@Perseus:

I completely approve of our government's decision to take a hardline attitude with the Australians. I had every reason to respect Australians, but if Perseus is a measure of regular Aussies, then these people are moronic scums with hilariously overinflated sense of self-importance, whose illogical anti-Indonesian hatred makes them a problem that need to be fixed sooner rather than later.

It is good that Indonesia are now dictating the internal affairs of Australia as acknowledged by Amanda Vanstone. Indonesia was too nice with these loonie Aussies, to the extent they took our kindness as weakness. Now, under SBY, Indonesia knows that these brainless pot-smoking Aussies need to be spanked hard regularly to keep them from misbehaving. By treating Australia with contempt, we show this weakling "country" their place at the bottom of regional food chain, far below Indonesia.

@Daeron:

LOL, I know a Dutch person who lived in West Papuan Catholic dormitory during Dutch colonial period, turned out the boys need to arm themselves every night because at dark, the native Papuans loved to break into the dorm to rape the white girl students. Only after some of the boys killed several of the Papuan intruders, do these nightly rape raids cease.

Indeed an independent West Papua under the rule of barbaric separatists would be a terrible bloody mess, much worse than failed states PNG or East Timor. Even today, the barbaric separatists hiding in PNG spend their days killing enemies from different clans or fighting PNG authorities. Only Indonesian subsidies and supervision from the transmigrants that now made-up 50% of the population help native Papuans advanced from their barbarian state of origin to relatively developed stage today. The only road barbaric separatism would lead is back to Stone Age barbarism where villages launch headhunthing wars to solve dispute over a hog.

Proud to be Indonesian, your posts are like speed bumps. Maybe that's no bad thing.

You have very strong opinions, like a shock-jock (did you ever think of applying - it's a noble calling in this country). I suffer from the need to be a contrarian - put it down to ego.

A few months ago, many of us revealed details of ourselves so that we might get to know and understand each other better. It was a most satisfying exercise - theraputic not only for ourselves, but also for Online Opinion. As you might expect, we discovered that despite our extreme points of view, we had much in common.

That made me think, what is a typical Australian?

If you are Indonesian as you say, what are the circumstances that shaped you? Please allow us to know you better.

This is me:

58 years old.
3 marriages.
3 natural children.
2 stepchildren.
5 grandchildren.

Born C of E, but an aetheist.
A boat person from the UK in childhood.
Experience in electronics and mining.
Now retired to care for disabled wife.

Somewhere in all that is the secret to understanding me.

Your turn. Go ahead please.

It must be the easiest thing in the world to emphasise the difference between people, when those people are separated by culture and language.

Read this well and go figure:

http://www.focusongroup4securicor.org/

Note that we are not so different after all.

This is a hard one for me...usually I go for any option that pokes the Javanese Imperialist Entity (Indonesia) in the face - the more misfortune Indonesia suffers the better I feel. It's called Schadenfreude. So therefore I might be expected to support Papuan independence. In theory I would like the Christian/Animist Papuans to be free of domination by brutish Javanese overlords - it is the same sort of colonial enterprise as the English dominating and enslaving the neighbouring island of Ireland for all those centuries. Just because Papua is near Indonesia doesn't make it fair game for expansionists, any more than England had a right to help itself to Ireland.

However, having said all this, I am concerned that an independent Papua will end up Australia's financial burden, like PNG or Timor or even Indonesia whenever the latest calamity has them thrusting out the begging bowl. Looking at the hopeless state of Timor and PNG I actually favour Indonesia keeping Papua as a perpetual running sore and money pit. So I feel an inner glow when I see Indonesia spending loads of cash trying to keep Aceh and Papua within their glorious unitary state. Anything that is bad for Indonesia is good for me. Ha ha!

I still can't understand that many Australians see West Papua as our propery by birthright.

What is our obligation to West Papua? Australia is a member of ASEAN. That does not give us a unilateral responsibility over land that is not sovereign to Australia.

We are signatories to the UN legal system. We were in breach of the UN laws the minute we invaded Iraq. Australia is signatory to international law that forbids all signatories to invade countries that pose no threat to Australia.

What is our historical involvement? We were at war with the Japanese in WWII, and the "fuzzy wuzzies" helped the Aussie diggers on the Kakoda Track.There is comradery with the Aussie diggers. The UN, however, agrees that the obligation to protect West Papua in incumbent on Indonesia.

I don't think all West Papuans are that barbaric at all. I think that if Australia protected some refugees without any fuss, without drawing attention to the problem, Indonesia would not be so offended.

We have as much responsibility over Indonesian West Papua as Spain, Portugal, Holland, Germany, and maybe the US and the UK, but no more than any of these. We really ought to sought our problems with the UN, for breaching UN conventions in an illegal and illegitimate war against Iraq, a country that posed no threat to Australia other than buying our grain. Australia was stupid enough to offer "kick backs", or bribes in trade, while illegally invading their country.

This sleaze lowered our credibility with a huge section of the world. It is no longer fashionable to be Australian internationally, and we can no longer be respected as an innocent member of the UN. If Australia called the world to action over this as a problem, we will be the laughing stock of the world. Not only is Australia seen as insignificant, it is now seen as devious and suspicious in motive. If you voted for John Howard, get used to it. He took away our thunder.

I like saints comment that " Australia (should have) protected some refugees without any fuss, without drawing attention to the problem, Indonesia would not be so offended”.I can just imagine that happening. Our press & the various political parties would have had a field day exposing it all.

And the incredible naive statement "Australia was stupid enough to offer 'kick backs', or bribes in trade...This sleaze lowered our credibility with a huge section of the world. It is no longer fashionable to be Australian internationally, and we can no longer be respected as an innocent member of the UN" Shows a very limited knowledge of the world -a lot of world business in involves bribes etc and more than half of the UN membership consists of corrupt regimes

On the surface making it easier for West Iran to flee seems compassionate.
But ultimately helps Indonesia’s policy of swamping the West Irian population & culture.
Perhaps we should consider scrapping our programs of training for the Indonesian military & offer to train & arm the West Irian separatists instead.