on desalination, is in jeopardy.

As much as 64.9 tonnes of antiscalant, 23.7 tonnes of chlorine and almost 300kg of copper are pumped back into the Arabian Gulf daily from desalination plants around the region.

Salinity is more than 50 per cent higher than the average and the brine produced by desalination is dumped back in the ocean (as in Australia.) The long-term consequences could be profound for the Gulf region according to experts.

Coastal water temperatures are rising and salinity is more than 50 per cent higher than the average - predominantly the result of massive increases in the volume of desalinated water production to meet the demands of a growing population.

Bear in mind that the country of your birth, has a population of fewer than eleven million and some 94 per cent are Greek. Between 2001 – 2007, Greece deported some 240,000 illegal immigrants. During May there were violent protests by Muslim migrants where Police resorted to using tear gas.

Many men, women and children are trafficked to and within Greece for the purpose of sex exploitation or forced labour. Last year, Greece was suspended from U.N. carbon trading in an unprecedented punishment for violating greenhouse gas reporting rules. Concerns are regularly raised about Greece’s pollution and wetlands and non-absorption of EU funding for environmental projects.

You're extremely critical of the country which granted you residency Antonios - “forty percent of Australians are racist, bullies, etc etc.”

Australia or Greece Antonios – your choice.
Posted by Protagoras, Saturday, 11 July 2009 10:37:49 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. ...
  6. 27
  7. 28
  8. 29
  9. Page 30
  10. 31
  11. 32
  12. 33
  13. ...
  14. 58
  15. 59
  16. 60
  17. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy