No one is denying that the 9/11 attacks were not horrific. What this thread is attempting to deal with (IMO) is the use of torture to obtain information. My opinion is that torture cannot be condoned EVER. The USA for a lot of years was seen as a country with high morals, and always was seen as doing the right thing. Now that is not so evident. Prison scandals in Iraq and G Bay are clear indicators of the fall from those morals, all in the name of "fighting terrorism". Just because you lock someone up, how do you really know that that person is guilty? Torturing someone may get you what you want, but any admission made under duress of torture surely cannot be taken as "gospel".

It's obvious you are an American (most likely republican) by your name and commentary and name-calling against other posters here. Unfortunately that seems to be the American way these days, as if you don't agree with the Bush admin policies, then you are called anti- American, scum etc. I know, cos I am an Aussie living in the "land of the free"...my advice to you "Al", is to be a little less nasty in your commentgs. You'll get a lot more respect if you tone it down and actually address the thread subject. Cheers!

Thank you for your thought provoking article Matthew.

I used to think that "an eye for an eye" was the way to go. Not so these days.

After I was gang raped in 1993, my male friends and male family members were intent on murdering or torturing - or both re the perpetrators.

I am glad that they did not do either.

People who commit horrendous crimes do not deserve physical/mental torture strategies - as in bashing etc. Rather, they deserve physical and mental isolation from all other people - that should be their real torture for the remainder of their lives. They should have to live alone without any human contact.

I don't think that the state should ever authorise the use of torture for the same reason I don't think they should ever authorise euthanasia. Where does it stop? The second you legalise it, the goal posts have moved and the argument continues to go a step further. In the end you're being tortured to reveal why you haven't put your tax returns in, or being euthanised for a persistant cough.

Similarly if a situation arose (and you would think it would be extremely unlikely) that the torture of a person is necessary for the protection of life, then I wouldn't be marching in protest. Doctors have been euthanising people forever, and that's fine as long as the person being terminated has asked for it. It's when the government gets involved that the whole situation becomes very scary.

Anyone who says that they wouldn't want the person who kidnapped their child tortured to reveal the location of that child is either Jesus Christ Himself, an idiot, or a liar.

Once again i am surounded by libratarians,go and ask what the Australian public think about your comments,OH BUT-WAIT YOU MAY HAVE TO GET OF YOUR COMMPUTERS AND SEE THE OUTSIDE WORLD,if mass TERIOSISM comes to my counrty and nothing is done about,my God i would hate to be in a liberal pair of shoes,becouse its YOU people that will see a counrty rise up and deal with the threat(even john howard will see to it) so stop posting idiotic liberal comments,becouse when the suspects are cought tortured ,there will be nothing you can do about it,becouse there is Australians that wont stand for it,accept the fact that there are people,that you cant see or hear that will take care of our counrty and protect all ''AUSTRALIANS'',GO BACK TO YOUR WINE AND FINGER FOOD AND GIVE TO ANOTHER ''GREAT CHARITY'' AND LEAVE THIS TO REAL ''AUSSIES'' WHO WOULD DIE FOR THE PROTECTION OF THIS LAND.
Oh and by the way i am ''Aussie'' not a arrogant yank,i cant stand yankee world imperialist domination,the name al bundy comes from a tv show,to make a comment about my name,shows how immmature you are why,becouse you cant accept that torture will happen if a suspect is found in Australia with activities or knowlege,let the blood flow and protect our children from the horror, toture till there numb,toture to they understand that this country is not for sale and we are the greatest nation om earth,why,becouse theres n o way i will give up what my granfather (in a prison camp)was tortured and starved to death,the future of my children to live in a nation with freedom.

I think the fact that your poster name comes from a puerile Amercian sitcom character sums it up much better than your hysterical post. Go figure.

al bundy eh? Would love to follow your argument here, and when you learn to spell I'll try and read your posts.

Torture places us as a species as uncivilised, unevolved. There are humane methods to extract information.

Besides what kind of human being puts their hand up to be the torturer? Imagine the dinner party chit-chat, Oh And what do you do for a living?...... A party stopper that.

We don't need to condone this primitive and pointless behaviour.