Dear David,

«Are you really serious in claiming that "most of today's so-called "Palestinians" are the descendants of Israelis who remained on their land ever since but later converted to Islam under the pressure of Jizyah taxes."»

Yes, regardless of how these people see themselves today, research shows that their ethnic origin is Israeli, more specifically Judean, that their ancestors were Jewish farmers who never left their land, never exiled, that while the higher classes who lived in cities left Israel, the farmers stayed on their land.

It is true that Arabs conquered Israel between the years 638 and 643, and indeed they expelled the Byzantines, but the Jews were actually happy about it and welcomed them, because the Arabs were relatively more liberal and humane to them than the former Christian rulers. They were even allowed to visit Jerusalem after many years of being forbidden to go there.

The research shows that the conquering army could not have comprised of more than 46,000 soldiers, and these too were then moved to other fronts, so Jews were still the majority by far. Further, they were all men, so even if they fathered children, the mothers were still Jewish, so their descendants are also Jewish according to Jewish law.

Research into the nuances of language and names of these so-called "Palestinians" proves that regardless of converting to Islam (especially to avoid taxes), they retained much of their Israeli/Judean culture. Later on they also adopted different national identities, but that cannot change the fact that most of them are ethnically Jewish.

The early Zionists were hoping to include them as brothers in the building of their new land. They (wrongly) assumed that the local Arabs will join them enthusiastically. That dream was then shattered by the 1929 Hebron massacre and later in the Arab revolt of 1936, when the bitterly devastated Zionist leadership understood that they had to go it alone. As a consequence they also changed their history books, but they could not change the facts.

#Yuyutsu

Absolute and unmitigated twaddle based on your supposed unsubstantiated "research".

Put up your sources to support each of the ridiculous claims you have made.

The PLO Charter makes a mockery of your "research". It clearly establishes the Arab identity of those identifying themselves as the "Palestinians".

#Article 1:
Palestine is the homeland of the Arab Palestinian people; it is an indivisible part of the Arab homeland, and the Palestinian people are an integral part of the Arab nation.

#Article 2:
Palestine, with the boundaries it had during the British Mandate, is an indivisible territorial unit.

#Article 3:
The Palestinian Arab people possess the legal right to their homeland and have the right to determine their destiny after achieving the liberation of their country in accordance with their wishes and entirely of their own accord and will.

#Article 4:
The Palestinian identity is a genuine, essential, and inherent characteristic; it is transmitted from parents to children. The Zionist occupation and the dispersal of the Palestinian Arab people, through the disasters which befell them, do not make them lose their Palestinian identity and their membership in the Palestinian community, nor do they negate them.

#Article 5:
The Palestinians are those Arab nationals who, until 1947, normally resided in Palestine regardless of whether they were evicted from it or have stayed there. Anyone born, after that date, of a Palestinian father - whether inside Palestine or outside it - is also a Palestinian.

The conflict between Jews and Arabs has been raging unresolved for 100 years over sovereignty in the territory comprising former Palestine.

Do I accept their claims set out in the above document published in 1968? No -I do not - as I repeatedly have made clear in the many articles that have been published on OLO.

But I would never have the temerity to do what you have disparagingly said of them: "regardless of how these people see themselves today". Who are you to tell people how they should see themselves?

Dear David,

I am not telling these people how to see themselves - why should I even care?

As far as I am concerned they are nothing, they are insignificant, they are weak with no strength to threaten Israel: all they can do is bark, so let them make noise, let them write their angry charters because there is nothing else they can do, it is only you who bothers to read them, I wonder why?

You keep mentioning some "conflict" between Jews and Arabs, but you never even cared to explain who those Jews and Arabs are supposed to be. Israel and the Arab countries are increasingly at peace.

You also keep mentioning "former Palestine" which is a great insult to the Jewish people: there was never such a place as "Palestine" - that was a a derogatory word which Romans invented to humiliate the Jews, so who would want to use such a dirty word but a Roman anti-Semite?

These fools continue to consider themselves "Arabs" even after the rest of the Arab world forgot about them. They also continue to look for trouble, infuriating Israelis by describing themselves by that insulting word. Have they had any sense, they could have, 100 years ago, been recognised as Jews due to their ancestry, or alternately they could have become Israelis while remaining Muslims, they could have participated in the Zionist project as equal brothers if they wanted, they could have been living today in one of the most developed countries, but they chose otherwise and so they suffer.

Why do you keep even mentioning them?
The occupation of the West Bank is an internal Israeli problem - the self-labeled "Palestinians" are irrelevant, they are not a factor in that equation and need not be considered.

David's article is disappointing. It seems that whenever I've seen something written by him concerning Israel, he characterises criticisms of the Israeli government and of its army, its 'settlers' and so forth ... as hatred of Jews.

I don't buy it...

#Yuyutsu

Are you incapable of reading and comprehending?

I requested the following from you:
"Absolute and unmitigated twaddle based on your supposed unsubstantiated "research".

Put up your sources to support each of the ridiculous claims you have made."

No sources posted by you - only more twaddle.

Not the way to establish any credibility.

Put up or shut up - your sources please

#Garry in Liffey

Sorry you are disappointed.

You apparently fail to understand that the UN claim that Jews have no rights to settle in Judea and Samaria (West Bank) and East Jerusalem - is contrary to Article 80 of the UN Charter.

That is Jew-hatred big time.

Dear David,

«your sources please»

Well there is a difficulty here because my sources are in Hebrew and this board only accepts English script.

Anyway, here is the book: http://simania.co.il/bookdetails.php?item_id=221363

Chapter 3 deals with and refutes the myth that the people of Israel were exiled in the year 70 A.D.

More specifically, sections 3-9 and 3-10 (pages 173-183) discuss the fate of the farming Jews who remained in the land of Israel all along till today.

These sections point to 24 other references, but all in Hebrew.