Alchemist, (and Leigh)

Your comment is impressive in that it summarises the issue of practice.

Islam’s teachings are really the commandments, good values, love one another, be good and charitable, etc...

The reason why you see extremes from personal experience with Islam and Muslims, is that it is practiced in one of the following ways:

- Contextual, spiritual: Those who practice it but think always thinking of new modern interpretations and intent. They know that Islam is about love, peace, help one another. They know that Jihad means to control your urges, to master your anger, to sponsor an orphan, to look after your parents and to help your next door neighbour. (Majority of Muslims).

- Contextual and literal: this are the religious Orthodox people who won’t step an ant because the Quran refers to them as nations, they will smile to everyone and sell their watches to feed the poor (Mystics, Minority).

- Literal with no substance: Those who follow a set of ‘looks’ with neither understanding nor intent to practice the religion. An example of this hypocrisy is when you see a woman with a headscarf but wearing a see through white jeans on a G string. (Considerable chunk)

- Muslim parasites’: these are perverts, criminals, murderers who like to wear Islam as their bullet proof vest. The spectrum starts from those with expertise on being on the doll, evade taxes, fraud insurance and goes all the way to wife beaters and MSK the gang rapist (who actually never prayed and used to mock Islam and Muslims).

The two points you missed:
- It is in Muslims best interest to get rid of the parasites group.
- Most comments from Keisar Trad and others are usually their own personal views. They just like the political portray of ‘we’. Don’t be fooled.

"If not why don't they go to a muslim country that will give them the freedom they want."
the alchemist- that has to be the most uneducated reflection i have ever heard. The reason that Muslim women expect to be able to freely display their relgious affiliation in public is because Australia is a mulitcultural society and because our constitution clearly indicates that freedom of religion is an important Austrlian value. This is why they do not go to a 'muslim county' (islamic country would have been the correct term as the word 'muslim' refers to the people themselves who practice islam, a clear refelction of your understanding of the relgion) is because Australia openly advertises every single Australian's right to practice the religion they choose and to wear what they wish.

Maximus, sorry about including your name in my last post on this thread. You and I have some differences, but I should not have described you in those terms in regard to this matter. And yes, I had been imbibing.

The forum that I was referring to is not ficticious, but has been around in one form or another since around 1996, its address is:

http://63.99.108.76/forums/index.php

It is known as Tankers Forum, but don't let the name put you off.

Alchemist,
For once you have not raised your sword. I must congratulate you an a very thoughtful post. Not your usual aggressive anti-religion style. However it asks the relavent questions.

unlabeled, it is not really true that "every single Australian's right to practice the religion they choose and to wear what they wish".

We do place restrictions on peoples choice of attire. Schools place restrictions on what kids wear to school (the purple mullet mentioned in someones post) would get you sent home from many australian schools. I suspect that the kind of message based tee shirts favored by some teenage christians would not be allowed in most schools.

Adults sunbathing or swimming nude at secluded beaches risk arrest and large fines if someone makes a complaint (let alone in genuinely public places).

Personally I don't think religious symbols should get better treatment than other forms of personal preference.

We all have to live within limits imposed by society. The issue for society is "are those limits reasonable?".

R0bert

In any country that claims to be democratic (and in totalitarian governments as far as that goes) government needs to keep it's nose out of religion with the exception of those that might practice human sacrifice or torture or those that practice forced membership and threats of violence against members that might want to end their membership. Presently, the pressure by political entities to accept pluralism and ethical relativism should be considered a crime against the people. No one should be allowed to assume the right to tell or demand that someone else is to believe something. Persuasion by reasoned argument (evangelism) is fine but force or coersion is absolutely wrong.