Excellent clear article. I worked hard for the award of my PhD in Science/Technology in 1987 and supported myself thru limited small research grants, lowly, demeaning part-time jobs and the support of my patient wife. Three years fulltime 14 hr/day, 7 days per week and it was a worthwhile experience. It didn't get me a relevant job initially and I ended up lecturing computing for the first two years. Having moved on into my chosen field for 5 years at unis in UK and Oz, I have moved into industry and government sectors in my chosen field. Did the Phd give me more pay, more respect, greater career progress... No. It give me was a sound basis for problem solving and "spin-detection" skills, which in itself is not often appreciated in this world of ego, narcisim and spin!!

Traditionally a PhD had to ne first & foremost a standalone piece of well argued and original research, summarized in a plain, bland 3-5 copy hardcopy book. But then the sausage factory mentality of greedy uni's adopted the "3-5 peer reviewed papers PhD", which led to start a downward and slippery quality path in "first-world" uni's. A bit akin to 1st class degrees being offered for project work with no viva or final examinations. University academic leadership have mortally wounded the value of a traditional PhD. Greed to export education products have devalued the product, akin to the printed money of hyperinflated failed economies. Unlike failed economies, I doubt PhD's will ever regain their value in our increasingly spin, social media and hypedworld... I bet they even give out PhD's in social media promotion these days somewhere in Oz !!

BUT if you do want to do a "proper" PhD, " old-school style", the do so. But remember, the beenfits will be for your personal development, skills and satisfaction... it won't make you money and will cost you not only several years of low/little income... it won't even contribute to your superannuation nest egg which you will need in your eventual retirement, where no one will care that you are "Dr".

Phd=

Wasted years of frustrated elitist conformation. Get a real job.

Dan

If it can be bought and sold and only as good as the size of your's or your parent's pocketbook/wallet? then it has no value?

Moreover, given this particular marketplace is awash with bogus credentials? Completely devalues the genuine article, the years of study, effort and possible sacrifice, required to gain VALID credentials!?

If the holders of such (forged) credentials were required to validate them via an unbeatable space age lie detector test and charged with fraud and perjury for relying on bogus documents to gain a superior salary and position? Or an undeserved financial outcome? Then there'd be a lot less of this behaviour or market?

Even so, when rich kids can have others write their papers and take their exams, with complete apparent impunity?

It's going to be hard to completely eliminate the practice other than making validation via the foregoing, mandatory, before an appointment or financial transaction!

Furthermore, there has to be some serious hard jail time for all the, knowingly involved, mendacious, disingenuous participants! A fine for some? Of little consequence! Unless it also results in penury!

And forfeiture of all the equipment, plates and material used to create fraudulent documents etc! Which should be very thoroughly trashed and destroyed, smelted, so they cannot find new homes and new fraudsters, using them to make illegal incomes!
Alan B.

Hi Alison Jane,

What is your background? What did you do your PhD in?

I remember the old joke about:

We all know what BS is.
An MS - is more of the same.
And a PhD - is piled higher and deeper.

One thing many students have in common is
dissatisfaction. Low pay and uncertain
prospects are widespread.

The requirements to complete vary enormously
between countries, universities, and even
subjects.

Many will find that hard work and brilliance
may well not be enough to succeed and they
would be better off doing something else.

They might be better off using their research
skills to look harder at the disposable academic.
Someone should write a thesis about that. (smile).

Dear Foxy,

I separate degrees into two streams: vocational degrees and scholarly degrees.

One does a vocational degree to get a job: engineering, medicine, law, architecture, etc. People doing vocational degrees are taught skills and knowledge necessary to carry out work to the satisfaction of employers.

One does a scholarly degree out of interest: archaeology, sociology, anthropology, history, etc. People study these subjects basically because they hold a fascination for people. We study humanities because we want to know what it is to be human. A handful of scholars get jobs as lecturers and make a living out of it but the majority do it just because these are fascinating subjects that help us understand the world we live in.

I bridged the divide between both types. I did an engineering degree first and have always made a living in that field. But I also followed this with several Arts degrees: sociology, anthropology, and history. The first I did for money and the second I did for interest.

A PhD is one of the hardest things that a person can undertake. It is only done for two people: the research student and the examiner. Personally I think it is mainly applicable to the Arts and the Sciences where people are wanting to discover things about the world we live in and the people we were, are and will be. A PhD in the vocational fields won't necessarily get a person a better job or bigger salary because there is only a relative handful of employers who actually need that level of qualification. Believe me when I say that there are a lot of engineers in Australia who would not get into a university let alone complete a basic undergraduate degree.

Obtaining a PhD does not equal sense or healthy mentality. It simply proves that the student has a very good memory !

Dear individual,

Are you speaking from personal experience?

Mr Opinion,
Yes, plenty, I've worked alongside & spent plenty of time with quite a number of Phd type people. Hence my assessment/conclusion based on averages from my experiences. One in particular who remains in my memory was at one stage one of the highest Judges in the land.
His ignorance was excruciating.
But the # 1 spot belongs to a Doctor.

Dear individual,

And what about yourself? What is your personal experience in doing your degrees?

A PhD is a very useful thing to have: you can receive medicines from overseas by mail, addressed "To: Dr. Such_and_Such" without them being confiscated!

