On the matter of the rule of law versus anarchy –

A number of individuals seem to be intent on mandatory detention being ended. They are, of course, free to urge their elected representatives to vote accordingly or stand for election themselves to achieve this end.

That our government has the overwhelming support of the Australian public behind its policy of mandatory detention and whilst we continue to live in a democracy, I suggest those who feel the incarceration of illegal entrants is inhumane, harsh, unjust, antisocial, xenophobic or cruel start to understand that their view is not universally supported and thus not automatically right.

Rossco – read my previous posts – your example of the refugee achieved freedom from persecution a long time before he commenced travel to Australia – thus the ‘reasoning’ you present of supposed persecution is no more than an EXCUSE. We have a refugee acceptance program BUT the ones you refer to are just queue jumping and evading due process. They may include criminal or other anti-social and nefarious elements – who knows unless their backgrounds are checked or checkable.

We do treat these people humanely (regardless they do not have freedom of movement to undertake whatever possible criminal or other anti-social or nefarious undertakings some of them might be used to - as I said - when you do not know, you cannot guarantee the quality of character of an illegal entrant)– but they are also able to assist their own circumstances but many prefer to simply make demands for entry and thus – defeat their own efforts by their own incorrigibility.

Bleeding hearts achieve nothing – other than leave a puddled mess for the rest of us to clear up.

Based on the number of posts in the past couple of days - it looks like garra was true to form -

WRONG on all counts -

especially the one where he unilaterally declared this thread finished - I just love it when the self-appointed "almightys" fall.

MIranda and Xena.
You r both looking at 'symptoms' rather than the deeper issues. If you want to be compassionate to 'alleged' refugees, ok, now here are more simple questions.

1/ How MANY will you allow in ? Open slather ? c'mon, no ducking and weaving. ANSWER IT.
2/ How is maintaining control and protection over ones national FAMILY lacking in compassion ?
3/ Do you see any POLITICAL advantage ? (repeated)

The 'evidence' that Miranda saw, I'm sure was true, to a point. I'm also sure that cunning people can easily attempt to take advantage of sympathetic outsiders who they feel will improve the chances of their desired outcome.

To suggest that to protect ones life and liberty and maintain control over those seeking to come here is a)Unchristian and b) heartless c) not compassionate, is an insult of the highest degree to both my faith AND my citizenship.

The need to accurately assess people who attempt to enter our country against our law,-yes, AGAINST OUR LAW (as in, 'until their true status is verified, they are not lawful') is being 'judged by history' how ? err.. How is responsible policy lacking in compassion ?

You think I dont know about being a 2nd class citizen and all those other things u mumbled about Xena ? well newsflash, I have a pretty good idea, having lived under a government in another country which treated me and the people I was serving extremely badly because we were not the right political 'flavor'.

I'd be a bit cross with you if your expressed views were not so 'trite and predictable' as though you have just left some 'newbie socialist' meeting where they pumped you full of the 'party line'.

I'm all FOR a limited time in detention, until status is verfified THEN I'm all for a hefty deposit from their community here to guarantee they dont run. Most who come here have large communities which include relatives, unlike my wife where u can count the number of people who speak her language in australia on your fingers and toes.

I am glad to see BOAZ_David supports limited detention time but I don't understand his proposal for a deposit to be paid by communities after status has been verified "to guarantee they don't run". Once refugee status has been verified and accepted as bona fide, refugees are given a visa and they are then free to go where they want. There is no question of them "running", there is no need so what is the point of the deposit.

Many refugees do get support from others from the same background but there are also very many true-blue Aussies right across Australia who provide assistance to refugees while in detention and after release from detention into the general community because they recognise it is right to help fellow human beings.
Hey, who knows any of us could find a refugee family as next door neighbours, we could have a refugee as a work mate or our kids could be playing with refugee kids at their school. Now that is something to look forward to isn't it.

Miranda is your typical aussie bleeding heart,where emotion rules logic.We cannot afford to be the recepticale for all the world's problems.If people like Miranda have their way,we will become just another "Banana Republic" in the South Pacific.Over population cheapens human endeavour and thus causes poverty, considering also the elements of education and intelligence, we have to be selective in who comes to our country.

Rosso,
by status I actually meant 'security and health' the 'refugee' status can take some time as u know, while there is uncertainty, they may toy with the idea of establishing roots and if rejected ultimately, they may go underground.

I'm also VERY doubtful as to why they have to come to AUSTRALIA through other countries which are culturally more suitable in many cases. (for Muslims) Compared to Malaysia, Australia is just about '3rd world' (been to the KLIA Airport lately ? and been on their fast train ?.. we putt putt shudder rattle out to TULLA in a crappy shuttle bus.. moan)

The fact that they come so far, through other countries and the clear evidence that many of them have close relations here points to the reality being of 'family reunion by stealth'.

No one has told me HOW MANY they feel they would allow ? Nor have they said what they will DO if there is a sudden FLOOD... (I didn't ask that but I'm sure asking it now) don't they think there will be POINT where u have actually do the same thing we are doing NOW ?

If not, then we may as well just go bush and give the country to the first group who decide to come en-masse.

"Suicide amongst pre-pubescent children is almost unheard of. Except in Australian detention centres." Julian Burnside