The Forum > General Discussion > The GREAT BIKINI MARCH ...what is it ?
The GREAT BIKINI MARCH ...what is it ?
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Posted by BOAZ_David, Friday, 1 December 2006 7:34:01 PM
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Looks like this is going to jump around a bit.
Now their website says the march will be in the CBD. (council something or other) Anway... more to come. Its entertaining to see the Left going eloquently ballistic about this. There are some serious points though. Posted by BOAZ_David, Saturday, 2 December 2006 7:09:25 PM
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It looks like our resident crusader doesn't mind these frootloops attempting to hijack Australia Day.
The question is, will he be wearing a brown bikini, or perhaps brown lycra bike shorts? I really hope that Boazy and his Brethren all turn out in force - should be a good laugh :) Posted by CJ Morgan, Saturday, 2 December 2006 9:09:34 PM
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gawd! the thought of it, a 60 year old man wearing a brown bikini, a gideon bible in one had and flogging himself with birch stick with the other - all while and declaring this BS to be real Australian culture. Yeah sure.
Posted by Rainier, Saturday, 2 December 2006 11:00:54 PM
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Onya guys :)
Brown is not my color..black is ok... All I can say is this... I don't want to look back in 10 yrs time and wish I'd risked more. I'm finding my little dabbles into activism are such a rush, I'm tempted to become an existentialist :) To be sure.. the 'rush' is related to the unclouding of confused minds and the opening of hearts. The IR laws protest and my 'BLAME CHINA' sign thing went well actually and in fact functioned as street theatre and an attention getting device, which can lead to some very fruitful conversations on many issues including economic, cultural, racial, spiritual. yes..I'm seeing a therapist :) the one found in John 3:16 Keep up the valued criticism. I do think about it. In electronics, negative feeback has a refining effect on the quality of the waveform. Posted by BOAZ_David, Sunday, 3 December 2006 6:53:37 AM
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Sorry BD, but you've lost me on this one. A skank parade!
I just hope it'll be very cold and wet that day - now that could be something interesting. And, what happens if a bloke takes photos of them? Will their privacy be being invaded? Will he get arrested? Mate, only a woman could have thought up this nonsense. Posted by Maximus, Sunday, 3 December 2006 7:58:17 AM
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Good on you, Boaz, for posting this topic and for getting involved. Sounds like a lot of fun. And a most appropriate message to those who would try to force their [now, but not pre-1902] un-Australian ideas of dress upon those of us who don't want it.
You may be interested in a bit of Australian history on beach activities and beachwear. Swimming at the beach during daylight hours had been illegal for many years in the more populated parts of Eastern Australia. Then, in 1902, a Sydney newspaper proprietor named William Gocher openly defied the law by swimming at Manly. And he got away with it! http://www.library.usyd.edu.au/subjects/psychology/psychvideo.html http://www.freebeach.com.au/Neck-Knee-Nude.htm For a great overview of what eventuated over the years, get a copy of From Neck to Knee to Nude: http://www.library.usyd.edu.au/subjects/psychology/psychvideo.html This documentary makes the point that every improvement in acceptable wear [or non-wear] for Australian beaches has been won by open civil disobedience. I grew up in England. In about 1947, my elder sister, who was a glamourous sort of woman, made herself a bikini for a photo session. [Bikinis couldn't be bought in England at that time, but there were photos of bikini wearers in European magazines.] I suppose, to some people, that was pornographic! LOL. She sent the photos to her then fiance in the British Army. I'm sure they helped him to think of home! I came to Australia in 1962. My then wife looked great in a bikini and even wore string bikinis to Leeds City Council swimming pools, without any problems. When we got to Perth, we were told by well meaning friends that she would be ordered off the beach if she dared to wear such things here. But it never happened. Things were definitely improving, perhaps in part to the influx of "multicultural" people from Britain and Europe. My personal opinion is that wearing clothes to swim in makes about as much sense as wearing clothes in the shower [something I'm told often gets done in same-sex changing rooms at health/sports clubs, schools and pool and beach changing rooms] etc Posted by Rex, Sunday, 3 December 2006 8:21:49 AM
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Thanx Rex.... you just demonstrated one of the great positives of a forum like this.. "multi pronged research" and now I'll be much better informed on such issues as a result of your helpful input.
