"And what does the church have to do with Christ anyhow, it is a body of sinners, imperfect in every way."

Umm Fide, you forget that your Jesus built his rock of a church on the Catholics, like it or not, they "are" the original xtian church.

"The OT is essentially a story of how bad the Israelites were at coming to terms with God, not directly about God's veiws."

The OT is about a violent, unreasonable, irrational god. Now if its not gods word, then its just human opinions, so its not worth the paper its written on, so why include it in a holy book?

"Get over yourself and tell me why I would ever consider taking your opinion over that of a billion and more people?"

There are about 1.2 billion muslims. Do you consider their word?
IMHO religion is the biggest con that ever existed, for very good reasons related to how the human mind evolved. It makes people fear, gives them hope, lets them deal with their own mortality, kids them that the worms won't really eat them after all, that does not mean its true. Religion balances your brain chemistry, so what is true does not really matter. What matters is that it makes you feel better. Fair enough.

" I pray to God that your children won't be brought up in the education system that has obviously failed you!"

Well you had better blame that on the nuns and then on the Baptists!
They both tried to brainwash me, but later in life I learned the power of reason.

Yabby, "the OT is about a violent..."
try reading "Genesis; the story we haven't heard" by paul borgman (2001), might change your small mind.

I think you will find St. Peter was a Jewish Christian, hardly catholic, although they do claim him as one (only someone as gullible as you would accept this at face value though). What is your reason for suggesting he was catholic, just the sayings of catholics years later?

But I am willing to play at your game and on your terms (reason alone), where did the energy for the big bang come from? Or do you just accept the sayings of scientists in a similar faith-like (although idolotrous) way to a Christian's faith in Christ? did nothingness just suddenly have a whole lot of energy for no reason? How could scientists ever find this out, as the energy must have been given before there was time or a universe, which followed the explosion of the energy? Can you even understand what I am saying, or will you just fob me off? What do you actually believe in, or do you just follow the trends?

"try reading "Genesis; the story we haven't heard" by paul borgman"

Perhaps Fide, its just easier to read the bible itself, to see how violent it is.

"I think you will find St. Peter was a Jewish Christian, hardly catholic" Well there ya go Fide, a billion Catholics claim he was their first pope. I told you not to trust the masses :)

"where did the energy for the
big bang come from?"

Where did God come from? If you can get your mind around the fact that he was always here, you can get your mind around the fact that perhaps energy always existed, that there have been a number of big bangs.

What I know is that there is a 95% certainty that you are a Xtian, as you were born in a Xtian country. Had you been born in Iraq, most likely you would be a Muslim, in India and you would be a Hindu.

What I believe is that I am agnostic. As there is no substantiated evidence to prove anything, no 10 commandments written on the moon for all to see, just human claims, I am wise enough to withhold judgement and spend time understanding those things which we do have imformation on and can understand, not run off and make rash claims.

I also know that throughout the history of humanity, people have worshipped whatever gods to reduce anxiety and feel better, hundreds of gods, many so called holy books. I am just not that gullible.

Coach,

Your points with comments:

Point 1:
We believe in all Holy books (I studied the VanDyk Arabic bible through the Bible society). The only ‘out of norm’ teachings as you claim is the Trinity.

Point 2:
In Islam all prophets are equal, that what the Quran teaches (Part II).

Point 3:

The commandments are mentioned across II & III. The Quran confirms the believe in one God, prophets & messengers, honour your parents, and confirms whats in the Torah and the Bible.

Point 4:

Not sure what you mean but in line, why the Quran and the Torah have an additional miracle of Jesus PBUH that isn’t in the Bible? (talking when he was a new born). The Quran have only one version that was written during the life of the prophet. Prophets stories in the Quran are moral and some are comprehensive, I tend to disregard any discrepancies with the Quran (like striking the first born in Egypt for example)

Point 5 & 6:

Muslims respect other religions and their respective Holy places. Churches (& synagogues) in Egypt, Iraq, Syria and many other majority Muslims countries are well looked after and have been for centuries. That’s our teachings.

Peace,

Yabby. "Where did God come from? If you can get your mind around the fact that he was always here, you can get your mind around the fact that perhaps energy always existed, that there have been a number of big bangs".

Oh sorry, I thought you believed in reasoned understanding of the world, not just blind faith, and imaginings. For your information, philosophers of science reject your answer.

The reason I suggested the book by borgmann was that presumably you neither read hebrew, nor have the time to learn how. Perhaps you could at least look into all that is lost in translation. A studied look at the old testament would be able to give you a similar understanding, if you were willing to read three or four translations, comparing each line.

Given that you clearly are not interested in addressing other peoples veiws, but simply wish to state your own, I think there is little to be gained from further discussion. I think it would be wise, however, to come to terms with the fact that all science is just as based on faith as is religion. just asking the believer to believe in different things. too see this tell me why the sun will 'come up' tomorrow, (this is a standard philosophy of science eg, not some crackpot intelligent design thing), is it because it always has before? thats not very reasonable. Is it because of the laws of gravity, velocity etc? then why should we assume these 'laws' will be valid tomorrow? If you read into philosophy of science (as you may be more inclined to do than my religious suggestion), you will find that there is no certain knowledge, all knowledge is based on faith in assumptions.

I would appreciate it if you would not slander religious thinkers for their faith, given you don't even recognise that your beliefs are based on just as much faith.

"I would appreciate it if you would not slander religious thinkers for their faith, given you don't even recognise that your beliefs are based on just as much faith. "

Actually thats not so. As an agnostic, I am the only one taking an honest position, saying " I know that I don't know" . Wheras you claim to know, big difference!

Now reading all sorts of things into some obscure holy books, which are full of mistakes, then claiming that anyone should take any notice, is plainly ridiculous! Have faith all you want, satisfy your emotional needs, your fear of death or anything else that religion gives you, but don't expect the rest of us to take you seriously or to live by the rules of that religion.