The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > Article Comments > Myth busting > Comments

Myth busting : Comments

By Bren Carlill, published 10/6/2008

Israel did not replace or destroy any country and did not prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state.

  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. ...
  7. 7
  8. 8
  9. 9
  10. All
A simplistic view but right on the money. I have puzzled a long time over where the so-called 'Palestinian Arabs' came from. Why wouldn't the Arab countries accept back the Arabs living in Israel at the time of its creation? No doubt that political reasons underpinned, and still underpin, this. Also, one needs to ask, what was Britain's role in all this? And the purpose for Britain's actions. But then you have a whole other story....

There is increasing evidence that Israel is being blamed for the woes of the middle east when in fact the blame lies elsewhere. It is even being touted that Israel is to blame for the rise in oil prices even though Israel is one of the few middle eastern countries that does not have oil. The fact that it even made the news in the outside world though is very telling. One needs to examine further the claims made against Israel. Unfortunately few do.
Posted by arcticdog, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 8:37:19 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Bren Carlill,

Oh, I see the present state of misery of the Palestinians is all their fault,really?Your historical excursion is irrelevant to the an ethical analysis of the present situation, human history is a record of migrations,invasions and conquests. Many of the present Palestinian population could probably trace their ancestry to the Bronze Age inhabitants of the area.The murderous behaviour of some Palestinians doesn't negate their claims to their farms,houses and businesses. Why do the settlements expand? Claims as to ethnic/religious primacy as a justification for Israel's expansion are morally valueless. Finally, to deal with the anticipated riposte, I support Israel's right to exist and favour a two state solution.
Posted by mac, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 10:28:49 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Mac is absolutely right when he states that "human history is a record of migrations,invasions and conquests". The end of WWII presaged an extraordinary level of migration and ethnic cleansing in much of Europe (described in Tony Judt's book Postwar); amazingly and fortunately, this was conveniently forgotten thereby allowing the most extraordinary period of peace to break out in what had hitherto been a continent of heavy conflict.

The problem in the Middle East though is that, by the insistence of Palestinian refugees of their right to return, they are not allowing themselves (or being allowed to) move on. As Bren Carlill points out, the Jewish refugees from neighbouring countries lost their homes, their livelihoods and their histories when they were forced out by the Arabs, but rather than wallowing in misery and a sense of entitlement, they have built new lives for themselves in their new homes (including many in Israel).

The real villains are the neighbouring Arab countries who have kept the displaced Palestinians living in misery in refugee camps for over 60 years so as to use them as a propaganda tool in their desire to see the destruction of Israel.
Posted by Cazza, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 10:50:53 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
The author says:

"The Palestinian refugee crisis occurred because of the actions of Palestinian and other Arab fighters. ... Instead of fighting, many fled well before the war reached them. They locked their front doors and left, expecting to return a couple of weeks later, once the land was free of Jews"

What contorted reasoning is this? Supposing they were to blame for the fact that they weren't in their homes for those two weeks. What stopped them returning to their homes? The cause of the refugee crisis now (and for the last 59 years) is that they haven't been allowed to return to their homes.

"to leave refugees suffering needlessly is immoral"

Indeed it is. And the primary responsibility to admit them lies with the country where their homes are, where they were living before the "crisis" was brought about.
Posted by jeremy, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 11:33:11 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
AMAZING.. almost David Copperfield-ish from MAC.....

Mac says:

<<Your historical excursion is irrelevant to the an ethical analysis of the present situation>>

Hmmmmm...Palestinians are in a terrible state.. so..nothing to do with history..nah.

<<human history is a record of migrations,invasions and conquests.>>

Oh wait.. IT IS to do with history..and here MAC is saying that this kind of thing happens all the time.. and presumably therefore is 'par for the course.

Well said Mac.. so the invasion of the area in the 7th century by Omar and his hoardes...(and the subsequent dismantling of Christianity and Judaism)

and the Crusades in the 12th ish century.. and the invasion of the Israelis in 1948.... its all just par for the course..

So....obvious question... why so fixated now on the Palestinians?

On the one hand you say "This is life, this is how it works" and then you say "Oh but wait.. THIS poor invaded mob deserve special treatment.

Do you have any compassion for the many 10s of 1000s of Jews exiled from the surrounding Arab Countries?

It seems to me that:

1948... Jews exiled, hunted out of Arab lands.
1948... Arabs depart Palestine from areas occupied by invading Jews.

Seems like one equals the other to me.

The Jews who were driven/hunted out are doing fine... so why can the Palestinians not? aaah..THAT is the question.

If they resigned themselves to your good advice "history is the record of invasions migrations etc"...then why don't they just get on with what every OTHER group has had to do.. build new lives?

Perhaps you want to reverse history JUST for the Palestinians, but NOT for the Jews? What about we white pella's in Australia.. do you want to reverse it here too? of not, WHY not?
Posted by BOAZ_David, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 12:07:56 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
There was no such country called 'Australia' before 1770 when it was 'discovered' by Capt James Cook.
I feel sure the Indigenous inhabitants did not think it was lost .

The fact that they believed they owned it by virtue of their presence is recognised today by legal opinions such as the Mabo decision and the Land Rights process that is continuing where the claimants need to prove their attachment to the land

And so it was with the people who now call themselves 'Palestinians'

Your argument may be historically factual but it is nontheless spurious in the light of the human misery that is the daily lives of modern day middle eastern Arabs.

Bear in mind that until the 1948 decision of the UN, there was no such Country as Israel

If it wasn't for the strategic aspirations of the USA and their support for the Israeli presence including arming them with modern nuclear weapons, the matter would have been resolved by now.
The solution is not separate states. The solution is to be found in clipping the wings of the Zionists and paving the way for the people of the area; Jews and Arabs in establishing a secular state.
Posted by maracas, Tuesday, 10 June 2008 12:14:10 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. Page 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. ...
  7. 7
  8. 8
  9. 9
  10. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy