The Forum > General Discussion > A Million Or More Refugees From Ukraine And China
A Million Or More Refugees From Ukraine And China
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Posted by shadowminister, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 9:40:14 AM
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Yeah Paul I get it.
70 years of Soviet archived data invalidated because the yanks provided some funds to help analyse the archive. The archives tell you things you'd prefer weren't true and any excuse to ignore them will do. Which of course explains why you are so historically challenged. Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 12:23:28 PM
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Hi mhaze,
"Europe has been yanked out of its idiotic reliance on Russian supplies." I'm curious about this, why is it important to stop european reliance on Russian energy? Isn't what's best for the Europeans themselves whats really important? Sure the US can sell more oil and LNG now at a much higher price, but European economies are in the toilet, businesses are closing their doors and consumers are paying much more, 6 time the price for LNG. "...Ukraine and the west should surrender because Russia threatens to use its nukes. If the US made such threats..." -If the Chinese had conducted an overthrow of Mexico and installed a pro-Chinese friendly regime and armed that regime to the teeth and started killing Mexicans that didn't go along with it, and America came into the conflict in support of those Mexicans and said they were going to nuke the Chinese-lead government of Mexico, I'd be supporting the US. I'd be against the Chinese and supporting the US, saying there was a risk of nuclear war. - And saying the Chinese are not respecting the United States legitimate security concerns, and that the U.S were right to not want to tolerate Chinese nukes on their border. "AC isn't interested in peace or justice or a safe world order." - That's simply not true. Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 8:07:47 PM
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Vietnam was started because of a lie.
http://allthatsinteresting.com/gulf-of-tonkin What's more there were many US servicemen left in captivity in Vietnam due to non payment of reparations. http://veteransforcommonsense.org/2008/09/21/senator-mccain-and-the-vietnam-war-prisoner-of-war-cover-up/ "Included in the evidence that McCain and his government allies suppressed or sought to discredit is a transcript of a senior North Vietnamese general’s briefing of the Hanoi politburo, discovered in Soviet archives by an American scholar in 1993. The briefing took place only four months before the 1973 peace accords. The general, Tran Van Quang, told the politburo members that Hanoi was holding 1,205 American prisoners but would keep many of them at war’s end as leverage to ensure getting war reparations from Washington." "World Peace Council was fully run by the Soviets. Their archives confirm it." Let's say that's true, I don't know that it is, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for a minute. - The US has been doing the same exact stuff in countries all over the world for decades. What about Ukraine, Myanmar, Thailand, Georgia stuff going on right now. "International Institute for Peace, International Organization of Democratic Lawyers, International Union of Students" - You want me to believe the soviets funded democratic movements and student protest groups? - That's a big stretch, I'd have to see the evidence to believe that. That's the Wests MO. I oppose sanctions and overthrows, so I'd oppose those coups no matter which side was conducting them. I believe that a nation should manage its own affairs free from foreign influence. - And I don't think trade should be used as a weapon, it's collective punishment. Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 8:30:20 PM
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Hey shadowminister,
"Yes, Russia withdrawing from Ukraine can stop the war so start shouting instead of mumbling platitudes like a moron." China has changed their stance. West alarmed as Xi tweaks China's position on war; Putin-Jinping hold marathon talks | Watch http://youtu.be/4qkwCVQPaMo "Moscow uses Xi Jinping's visit to warn west of a bigger war & possible 'lethal' support from China, which could be a replication of arms supply to Ukraine" Didn't I tell you this would happen? That China would not allow Russia to lose. Russia and China's plans to de-dollarise and support each other are too important. - Looks like China is willing to take the next step if the West does not stop arming Taiwan. "The Chinese President Xi Jinping has even tweaked Beijing's formal position on Ukraine war by effectively siding with Moscow on 'Special Operations'." "China's Official position on Ukraine war: Old Position = Respect the sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity of all countries New Position = Respect legitimate security concerns of all countries" - Putin and Jinping are discussing China's Ukraine peace plan. "This visit is a signal for the west to stop pumping weapons into Ukraine and push Kiev to come to the negotiating table" - Also, I can tell you that Ukraine is extremely important to China because of their Belt and Road Initiative. Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 8:47:52 PM
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Hi AC,
"I believe that a nation should manage its own affairs free from foreign influence." Not according to SM, if a country wants an independent policy and self determination with its own affairs, and that action is not serving American interest then "regime change" is the order of the day. According to SM; "President Yanukovych wanted to take Ukraine away from committing to an FTA with the EU to trade primarily with Russia" Seems that was not serving America's interest, so Yanukovych had to go. SM said this Yanukovych was corrupt, I don't know. America has no problem with supporting corrupt governments that are serving their interest, Marcos in the Philippines is an example of a corrupt leader supported by the US, there are many others Posted by Paul1405, Tuesday, 21 March 2023 8:54:16 PM
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Now you are just lying and spouting bullsh1t conspiracy theories. There is no evidence whatsoever that the US funded the uprising in 2014. The US funded about $5bn from 1992 to build infrastructure that had been neglected while part of the USSR.
The protests started when the corrupt president Yanukovych wanted to take Ukraine away from committing to an FTA with the EU to trade primarily with Russia clearly for personal profit and was looking to drag Ukraine into autocracy. It would be impossible for the US to drum up the 100 000s of protesters. The violence started after the government started shooting protesters.
As for the "rules based order" Rules are required, the alternative is chaos. As for breaking treaties that they have signed, Russia and China are the worst culprits.