It could be the lack of history education today that has contributed to this cruel rejection of fellow human beings. Most have forgotten the treatment and massacres of young Australian men in two wars so still continue to believe that Iraq is what a war is.

It was after those wars that the world banded together to prevent what happened to the Jews in the holocaust ever happening again. In 1938 22 white nations got together to discuss the Jewish refugee "problem" and voted to send them back to Germany and then stood by while 6 million people were slaughtered.

After the war the guilt was overwhelming so they wrote the refugee convention to prevent such an occurence happening again. Until very recently Australia has accepted over 650,000 refugees without ever forcing them back.

Why on earth would anyone want to send people back to the hell of Rwanda as we did a 15 year old boy whose whole family had been massacred in the genocide of 1994, after locking him up until he was 18? Beggars belief but we did it.

How about 13 and 14 year old Afghan boys who saw their older brothers sent to clear the mines with their bodies? We sent home 32 such boys, almost all of them orphans. Why? Couldn't we have found it in our hearts to help those boys?

What about the christians sent back to the mad mullahs in Iran who disappeared from the face of the earth, or those that were tortured? We have never done this before Howard so we need to put this into an historical context and understand that one day we will need help and it will not be around.

Your right Marilyn, one day we will need help given the way things are going in Australia as standards have dropped dramatically in the public arena and morals and obligations are not longer highly regarded and society is becoming more aggressive and violent. Crime, terrorism and corruption is on the rise and turning a blind eye and political correctness is the trend. WE are going backwards.

Problem is that when the inevitable happens and things spin out of control as they have in many Countries before us, Australia wont be able to handle the problem and we wont be able to get outside help as they are all having similar problems and issues and we wont have numbers large enough in Australia who really believe themselves to be Australian and that will fight for Australians to be able to save what Australia once had. Our freedoms are already being eroded.

It’s not the history lessons in schools that are a problem. All People are capable of good and bad and that will never change. We need to learn from the past but live in the present and look towards the future, times have changed and for many Australians there are ‘warning bells ringing’ telling us that we should be seriously concerned as there is a definite pattern emerging. As my son said to me once when he was just six years old “Smart people believe what they see with their own eyes!”.

Sure maybe these refugees etc are finding it tough because they feel left out and vilified and they are reacting but the fact is that we need to take the time to assess the situation as many are not being absorbed well and we need to take the time to settle those that we already have here before deciding whether it is in the best interest of the majority to bring in any more.

Australians are feeling threatened by the situation and they are scared. Do we need to wait until a bomb is dropped on our heads for it to count?

Jolanda conflating refugees to bombs on our heads is counter productive as there simply are not enough refugees in Australia to bother, or want to.

As for waiting for a bomb to fall on our heads - what did the Afghan and Iraqi people do to deserve us dropping bombs on their heads, hundreds of thousands of them.

Did they ask for it do you think? People need to ask themselves just what they are so afraid of, if they really are afraid and if they are simply telling ghost stories.

I remember as a kid in the bush being told I should be terrified of baby eating catholics and was demonised for years because I played with them as friends.

Now I have catholic and muslim friends I just feel richer.

Marilyn, if muslims are in such fear of their lives why do they bypass Islamic countries and pay thousands to reach Western countries?

Okay Marilyn I will tell you what the people that I speak to are afraid of. They are afraid because they believe that extremist Muslims and even some moderate Muslims do not tolerate the Western way at all and they actively try to change things to suit them.

They come from Countries where they have no rights and no freedom of speech and instead of fighting to change things in their own country so that they can have rights, they come here pushing for changes that reflect their own Countries way of thinking and living and they are succeeding. They don’t seem to really want to change, they seem to just want to make things so it is suitable and appropriate for them. I believe that the majority of those that come here are Economic refugees. They don’t seem to care whether the Australian people are in agreement or not and they don’t seem to realise that if they bring the same attitudes with them and use the Law to push their rights above others then it will cause hostility and resentment and violence and that causes fear and wars.

The attitude of some, including the belief that stealing and rape and things like that is “not really” crime or its not serious crime like say ‘mass murderers” reflects the environment that they have been brought up in. That is the problem with people that come from Countries that have been at war and have experienced a lot of violence, their standards drop and they have a different idea as to what really constitutes crime.

Whether it is the fault of those that caused these people to become refugees or immigrants is irrelevant, the fact is that the consequences are felt by Australians and by many people across the globe and issues are occuring across the globe.

Blaming Australians for bombs being dropped on the heads of Afgan and Iraqi people is counter-productive Marilyn as the majority of Australians are at home they are not dropping bombs on anybody’s head.

Dear Marilyn
actually I don't have such a big problem with your suggestion of changing the mix as u said.

What I DO have concerns with, (not so much what u said) is the issue of compatability. We must must MUST have the final say on who comes, and their background, language, culture and religion all have to figure in that assessment.

Oh..definition time. "We" would be the predominant ethno/cultural status quo in Australia which at last count is approx 69% Anglo/Northern Euro, with the UK contingent by far the largest of that.

So, another point you raised. Lack of history teaching u say is the reason we are so unsympathetic to those wanting to come here.
I suggest the reverse is true.. because we DO know how ethnic groups behave when they become strong. Just look at the USA right NOW ! its happening before our eyes.. don't u see it ? Floods and waves and numberless masses of Mexicans .. who see themselves as 'workers today voters tomorrow'. Do you not notice the Bush camp being worried about annoying 'The Hispanic Vote' ? do you not see the Democrats DROOLING at the thought of 12 million extra 'democrat' voters if the illegals are allowed to remain ?

This hispanic invasion of the USA could ultimately sneak over here and bite both you and I in the bum. Simply by changing the world power balance in ways which expose us to danger.

So, everything u said was pretty ok except the last line which was very much 'preaching' :) now I NEVER do that do I ? 0_-

I will never accept the idea that we should accept people from far off places irrespective of their degree of compatability with our existing situation, culture and political/social stability.

My approach would be to assess them all off shore and then direct them to a 'most compatable' country. (which may include ours)