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The Forum > Article Comments > The religious Right cannot hijack values > Comments

The religious Right cannot hijack values : Comments

By Kevin Rudd, published 18/1/2005

Kevin Rudd argues that the Coalition is not the only party with Christian and family values

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good on you Kevin , keep making your very valid points. Now let's hear and see the rest of the team in ACTION . perhaps they need a motivational weekend retreat away with Tommy Haffey to realise the urgency and size of their task to expose and then defeat the liberals and the nationals .
Posted by kartiya, Sunday, 23 January 2005 12:32:33 PM
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Well this little whinge defines the writer more readily than the Coalition.

Just a few points from the tail end of this excuse for labor failings

“Once again I fear that the Coalition's political strategy is to define moral values as narrowly ......”

It is not the “role” of government to “define” moral values but to reflect them. (Oh may God preserve me from people who take it upon themselves to define my "morals" for me)

“One of the great divides in Australian politics and Christianity is whether or not our responsibility to our fellow human beings is a matter of private, discretionary choice - or whether that is something which requires the collective intervention of society through the state.”

How we each define “our responsibility” is an individual decision which the state should not be imposing upon the individuals it is there to serve. The problem with this whory bit of humbug is - It presumes and requires the “collective social responsibility” to each private individual is equal and devoid of the flexibility (and inequality) which is an inherent component of compassion.

“There are many fine human beings in all our political parties who are great givers of their time and money to those who need help.“

True – and many of them support the coalition

“Labor has a view that if social justice were to rely entirely on individual acts of charity, there can be no guarantee whatsoever that all those in need are provided with humane levels of universal care.”

And when Labor had the chance to implement social justice programs what happened? the infamous Keating “Tax Cuts written into Law” and Hawkes “No Australian Child will live in Poverty in 1990” declaration
- There are never any guarantess of anything particularly when a labor government is "at the helm".

“Those of us who are Christians within the Labor tradition are not about to readily concede the ground to those who chant the mantra of family and moral values “

I think "the ground" in no longer able to be conceded - it is, clearly, already lost.

Have a nice day

Col Rouge
Posted by Col Rouge, Sunday, 23 January 2005 6:18:43 PM
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ozaware - re your post of Jan 21st 1132 - I couldn't agree more. Having read your previour post of Jan 20th 1115 it clearly confirms your assertion that, "This society is comprised of two groups. The decent and the indecent. What we write and how we address those who differ from us defines who we are." Your own diatribe slots you firmly into the indecent camp, (no pun intended), and define the well informed, coherent, tolerant, Grace and DavidJS as decent individuals.

Jo
Posted by JoJo, Monday, 24 January 2005 7:16:07 PM
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Jo Jo, I have deliberately not previously participated in these "Tower of Babel" (mindless babble) blogs or posts or whatever one calls them.

Thank you (and DavidJS and grace) for reminding me why. Now that I remember, I'll return to my old ways (no doubt with some vigorous epithetting aimed at my departing back....)
Posted by ozaware, Monday, 24 January 2005 10:45:26 PM
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Well Said Jimmy !!!

Grace.... I think you need some counselling. You say 'God has no place" in our parliment or our Constitution ???? but guess what.. God IS there.. and now that your political position is clear "Left" I find it a duty to take you to task on a number of powerful issues.
Before I do that, I have just as much problem with the extremes of 'right' wing politics.

God being in our parliment and constitution is a reflection of our history.. the phrase 'get over it' comes to mind. Now.. this being a democracy, ur welcome to try to change that. But here are the consequences.

1/ It presumes a post modern, atheistic, existential moral relativism as the foundation for our national fabric.
Do I really NEED to quote you the logical ramifications of that from Neitzche ???? read up on 'Nihilsm'. Am I right in assuming you have some kind of 'sentimental disney version of morality' ??? or.."make it up as u go along" ????
2/ CURRENT TRENDS in a moral relativist society.
a)The APA (American Psyhcological Association) is now WAVERING in regard to the harm inflicted on chidren when they are consentually sexually dealt with by adults. (but we put such away for 25 yrs)
b) NAMBLA "North American Man Boy Love Association" has JUMPED alll over this, as they continue their lobbying and campaign to ramp up the 'pedophobia' agenda they have. See... Gays.. agenda.. 'homophobia'.. is it all coming back to you now ????

I, without shame or hesitation or fear... invite ALL of us to adopt a view of life which is based on 2 rules. 1/ Love God with all ur heart, 2/ Love ur neighbour as urself.
There is nothing suggestive of social or political stupidity in this, and I might say... unless we have the first, there will be nothing other than a sentimental cultural socialization (which is decaying) to move us toward fulfilling the 2nd.

jdrmot@bigpond.net.au
keep it up
BOAZ
Posted by BOAZ_David, Thursday, 27 January 2005 10:15:22 AM
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Cranky.. you got it in one ! Atheism IS a 'faith position' if not, it is at least a 'DOGMATIC' one. And u feel uneasy with them also ?
lets see if I can shed some light on 'why' u might feel that way.

Atheism===> Nihilism/Existentialism/moral relativism/"make it up as u go"ism

http://www.iep.utm.edu/n/nihilism.htm

Nihilism is the belief that all values are baseless and that nothing can be known or communicated. It is often associated with extreme pessimism and a radical skepticism that condemns existence. A true nihilist would believe in nothing, have no loyalties, and no purpose other than, perhaps, an impulse to destroy. While few philosophers would claim to be nihilists, nihilism is most often associated with Friedrich Nietzsche who argued that its corrosive effects would eventually destroy all moral, religious, and metaphysical convictions and precipitate the greatest crisis in human history

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Personally.... I prefer "Love God, Love ur neighbour" as a pretty sound basis for life.
Ok..'BIBLE BASH' time.. "Viewer/reader discretion is advised as the ensuing story may contain scenes and statements which might offend some viewers/readers"

The Lord Jesus Christ said "I have come, that they may have LIFE..and have it abundantly".. gee.... what a wowser eh :)

If u dont love/know God, why worry about 'loving' ur neighbour.. I mean heck..if he has more of this worlds goods than you..and flaunts it at ya.. why not TAKE it, after all.. its not 'morally' wrong only 'LEGALLY' wrong.... the only regret would be 'getting caught' by the Law.
jdrmot@bigpond.net.au
BOAZ
Posted by BOAZ_David, Thursday, 27 January 2005 11:00:11 AM
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