david f writes

'I think that the wrong side won. It is hard for me to think that Islamic rule would have been worse than what happened with Christianity.'

In actual fact under Secularism you are far more likely to be a target of violence and/or murder than Islam or Christianity. The mother's womb is the most dangerous place to be under Secularism. Stalin and Mao murders in the name of secularism/atheism make the crusades look like kinder garden stuff. Your blatant bias in your conclusions from history are shown to be crap from the fact that no one wants to live in Islamic countries where people have always lined up to live in countries founded on Christian principles. In fact you would not be allowed to spew your vile in a Islamic nation. Your anti Christian views really do blind you of any reasonable conclusions

David F,

Whilst I strongly agree with Runners reasoning, I do agree that that is a pretty crazy statement...

Are you actually saying you'd prefer to live under strict Islamic law over living within secular Christian society?

Not the use of "under law" and "within society" these are the differences in the two... It comes down to religions thinking being able to be legally imposed on us or not.

Give me one - just one - instance of Stalin or Mao citing atheism or secularism as a motive for killing.

Bush's Christianity is as much to blame for the mess he made as his Satanically evil offsiders are.

Sancho you ask
'Give me one - just one - instance of Stalin or Mao citing atheism or secularism as a motive for killing.'

How about you giving one just one example of a death because someone is following the Lord Jesus Christ's teaching. One could easily argue that the Catholic church was acting a lot more like heathens, atheist, secularist or Muslims when killing innocent people.

Meredith asked: Are you actually saying you'd prefer to live under strict Islamic law over living within secular Christian society?

Dear Meredith,

I certainly prefer to live in the secular Christian society of Australia. However,

I wrote:

“Just think if the Muslims had won there would not have been the Crusades, the Inquisition, the Wars of the Reformation along with the other evils of intolerant, murderous Christianity.

I think that the wrong side won. It is hard for me to think that Islamic rule would have been worse than what happened with Christianity.”

My writing above clearly referred to an earlier period.

Islamic society in the eighth century was a much kinder more tolerant society in general than Christianity. When Jews were expelled from Spain many of them fled to the Islamic dominions.

Christian society has historically been murderous and intolerant. I don't think I have any anti-Christian prejudice. I just recognise the way things have been between Islamic and Christian societies for most of history. In medieval times Islamic universities had Buddhist, Christian and Jewish scholars while universities in Christian areas were restricted to Christians.

My answer to your question depends on which secular, Christian society you are talking about. Secular, Christian societies still contain much of the hatred and prejudice promoted by Christianity. Nazi Germany was a secular, Christian society where the Christian churches in general backed Hitler and his murderous program.

My chance for life in a society under strict Islamic law would be much better than in the secular Christian society of Nazi Germany.

In 1935, in a book called "It can't happen here", the author Sinclair Lewis said

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross."

In the West (and especially under the Bush regime) we have experienced -

Extreme nationalism (you're either with us or against us),
The disdain of human rights,
Unprecedented secrecy,
Military supremacy over domestic needs,
Fraudulent elections,
Suppression of labor power and the protection and strengthening of corporate power,
Use of religion to manipulate public opinion,
Tightly controlled mass media,
Th sanctioned use of torture and
The hatred of intellectuals... and the list goes on.

All are typical symptoms of emerging and growing fascism.

History will indeed be the judge.

Since the time of the Roman Crassus, political success historically comes from the existence/creation of a dangerous enemy and the notion that only the encumbent can protect the voters.