gracealOne first of all I suggest you consult the Oxford dictionary for the definition of cult. Infact I suggest you simply look up the definition of cult on any reputable online dictionary.

As for 4% of the world being Atheist, I would like to know where you got that figure. May I remind you in some Muslim countries it is an offence for persons born into Islam to be atheist, or to convert to other religions and so those who do not hold Islamic beliefs, keep it to themselves. I have also met a multitude of Christians who will not admit others are Atheist.

As for evidence that Jesus existed there is no real evidence. As a product of myth Jesus remains elusive and vague.

I did not say I was Atheist but you attacked the poor Atheists anyway. This is bigotry against Atheists. This is exactly what I said in my earlier post. “As far as the values of Christianity. Christians (and according to the bible Christ) believe non-believers are not saved (on their terms) , this is exclusionary. Although many Christians deny it this affects how they judge and treat other people. The article is a good example of this. Somehow Christian ideology is more important than anybody else’s views (this is bigoted) and children should be instructed to the beliefs of the religion even though many if not most are not Christian.”

Again it is a form of ethnic cleansing to force a dominant religion on children. Even if you were right and a majority of people in Australia were Christian (where is your evidence?) it is still not right for Australian children to be subjected to Christian values in school. It protects children of Christian parents too because sooner or later another ideology will become dominant. What is important is that children are brought up to live in the real world and not a fantasy world based on myth.

It appears that I was wrong. Let us then go with your opinion and abolish those values which are attributed to Christianity. Let's start with getting rid of love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Maybe we could throw in a few more for good measure like acceptance, forgiveness, grace and justice.

Of course there is no evidence that Jesus existed - the history books are all wrong and thousands of people like myself have just had experiences that were pure imagination. And history must all be rewritten to prove that Jesus did not exist, nor did the Holocaust or the planes flying into the World Trade Centre.

As far as statistics are concerned, sites like www.adherents.com who provide statistics for the likes of Encyclopedia Brittanica are disbelievable also. And everybody knows that cults are all mainstream!

I realise that I am wasting my time on this thread, so goodbye and have fun proving me wrong, but please provide references in case you mislead anyone else.

Sorry gracealOne I feel I have to respond because of the dubious sources you are getting your information from. www.adherents.com is a Christian propaganda site and has no validity. It draws conclusions based on the inherent bigotry which believers hold. The purpose of that site is to reinforce beliefs not to inform.

History books based on reality do not support the existence of Jesus. There is no witness of Jesus by public records of the Roman or Judean governments or the neighbours of Judea at the time Jesus was supposed to have existed. Pilate presented no mention of Jesus in his reports to Rome. No contemporaries mentioned Jesus in stories, journals, inventories or letters. There are no artefacts of Jesus. The tale of Jesus by some great coincidence is the story of the Roman military deity of Chrisos. There is however a large industry of inventing history by Christian writers. Perhaps you are confused with religious publications as you confused www.adherents.com with a valid site.

As for those values you attribute to Christianity. Such values are empty words as an attempt to justify beliefs; they are not the core beliefs of Christianity. Such values are no more than product commercials such as work free stain removal. They are values of any caring person. However if we review the history of Christianity, the wars, the social divisions, persecution ,witch hunting, the ethnic cleansing of European pagans, the Americas , Africa , Australia and the Pacific. The integrity of most of the churches, the integrity of Christian based political parties, the actions of Christian politicians, the manipulation of history and information, even the exclusionism taught by Jesus in the Bible. None of the values you claim are present in Christianity. Of course individuals may hold those values you claim, but I argue they may hold those values in spite of Christian beliefs not because of them. When Christian values are taught what is taught is authoritarianism, exclusionism and paternalism.

Even so, even if there was one non-Christian child it would still be ethnic cleansing to push Christian values onto that child.

Well said West.

I find it very refreshing that we live in a country and society where we can ALL place our opinions in the public forum. Whether this freedom was made possible by Christianity or Democracy or past leaders viewing religious control with a jaundiced eye and moving outside the control of the priests is irrelevant.

We must all make sure that no one group gets in control as happens in other less enlightened or well educated countries/societies.

Teaching our children life skills is everyone's job by example. The best way to do this is by public comunity service. Unfortunately our Government is making life very difficult for community service groups to function. Try being a Scout leader, chairman of the local church committee or other volunteer organization and see what onerous, legally binding responsibilities are placed on you.

One other excellent way to get children to develop morals, codes of ethics, tollerance and to appreciate this wonderful country is to show them what other places are like as discussed earlier in the comments.

Keep up the discussion

After putting up with Anglican school children and Catholic school Children fighting and abusing each other on public transport this afternoon I cant agree with you at all Guy V.

The reality is superstitious cults will divide into sects and competition to speak and think for gods and spirits in order to control a group creates tribalism.

Each group choses what it decides is an order of community which it deams below them a group to persecute. This is always justified by occult literature such as the bible.

This is the reason why the religious community are the most disrespectful people. Like one antagonist threatened to a member of of an opposing sect 'I am saved you will go to hell , who cares about you?'and I am certain he will sleep soundly self justified by the dogma of his superstition. The worst thing that disgusts me is now we have children fighting for their religions political agenda.