Take note others who prefer to just wax increasingly eleoquent in their insults :) I actually had it in mind to specifically research this issue.. from a social change perspective and looking at the particular agents of change, how it related to the law and to economic forces. THANX :) cheers cobba Posted by BOAZ_David, Sunday, 3 December 2006 8:54:19 AM
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Posted by Rainier, Sunday, 3 December 2006 10:44:16 AM
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Whatever Boaz's reasons.... and I am a suspicious soul, this is an excellent idea. If I lived in Melbourne I'd be there! I'm pleased Keyser Trad has been included as an unwelcome resident -- his recent 'sensitive' image is a fake. It is barely two years since he was calling for the right to stone to death adulterous women and all homosexual men.
Australians have long been puritanical, but that doesnt reflect their English origins -- more the Irish Catholic. Under English law, nude sea bathing was common until WWII. In the 1960's I wore merely a 'cache sex' pouch on the beach in Brighton and no one was offended. What intrigues me is the new 'modesty' of Australian males who today dont dare show even their thighs on the beach. Why is this? Apart from anything else, it is dangerous for boys to wear such baggy things as they make swimming impossible and drowning a greater possibility. Posted by ybgirp, Monday, 4 December 2006 10:47:18 AM
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"Do your looks matter?" Of course they do, but not as much as most guys think. You see men are visual beings and judge women by their looks: body, hair, face, eyes, legs and etc. So a woman has a much better chance at seducing a potential lover by looking her absolute best.
This is the reason why women everyday pile on make up and spend hours in front of the mirror, doing their hair and eye shadow. When a man sees an attractive woman, the woman's looks are what initially puts the man into a sexual state and makes gives him "butterflies." Women on the other hand, tend to be seduced by words and actions. Ever noticed how when back in high school you had a crush on a girl but she never seemed to notice you UNTIL you successfully approached her and captured her attention. Suddenly after a few chats she seems to be really into you, interesting. So unless the man is some kind of a male model or a celebrity in which case women will feel the "butterflies" for him. So while a lot of people may think that women may care about the men's looks, it isn't quiet so. So if you are not that appealing to look at, you are in luck. If you can make the woman feel all kinds of different emotions such as: love, lust, hate, warmth and tension then she will be drawn to you even if you look like George Costanza from Seinfeld. Looks can help you get an "audition" but if you do not show to her that you have much more to offer (not money or materialistic things) like the ability to make her feel an emotional connection and deep feelings for you then she will be gone in a flash. http://www.attractwomen.com.au Posted by AlexN, Monday, 4 December 2006 12:39:47 PM
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This just seems like a bit of a stunt to me.
On one hand it's obviously about the infamous "uncovered meat" statement but on the other hand it also seems to prove the point. I'm certainly no prude but parading down the street in bikinis will only objectify the women involved. Bikinis at the beach is one thing but this is just provocative exhibitionism for the sake of it. If Muslim women joined the parade wearing their hijabs, it would mean that it would be a legitimate womens' protest about the freedom to wear what you want in this society (which is also valid), but this is something else entirely. Do we have to top one outrageous act with another just to feel better about who we are? At best it will get a lot of laughs on you-tube. I'd be there if I could, but not for political reasons. Posted by wobbles, Monday, 4 December 2006 12:47:35 PM
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firstly...housekeeping.. ALEXN please don't use my thread for commerical self promotion! *smack*
ygirp.. my own motives are simply to make this event known... I'm more for modesty myself, but I support this event as an act of cultural assertion. Even though it is contextually 'wrong' to wear bikini's in the CBD (the new veneu for the march) in this case, as it has been promoted as a 'bikini' march it will be ok. I am a little concerned that I don't see sufficient (as yet) distance between the organizer and the Sponsor, but given that Christine (The organizer) does not yet even know how to email, I could understand this potential problem/issue might not be apparent to her. It sure IS a 'stunt' :) and a creative one at that. But every time I see a vid on YOUTUBE of Nasarallah or other Islamo fascists speaking about the glory of being killed for the sake of Allah, and knowing that any young Muslim in Australia can access such speeches.....I am all for anything which wakes apathetic and socially lazy Aussies up from their historical slumber. Posted by BOAZ_David, Monday, 4 December 2006 1:40:07 PM
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ybgirp, check out TrippleM's web site and link to The Cage (breakfast shows). They are running a Budgie Smuggler amnesty at the moment. I posted a link to it on the "Shiek Wot's is name has a point" thread.
Done in jest but the old budgie smugglers have been under attack for some time. That seems to be one item of clothing that society seems to be quite willing to villify quite openly. Where are all the bikini wearers speaking out in support of old mens rights to wear the Budgie Smuggler? R0bert Posted by R0bert, Monday, 4 December 2006 1:58:40 PM
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If,indeed, the ladies wear bikinis, it will appear as a ridiculous stunt. Properly if casually dressed would be the way to go-otherwise they are leaving themselves wide open to gibes. A bit of dignity will emphasise the point far more that Australians are fed up with all the unAustralian views of muslims.
I would like to see a march on Canberra to protest about the tribal people being imported into this country. Like the Lebanese who live here long enough to qualify for benefits, return back to live in their own country and scream for Australian help when their country does it's usual violent thing. It is the politicians who need a wake up. Posted by mickijo, Monday, 4 December 2006 2:38:51 PM
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I think this is going to be hijacked by right-wing extremists as another example of the Us and Them mentality.
Will Paris Hilton be leading the march? Posted by rache, Monday, 4 December 2006 10:19:21 PM
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BOAZ,
Just to wish you luck with the bikini march. Hope it turns out well, but given Melbournes weather, one can never tell. Stay away from those communist ladies, they are a dangerous species. Wear or carry a distinctive sign so we can tell it's you. You can bet I'll be watching the TV news that night. I had a good chuckle about your last encounter. pity about your sign. Hope you are not offended. Posted by Banjo, Tuesday, 5 December 2006 11:08:58 AM
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Banjo.. never mate :) its all good. I'm pretty robust when it comes to digs and jibes etc.
Micki has a point. I'd like to see 'modestly dressed women' in casual but comfy clothes with perhaps just a couple in bikini's for symbolic value. They could actually have a very good role playing segment. If its used to promote Australian culture, and to point out that we do have one, and that we are pretty comfortable with it...consider this. 1/ We have a segment called 'Greetings'. a) Japanese man comes and bows to the host. b) Maori man comes and rubs noses. c) Aussie comes and shakes hands. There are many creative ways of getting the point across. I'm getting closer to making a dedicated web site with all my whacky thoughts on it. I should have a 'cyber shop' selling 'Aussie pariphenalia' :) all proceeds to goto Aboriginal rehabilitation work. YOUTUBE is quickly becoming a gold mine. I'm finding it can be used effectively for evangelism and even things like Aussie culture promotion. I'm in contact with people from all round the world via its message section. Gee, you can even promote products there if u want. I recommend it for learning self defense also. Masato is a great jap Kickboxer with a very interesting technique "Stand out of their way and work on their leg" after 3 rounds they often just collapse :) But any cause could be promoted there, and its a pity that Christine Hawkins (Bikini march)does not even know how to email at this point in time. Brainy.. I'll wear something distinctive. Posted by BOAZ_David, Tuesday, 5 December 2006 8:39:27 PM
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http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20879483-2702,00.html
Muslim boys urinate on, spit on, and burn Bible. (MELBOURNE) That would be another reason to have the march, but perhaps the destination should be changed to the SCHOOL where these boys went. But, not really, because the Bikini march is not a 'Christian' event per se. I would love though, to see a heap of my Christian brothers and sisters trot along and demonstrate just how peacefully we can be in the face of behavior which would normally have the raging masses of muslims on the streets calling for blood and guts if the matter at issue was the Quran being desecrated. Maybe.. we can see. But the most important point is to show that Jesus taught Matt 5 43"You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor[h] and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies[i] and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect. So, maybe we can go there and hand out little gift packs to the Muslims ? :) My only serious desire as a result of this type of thing, is that we are protected against volatile reactions and be free to criticize Islam and Mohammed truthfully. I don't plan on calling Fred Phelps and family to zip over here and dance on the graves of newly slaughtered Muslim boys. "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, as I have loved you" John 13:34 Posted by BOAZ_David, Wednesday, 6 December 2006 7:44:12 AM
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Boaz,
In case your memory is a little short, the Qur'an was placed into urine (a toilet) in Guantanamo bay by Christian Americans. Perhaps those kids were just imitating what they'd heard others (Christian Americans) doing? Either way, what they did was disgraceful, and no Muslim has condoned it. For us, we consider sacred books to be inviolable items that should not be desecrated in such a manner. But the reality of it is that you should look to where they got the idea from. Posted by Abu Rashid, Wednesday, 6 December 2006 9:25:11 PM
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Don't hold your breath waiting for our pre-eminent anti-Muslim crusader to acknowledge the deceit in his posts about the Muslim school, Abu. I've noticed that when he's caught out telling fibs or the sheer idiocy of some of his claims is pointed out, he sort of scuttles back under his rock and pops up again on another thread.