And what about yourself? What is your personal experience in doing your degrees?
Mr Opininon,
My interests & needs & requirements are in the practical field & would therefore be much hindered by a degree.

Dear Mr Opinion,

I've made the right choices in my studies.
My qualifications have been balanced - studying
for the love of it, in humanities, to practical
hands-on qualifications that kept/keeps, me
employed. I've never been out of a job. And have
had a successful career. It was Thanks to my father's
advice that I made these choices. He insisted that
I study whatever I wanted but that I should also back
it up with employable skills and experience.

I should also add that I'm still learning to this day.
Education does not stop at getting your degree. It
lasts a lifetime.

Mr O an indication of the less than usefulness of many academics.

I learned all my practical engineering from an amateur. He was an accountant by day, & a brilliant motor racing engineer by night.

We built the most successful racing Australia ever saw. It was a Formula 2 engine, competing against the best from the top engines from the UK builders.

In the 20 months I raced it, it not only finished every race it started, but won either it's class, or outright in every one of them. In both years it raced at Bathurst it finished third outright in the main formula 1 race.

During this time I ran into my favourite professor from my last year of engineering. He seemed to be the most switched on. I excitedly started telling him about our engine, & it's success, what & how we had done it.

After a couple of minutes he cut me off, telling me that my ideas would never work, & would be detrimental. I don't know quite what he missed when I had told him this was our results, not hopes or dreams. This brought home to me how these people live in their own little make believe world, where they believe they are the font of all wisdom.

This was reinforced when "scientists" discovered what lowly educated professional reef fisherman had known for decades, that corals release their spore over just 2 nights each year.

I won't bother with more examples, but when you see them regularly promoting what you know is utter garbage, it gets harder every year to take any of them seriously.

Dear Hasbeen,

You sound like an angry man. I suppose, like me, you are upset about having wasted your time doing an engineering degree. Don't worry most engineers find themselves in that position. Do you find yourself telling people the you're like a doctor. That's a fairly common behaviour among a lot of engineers. When I hear them saying that I remind them that they are just engineers.

50 years ago in Europe a Tradesman knew more than an Engineer here nowadays. Some will insist there is progress.

At least I have not wasted my time studying pretend disciplines like Sociology, with the make believe fairies.

Dear Hasbeen,

Seems like you suffer from a dose of sour grapes. You can't be a sociologist yourself so you resent it so much that you resort to telling yourself that you don't want to be one anyway.

Actually I don't think you could handle being a sociologist. I don't think you would be able to complete any of the humanities, be it sociology, anthropology, history, archaeology, etc. You would probably be able to get into the degree program but you definitely wouldn't be able to complete it. You just don't have what it takes. Same goes for your know-all-know-nothing wannabe mates individual, ttbe, Loudmouth, mhaze, etc.

You can't be a sociologist yourself
Mr Opinion,
If you were to look up the word 'Integrity' in a Dictionary you'd find and, most likely much to your surprise, that many people still have enough integrity not to actually want to suffer the humiliation of being a Sociologist i.e. of no use to fellow Citizens !

Dear individual,

I see you have got case of sour grapes as well. You hate what you cannot have.

Mr Opinion,
So, of what use are you to society then ? I was part of teams that kept whole communities going with essential services infrastructure installation & maintenance.

Dear individual,

I did my humanities degrees and became an environmental sociologist for me and me alone. As my wife keeps reminding me: It's all about me!

Mr Opinion,
Sounds like you have a reserved spot for your snout at the Govt trough !
Do you ever check how the victims of your policies fare?

Dear individual,

Can you say something else because what you just said has absolutely nothing to do with what I've done, am doing, or will ever be doing?

Mr Opinion,
Well, as soon as as you divulge the degree of your usefulness to society there's a possibility my rhetoric may change alas, without information well...

Dear individual,

You are the master of total gibberish. In fact you're so good at gibberish that you should be awarded a PhD in gibberish.

'You are the master of total gibberish. In fact you're so good at gibberish that you should be awarded a PhD in gibberish.'

actually Mr Opinion that is already taken by those trying to preach the gw faith.

Dear runner,

Spoken like a true LNP voter. Your GW denialism has nothing to do with science - it's all about maintaining right-wing conservatives in power. Finally we have begun to see through the Emperor's clothes and understand exactly what it is that you and your know-all-know-nothing wannabe mates are really trying to achieve.

see through the Emperor's clothes
Mr Opinion,
And we can see through your Clown outfit !

To individual,

OUCH ........ RUSH ME TO THE BURNS UNIT.

Mr Opinion,
Too late for you, your Brains are already cooked past soft-boiled !
Jokes aside, what are you actually contributing to our society ?

Dear individual,

I do it for myself. As my wife keeps reminding me: IT'S ALL ABOUT ME.

Mr Opinion,
I think it's time we checked your ankle band again !

Dear individual,

Looks like you are getting your grandchildren to write your material for you. I bet they have a lot of fun playing with your interchangeable DUNCE/INDIVIDUAL hat.

Mr Opininon,
You're a true Progressive, you've progressed from insipid mutt to fully qualified Moron !
How much are the Greens paying you for being such a disruptive, pointless git here ?

Dear individual,

Nope! Wrong again. Keep trying.