Bravo Con! Encore!

You are spot on or at least very close to this very complex problem. You nailed it man.

This is not an Australian problem but a global dilemma. Islam cannot and will not try to integrate full stop. Muslims may adapt, they may even look as if they are adjusting to their host country ways; but to those who can see and hear: not!

I have been trying to say this for some time but it mostly fell on the deaf n' blind; or worse those with a socio-political interest who need to maintain the status quo and use time to their advantage.

Australia is in the main polarised into three sectors

1. Secular - The majority: atheist, agnostic, non-believers, non-religious, or at best nominal-non-practicing labels; who want nothing to do with “religious stuff” don’t understand what the fuss is about, and don’t want to know. “Live and let live” is their preferred mantra.
2. The Religious - Most Denominational Churches, Buddhist, Hindi, all the cults, new age, satanic, etc…who strongly believe and practice their religion – would love more people to be “enlightened” and join them but wont impose their views at least not publicly…
3. The smallest but most visible and noisy group is the Islamic lobby with its not-so-hidden agenda of globalising the world.

I deliberately left out the Christians – because we are the minority (not numerically) and the most misunderstood bunch. As Disciples of Christ we are his true church and the only hope for humanity. (I can almost hear the uproar) – But folks this is the truth. No amount of debate will change that fact.

Like The Skeptic, I’m fairly big on proof. For starters, I would like to know on what statistics Mike Steketee and others base their “99.9%” claim. As far as I know, George Negus kicked that one off, but nothing can be found in his book to prove the claim.

It’s unlikely that we could find hard evidence. Muslims are hardly going to answer ‘yes’ to a pollster who asks if they support terrorism or not. We have to acknowledge that there is no evidence to back up a wild claim that is used by just about everybody on every subject to get other people to believe them. Expecting statistical ‘proof’ on this matter is unrealistic. We have to rely on anecdotes and that which is before our eyes and ears. Reports from UK media after the London bombing indicated a worrying number of British-born Muslims certainly do support terrorism, for instance.

Con G-K gives us the opportunity ask ourselves just how far credibility can be stretched. The 99.9% claim beggars belief and is an insult to our intelligence.

Only Muslims can set the record straight. US radio commentator, Dennis Prager posed the following questions to Muslims:

1. Why are you so quiet? (1 billion of you in the world)
2. Why are none of the Palestinian terrorists Christian? (If Israeli occupation is the reason for terror)
3. Why are so many atrocities committed and threatened by Muslims in the name of Islam?
4. Why do countries governed by religious Muslims persecute other religions?

Instead of confronting the problems of Islam, he claims, they are “defending” it by telling him that he has no right to be talking about Islamic terrorists, and they call anyone who does so “anti-Muslim”. Sound familiar?

And, multiculturalism, not just in the context of Muslim Australians, is a joke. We have hyphenated-Australians, or just the country of origin of forebears used in many cases by people born here. Some of us are only plain “Australian” when it comes to criminal acts committed overseas, when sympathy is sought

I don't really think multiculturalism is something we can choose to label a failure and discard. It is certainly not "created by legislation". The reality is we are a country made up of many different cultures, a great deal of them immigrated at one point or another. The multiculturalist policies of government are an attempt to adopt the best ways to ensure these cultures can coexist. Saying that that approach is doomed to failure is extremely pessimistic.

As for whether Aussie Muslims need to "liberate themselves from the rigid parts of their religion", no they don't really, all they have to do is abide by the laws of this country that they live in. Other than that they have the absolute right to free exercise of their religion.

Leigh,

Will have a go at your 4 questions:

1. Why are you so quiet? (1 billion of you in the world)
Says who? Why Imam Faisal AbdelRauf (one of the few moderates author of ‘what is right with Islam’ with Karen Armstrong) was interviewed only once on US television but other nutbag imams are daily on the news? It is the media ‘ sick puppy' syndrome.
Simple, get your commentator to pick 5 moderate imams and give them enough airtime and see who much fanaticism will die. Oops sorry their is no $$ for the media in my suggestion, bad news sells.

2. Why are none of the Palestinian terrorists Christian? (If Israeli occupation is the reason for terror)
A political/land conflict motivated by religion. The proof is simple because:
- Why Palestinians Muslims & Christians lived with the Jewish minority peacefully for the last few centuries?If religion was the issue, why did it only come out now?
- Why there is only Catholics in the IRA?

3. Why are so many atrocities committed and threatened by Muslims in the name of Islam?
Again that’s mainly media focus, if it was about religion, why the majority of Terrorism victims are Muslims? (Before sep11, and currently in Iraq). 60 years ago more than 6 million Jews lost their lives on the hands of claimed Xtians.

4. This is the half empty/half full debate: Why not focus on the majority of moderate Muslim states that look after their minorities and encourage the others to do the same? As far as I know Saudi Arabia is the only government that does not accept practice of other faith but what are the chances of approving a mosque in the Vatican? Who cares anyway lets just be positive and improve the minorities conditions wherever they are.

Peace and good weekend,

Fellow_Human,

There is a time in any dispute when the loser admits defeat and honourably shakes hands and withdraws.

You were asked by Leigh 4 definite questions to which you did not give straight answers.
I asked you 5 questions the other day - you did the same.

Smoke screening won’t hide you anymore. The rabbit is out of the bag. Why don’t you go and look for 5 moderate imams and if you do find them come back and we will collectively pay for their appearance in the media.

Fellow Human,

Like me, you are an anonymous poster with opinions. The only people who can and should speak for the Islamic faith and Islamic organisations in Australia are clearly identifiable public figures, properly qualified, and with authorisation to speak on behalf of the religion. This is the case with any organisation. But I am always interested in your opinions.

You could, if you would please, answer me one general question though. Why do you think that Muslims in Australia refer to themselves as Muslim Australians rather than, say, Egyptian Australians which I believe you are? No other groups in Austalian refer to themselves by religion: they are Vietnamese Australians, Anglo Australians, Italian Australians etc. The author of the this article describes himself as an Australian of Greek background. I'm a bit of a mongrel with English, Scottish and German heritage. I would think that the very last thing that Australians are interested in, irrespective of racial or national origins, is another person's religion.

We are all Australians, but if the average person decides to be nosy about a person's background, they ask, 'Where do you come from?', not 'What's your religion?'.

A minor point, perhaps, but one that I believe encourages people to think Muslims are overoccupied with their religion to the detriment of all else.

Donnie,

An official policy of multiculturalism was forced on us by legislation and without reference to the population. Yes, we have always been a multiracial society, but that is different from from a government enforced multicultural society which emphises difference rather than similarity.