In this case, several posters have pointed out that the school in question expelled the perpetrators and called in a senior imam to counsel the students about respecting Christianity and the bible, but Boaz has chosen to conceal this very relevant fact in his various rants about this incident. That makes him a liar in my book (which is neither the Q'uran or the Bible). Posted by CJ Morgan, Thursday, 7 December 2006 6:40:10 AM
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Hi Abu ...welcome to OLO. I've not seen you before so please feel free to contribute. I don't mind how passionately you make your views known, and unlike the Sydney Islamic forum where any 'upalatable' views are immediately censored, that won't happen here. (unless its profanity and extreme personal abuse)
C.J. is right..I am an adamant and passioanate 'anti Islam' personality here so you will need to be quite emotionally robust to interact on that level. I'm quite happy for Christianity and Christian history to be scrutinized and criticized with the 'gloves off'. I beg to differ on C.J. assessment of me as 'deceptive'. It's quite true that the boys were expelled. An Imam was called. 'damage control'. I take the view that what the boys did is just the outward manifest example of what many think anyway but don't do anything about. The Guantanimo issue ? Well.. I know it was beaten up in the Arabic press. I know some people died in subsequent protests, but can you point to actual evidence that it happened ? If it did, I doubt that it was done by 'Christian' soldiers. There is a difference between "Americans" and "Americans who know Christ". You were actually superimposing and "Islamic" view of religion on them. True Christianity is a relationship, not a culture. cheers mate. Posted by BOAZ_David, Thursday, 7 December 2006 7:12:42 AM
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CJ, Thanks for the warning, but he seems tame enough to me. Nothing wrong with him expressing his view, but he must realise he's going to be accounted for his lack of fairness and accuracy in representing Muslims in this manner.
Boaz, I likewise could retort that those schoolkids don't know Islam very well, and were acting out of unIslamic character, so the same goes both ways. Also it's well known that American soldiers have desecrated Islamic sites and articles all over the place, not just in Guantanamo Bay. If you like I can post for you pictures of US soldiers desecrating mosques and other Islamic sites/articles. Also US tanks with crucifixes hanging from them and many other pictures which confirm the fact that some Christian American soldiers have engaged in anti-Islamic behaviour. No doubt you'll claim it's just more propaganda from Arabic media outlets, but the fact is, it happens. Get over it, and realise it probably has some effect on teenage boys in Australia, who happen to be from Muslim families. And in case you weren't aware, school camps for 13 yo. boys are the most likely place for stupid and idiotic actions to occur. I'm sure non-Muslim 13 yo. boys probably do similar or worse things than this. Posted by Abu Rashid, Friday, 8 December 2006 6:30:02 PM
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Abu Rashid, you are missing a key part of BD's logic.
People who may see themselves as christain are not if they do things which are inconveniant to the way BD wants the christian faith to be seen whereas all muslims are muslim regardless of how they act. Likewise any part of the Bible that is inconvenient has passed away under the new covenant but muslims will be held acountable for the most extreme interpretation of the Quran BD can imagine regardless of how muslims choose to interpret those sections. It's all so simple really and saves BD from having to address a lot of otherwise difficult issues. Or we can just assume that the term deceptive was an example of CJ pulling his punches. R0bert Posted by R0bert, Friday, 8 December 2006 7:06:00 PM
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Robert,
if they do things which are inconveniant to the way BD wants the christian faith to be seen whereas all muslims are muslim regardless of how they act. --- Good point, obviously that's suitable for his arguments, and since he doesn't really seem to be a "thinker" it's obvious he's not going to probe further and consider whether some Muslims may have acted contrary to their faith's teachings. However this next point was not on the same par: but muslims will be held acountable for the most extreme interpretation of the Quran BD can imagine regardless of how muslims choose to interpret those sections. --- Contrary to what we read in the mass media about the so called numerous and widely varying "interpretations of the Qur'an" there is actually very little difference of opinion amongst the vast majority of the Muslims (ie. the Sunni Muslims). As the Shi'a are only about 10% of all Muslims we can pretty much leave their view out as negligable, but the remaining 90% of Muslims largely rely on the exact same "interpretations" or what we would call Tafasir (explanations) of the Qur'an and Hadith material. And not one of those explanations claims it's permissable to desecrate other religions books with lewd acts. So Mr Boaz will just have to accept that this action has nothing to do with Islam, and was probably an imitation of the Great Christian Soldiers of America (no matter how unpractising they are). Mr Boaz is obviously a dedicated Christian who's "accepted Christ into his heart", and since we know that the Christian Doctrine is not a very intellectual one (not belittling its spiritual value for its adherents), we can see why Mr Boaz holds the views he does. After all, this is the religion of Inquisitions and Crusades and book burning and all those other loving and peaceful acts that Europeans suffered for a good millenium or so. But wait, I bet those guys weren't real Christians either and hadn't accepted Christ into their hearts properly. I wonder where the "true Christians" were during 95% of Christianity's history? Posted by Abu Rashid, Friday, 8 December 2006 8:08:50 PM
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Well well :) I see this has turned INTO an iquisition against poor old dim witted unthinking Bozo .....
Never mind that it was about the Bikini march.. we can go in anydirection you blokes enjoy :) Bikini march cancelled, but it has already had world wide impact. Goal achieved. Threats to kill scared off the organizers. But.. the spirit of the march will go with me at next years "ONE" demo. 1/ I aint that stuuupid as to give my home details. 2/ If any smart alec thinks a few threats would ever stop me, he is wildly mistaken, in fact if anyone does wish to take issue with my point of view, they can either debate me or make an appointment to have a whack at me in a gym. Back to business. Abu.. I'm a bit constrained for time right now, so its difficult to address issues raised by you and Robs mutual admiration club there :) but be sure of one thing, no..its 2 things. 1/ I am totally happy to engage on ANY Old testament issue and Robert should know this. He simply chooses to disagree with me. (and scripture) Seeing as you and Rob 'discussed' me together I can now inform you of where Rob is coming from. He is a 'former' christian who lost faith in the 'angry' God of the Old testament. That pretty much sums him up..right Rob ? 2/ ISLAM... I am also happy to deconstruct Islam in terms of its sunnah and theology based on the Quran, and hadith, and I should warn you that I don't pull punches. You may well be offended by what I say, but I will limit the adjectives as much as possible to the text. Re Quantamano..you have 'proof' ? :) if yes..so ? Re the boys... not a big issue to me, plenty of others to pick. First one. WOULD you kill a fellow muslim who is invading this country and swear so on the Quran ? (I'm pushing for this to be a condition of migration.) Posted by BOAZ_David, Thursday, 14 December 2006 1:09:15 PM
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ABU... I've got a bit more time now.
Let me addresss a question to you if I may. "How many times was Saffiya bint Huyayy married, to whom, and what is your source" ? (I only want the absolute earliest please) From there we can discuss a few things. Please see my new discussion (if it is approved) and you can spread the word :) The Great Australian Bikini March CANCELLED, but...Lazarus with a triple bypass" ? This event (now dead) has received world wide attention, and I see no reason for it to just rot in the social ground.... Posted by BOAZ_David, Friday, 15 December 2006 2:37:47 AM
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BD, actually it was more about the absolute failure of the "head" of the church to govern his church. Until I realised that there was nothing to respect in the headship I plastered over the other stuff with the some of the same denial as other christains.
R0bert Posted by R0bert, Saturday, 16 December 2006 9:55:48 AM
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Thanx Rob..... yes.. I do recall that was an issue there also...
hey.. where has Abu gone.... did I scare him off ? Tomorrow, am heading to Gippsland for aunties 80th b'day..the last remaining Aunty on mums side.. was 3 girls and 3 boys in the family, I'll be so sad when she finally surcumbs to the battle of life. Only she and one uncle still with us. Hope all is well with you and that you are working through your own family situation. cheers cobber. Posted by BOAZ_David, Saturday, 16 December 2006 7:57:43 PM
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but....
WHAT...IS IT ?
http://thegreataustralianbikinimarch.wikispaces.com/
WHO is running it ? (see above link)
and
http://www.morelandleader.com.au/article/2006/11/27/7575_cov_news.html
It appears that a groundswell of Aussie silent majority is finally gaining momentum and is prepared to speak, and be heard.
The movement is simply middle Australia, neither 'Right nor Left' making a cultural statement and asserting "We DO have a culture".
It's more than that. (I've just spoken to the organizer, she seems a nice lady) It is the heart cry of a people who are feeling they are rapidly becoming 'no people' by aggressive cultural influx and multicultural mafia.
There have been attempts by Ultra right wing extremists to hijack the march, and also attemps by the Left to mischaracterize it as 'racism' (duh.. now I didn't see THAT coming :)
Even 3AWs Neil Mitchell went into shock jock mode and mischaracterized it. (he was pulled up on this)
ME ? I'll be there, you betcha, and I urge all thinking Aussies to do the same. I'm sure there will be controversy, maybe even some unhealthy behavior by those who do NOT fit the March personality profile, but this is not a reason to not have it.
The march will begin
BEGINNING: Clifton Park, Brunswick, Melbourne - next to Brunswick Train Station
DESTINATION: The Islamic Information and Support Centre, 19 Michael St, Brunswick.
10,000 seems like a goodly number to start with :) Hey..why not all Melbourne.
I'll keep you all posted.