Alia24,
Agreed that generalizing can lead to the wrong conclusions.

I previously assumed that there was a social problem with muslim men and their attitude to women. I have now narrowed this down, thanks to a muslim poster here on OLO, to that the problem is the cultural attitude of Arabic muslim men towards women and particularly to women in western dress. This shown by the anti-social conduct of some young gangs and the speeches made by Sheiks Hilali and Feiz Mahommed. Also by the complaints by females such as nurses, teachers, police,receptionists and shop assistants that claim that muslim men are rude, dictatorial and offensive to them.

I also noted an article by Waheed Ally, who was angry that criminals were using his religion in effort to obtain lighter sentences. I also note that Ifran Yusuf writes similar type articles and refers to what he calls "thick sheiks". The only way to combat the adverse effects on muslims in general is to bring to public notice the real culprits of the critisism.

The only question I have in relation to your post is this. If murder of innocents gains instant hell and dammnation for muslims, how do extremists get it so wrong that they believe that after their actions they go to heaven and have X number of virgins to play with.

Oh, I do not care much how one chooses to dress, but I must admitt that I like to see a persons face. Facial expression is a great advantage in communication.

Banjo,
To be honest I have no idea how extremists actually think killing innocent people will get them into heaven. I was quite young at the time of 9/11 and all I could do was ask my father how?. I myself have finished reading the whole Koran and it NEVER says anything about justification for killing innocent people. It is especially mentioned about women and children. The only thing I found was that the Koran asks that you to do is try and tell non believers about Islam.

One reason I have stayed with my religion and felt proud of, was the fact that the two main things are about cleanliness and peace. In the Koran it always says to be tolerant of all others. Nothing about war or violence. Peace is a huge thing. And I almost fell down laughing when I found out what the word "jihad" actually means, because I was shocked that it could mean holy war. The word itself means "struggle" as in I could say 'My day at work today was a jihad'. Simple as that. I have found myself wanting to ask these extremists where in the world to they actually get their information from because it almost seems like a different religion.

I agree that facial expression is a great advantage in communication, but I don't see why someone should change their way of dress because of me. Oh and the actual facial cover of a veil is fully optional, the Koran does want women to cover their hair, but if someone covers their face, it is choice, in case anyone was wondering.

Alia24,
Thank you for your reply, I do appreciate it.

I will try not to generalize too much and get as much information as I can before commenting on a matter.

Peronally, I have no problem with others wearing the burka if that's their very own choice.
I am all for freedom of religion and the right to express that religion. Freedom is about being able to do whatever you please as long as it fits within the law.

Having said that, I do not like to see women being oppressed and restricted for whatever reasons- religious or other.

If I could be certain that this is what women really want to do merely to please themselves, then I would have no problem with the burka; others would simply have the choice to get used to it or not.
However, they should be required, like everyone else, to uncover the face when identification is needed. (Drivers license please!)

However, there are certain occupations in where wearing the burka would be impractical or impossible. Therefore, a burka would limit a woman’s choice of occupation.
For example, the burka is not recommendable for women working at preschools or kindergartens because young children are still at the stage where they learn about and rely on human facial expressions and body language as an integral part of learning a language.
I don’t see how fully covered-up drama teachers or dance instructors can be successful either.
Jobs in where uniforms are required are out too (police uniform etc).
The face veil stops women from achieving their full potential and is restrictive (e.g. all sports and quite a few occupations).

Alia, thanks for explaining that it is an not an obligation of Islam that women cover up their faces.
I've always believed that the face veil is more about oppression and subjugation of women by fundamentalist Muslim men than it is about religious obligation or women's own choice.

Philo- have you noticed anything? We finally agree on some points :)

Alia 24
I doubt people are judging you personally or Islam in itself but rather commenting on the Muslims who perpetrate social unrest, attempt to impose repressive and oppressive bits of Sharia, demand cultural inclusion in law and expect the host nation to change to accommodate them. The veil question wasn't about covering ones hair we all do that at one time or another. It was about those Islamist who wanted to go to work with the public like teach class or get a drivers licence, drive a car, be a receptionist, a nurse, etc., wearing the burka. It's the ones who demand the right to public prayer in airplanes while in flight. The ones who demand that a school must provide a prayer room, or Muslim workers who demand a prayer room in the work place. It's the radicals, the extremist who harm Islam. Not to mention the death and destruction that they bring upon themselves and their fellow Muslims.
Ever hear of David Koresh. He was a Christian cult extremist in Texas or New Mexico, USA. You will know you've really gone wrong when you get the response to extremism he and his cult got. It's the Islamic cult of the mahdi and many many Islamic terrorist cadres like al-Qaeda that forment this world wide suspicion, distrust and anger. It would really help if Muslims such as yourself spoke out against this activity and false belief of Islam and let the citizens know you support them and their society, will fight to preserve democracy, and respect the customs and values of your new Nation. Demonstrate that and you will find a renewed welcome and a warm embrase. Peace and blessings.