"Your second 30 sec 'X' link is of two men, one armed, loading a dead body into a car, what does that prove? Nothing."

You're right as usual Paul, but how is your view of what constitutes evidence for an act by an alleged UNRWA employee consistent with your acceptance of George Pell's guilt on the basis of the word of one person about an alleged event decades prior?

Hi Fester,

"your acceptance of George Pell's guilt on the basis of the word of one person about an alleged event decades prior?"

In the first instance, Pell was found guilty, by a court of law, and there was no verdict delivered by me, that was that. Then Pell was exonerated on that one specific charge, on a legal technicality, and not on the evidence, rightly so. Many other allegations, about 20 in total, of Pell committing paedophilia have been aired, there will never be another case brought before a court of law as the bloke is dead. That's my thoughts on Pell. If I had been a choir boy in the days of Pell, would I have felt safe left in his company, on balance probably not.

"how is your view of what constitutes evidence" The findings of a court of law, rather than hearsay and media gossip, like on this forum.

Good Morning Fester,

I wasn't able to reply to you on this site earlier
because I'd used up my quota of posts. My apologies.

I did put a post on another discussion.

Amnesty International and many other humanitarian
organizations have expressed their concern of the
unprecedented scale of the eruption of violence
between Israel and Palestinian armed groups.

The brutality inflicted on civilians by both sides in
the conflict has shocked the world. The attacks by Palestinian
armed groups are quickly and rightly condemned by the
international community.

But it's Israel's unrelenting assault on occupied
Palestinian Territories that has caused by far the
greatest devastation.

The aerial bombardment and a ground invasion of Gaza by the
IDF has created a desperate humanitarian disaster. And as
military operations are carried out with little apparent
regard for civilian lives the death toll keeps climbing
daily.

You accused me of Jew bashing and Jew hatred.
No. Giving facts from various sources, and quoting world
opinions including from humanitarian organisations, as well
as supplying reputable links does not amount to either Jew
bashing or Jew hatred.

However, this is quite common. It's what happens when you dare
to criticize Israel as even many famous Jews have learned.
You become persona non grata. You're not allowed to
criticize Israel. Even though Israel currently deserves
criticism of the most severe kind.

I believe, along with Miriam Margolyes, Antony Loewenstein,
Prof. Ilan Pappe, and so many other, that "My country, right
or wrong, does not work."

But don't get me wrong. I do not blame you in any way for
your opinion. You are not alone - even though support for
Israel without questioning its actions is now dwindling.
There's so many false narratives and such high stakes
that it is crucial everyone knows how to fact-check the
information they come across.

Especially always verify the source of information. And,
look-out for dehumanizing language as well as read the
documentation in full.

I look forward to further other discussions with you.

In this one - I'm out!

"Many other allegations, about 20 in total, of Pell committing paedophilia have been aired,"

By your standards Paul that statement is as meaningless as the thousands of alleged examples of terrorism, support of terrorism and abusing children by UNRWA employees, including the IDF finding a major Hamas facility under UNRWA HQ and connected to its power supply. I guess you will have to wait for the court cases before you can give it any credibility.

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20240210-israel-claims-hamas-tunnel-found-under-un-agency-gaza-hq

Hi Fester,

Yes, they are allegations, and allegations are not proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law. In war there are lots of allegations made by both sides, some are eventually proven, others are not. Many allegations are made for propaganda purposes. The "evidence" concerning the UNRWC that you posted, and I made reference to, was in my opinion weak in the extreme. What there is evidence for, and its undisputed fact, tens of thousands of Palestinians, mostly women and children are dead at the hands of the Zionists. Much stronger allegations, than your "evidence" about the culpability of the UNRWC with terrorism. There are claims that the IDF is killing so many as an act of retaliation, along with the other reason of ethnically cleansing Gaza of the Palestinians, so an expanded Pan-Israeli state is the final outcome.

Just as a side; What do you believe should be the final outcome for the 2 million Palestinians living in Gaza?

Dear Paul,

«What there is evidence for, and its undisputed fact, tens of thousands of Palestinians, mostly women and children are dead at the hands of the Zionists.»

It is alleged, but unproven and still disputed that:

* Tens of thousands of [non-combatant] Palestinians are indeed dead.
* They were killed by Israel, rather than by Hamas (including for the sake of boosting that number and/or as punishment for supporting Israel or providing it with information).
* They are mostly women and children.
* Even if killed by Israel, their Israeli killer(s) are Zionist(s).

«There are claims that the IDF is killing so many as an act of retaliation, along with the other reason of ethnically cleansing Gaza of the Palestinians, so an expanded Pan-Israeli state is the final outcome.»

If these claims are correct, then that means that the IDF is undisciplined and acts against the official orders of its commanders.

I consider it likely that a few IDF soldiers do act against their orders and I hope they be caught and brought to justice.

And if indeed an expanded Pan-Israeli state and/or ethnic cleansing is the desired outcome, then Israel is doing extremely poorly and as Napoleon commented about his loss of soldiers: "one night in Paris will replace them all"!