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The Forum > Article Comments > The second person of the Trinity: the Son > Comments

The second person of the Trinity: the Son : Comments

By Peter Sellick, published 11/10/2017

If a kindly Father God was looking down from above ready to intervene for his Son he must have turned aside so as not to see.

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(...continued.)

•Blessed are the poor, those who morn, the meek, and those who hunger for justice.

A second criticism for the first 4 blessing is that these verses provide comfort that isn't validated, and focuses on the life after this one instead of bettering our current conditions in this life. The criticism goes on the idea that these verses negate our needs in this life instead of offering solutions to living a better life.

What the critic got right is that these verses offer us a hope in God's Kingdom. In the life after this one. That should be a great focus on our lives. But it is not the only focus. We have much to do in this life. What the critic got wrong is that there is no spiritual advise for us to follow in this life. It offers comfort to the poor and to those who morn; but it also give direction to be humble, and seek justice. Both humility and justice are common themes throughout the bible. And here they are as well.

•Blessed are the merciful, the pure of heart, and the peacemakers.

The criticism given to these verses is not about to be merciful, pure of heart, or peacemakers, but that God would reward that behavior, or teach about a reward instead of teach to do good for it's own sake. The critic also criticizes Jesus by these words. Saying that Jesus's teaching that those who deny Jesus will be denied by Jesus before God in Heaven is not merciful.

This criticism is misguided. It acknowledges the good teachings to be merciful, pure of heart, and a peacemaker. But then in it's own conclusion that these are good, the critic says they are not good enough, and should not hold rewards. I disagree with that. God gave us a standard, but is a standard any good is there is nothing backing it up? It is His decision on how He would reward anyone. There is no harm in God rewarding those who follow Jesus's teachings, nor in the depth of the reward.

(Continued...)
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Wednesday, 1 November 2017 4:56:24 AM
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(...continued.)

Show mercy if you want to receive mercy. We all need mercy. No one is perfect and based on that, we all usually offer a little forgiveness in each other's weaknesses. The standard is revealed by God that if we don't show mercy we won't receive it.

Clean your heart, and hold no impure motive. Instead have a pure heart. The reward for this is that those who do will see God, but the challenge of having a pure heart? That is something of a hard battle. Be pure and not guilty of greed, lust, anger, cruelty. Be pure and full of love, sorrow for the suffering of others, helpful and humble. However one looks at a pure heart with the removal of our wrong desires and full of positive motivations; having a pure heart is not an easy task. The reward is great, but the task is not easy. Therefore it is worth striving for whether we are successful in it or not.

And to bring peace to any conflict. Their reward is to be known as children of God. What a wonderful thing. But this is something that requires both a heart for the conflict and wisdom to resolve it. The badge of honor might be more then just a badge of honor in Heaven. Who knows what awaits us if we make it to paradise. On our way there though we should try to bring peace instead of conflict.

As for the criticism against Jesus. Jesus suffered for our benefit. He died because God loves us. He rose again as a testament of both His promises and God's promises. To reject Him has a severe consequence. But to accept Jesus in our faith in Him, and in our lives. That will help us on many other aspects too. He will help shape us to be better then we were before. It is worth noting this reality instead of complaining that God isn't merciful when He gave us an out to the dirt and grime that is part of who we are.
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Wednesday, 1 November 2017 5:03:09 AM
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(....Continued.)

•Blessed are those persecuted for rightousness sake.

The critic from this verse says ignores what the verse says and goes on about what it implies. It brings divisiveness between Christians and nonchristians. Free from any criticism because that is counted as persecution, and discourages cooperation.

What the critic is wrong about is what he implies though too. That Christian persecution isn't a real thing. Those who are lucky enough to live in a nation that protects a Christian from harm are the minority. The majority of the world does persecute those that are in it's way. From both religious persecution of another religion beheading and torturing Christians, and political persecution of the government that holds no religion, wholesale persecuting Christians. This is both current in our modern day, as well as in the past. It's even unfortunate to note that the conflict has existed among Christians when they split into different denominations and sects. And fought with each other instead of focus on God.

That said this is not just towards Christians, but to those persecuted for righteousness. For following God, or for seeking what He commanded. It should also be noted that in the previous verses we are encouraged to be peacemakers, how is that already forgotten to be the criticism of not having cooperation with non Christians? The criticism can be applied to Christians if they fit the criticism, but not to the teaching.
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Wednesday, 1 November 2017 5:06:03 AM
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To Yuyutsu,

Thankyou for your replies. I now have a fuller understanding of how our views differ and disagree with one another. It sounds like to me that in Hinduism God is something to be obtained. To be enlightened enough to become part of, maybe? Perhaps after many lives?

Christianity is quite the opposite of the spectrum. God knows us and He made us. He reaches down to us. And in that way, He has made Himself known to us. It's not something we obtain after a lifetime of understanding. It's something He gives. I don't know the whys for how we are the way we are, or why (or how) God is the way He is. But I do know how He introduces Himself from the bible. I accept those terms because it's how He has made Himself known. I trust God, and from searching for Him I've also come to trust the bible.

As for the aspect of God being real, or existing. These are practical terms, not in depth concepts. Counting God as real and as existing therefore is to compare Him to things that don't exist. Or things that aren't real. It is a topic that goes into much more detail in Israel's history. False idols, and wicked worship existed in the land Israel was given. And unfortunately much of that culture continued after Israel was given their "promised land." Saying that God exists is an acknowledgement of Him. I don't mean it on a deeper level then that to be how I worship Him or focus on when I worship. There is so much more to love then to only focus on God just existing.

(Continued...)
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Thursday, 2 November 2017 6:10:01 PM
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(...Continued)

The other element that Hinduism and Christianity differ in is the idea that an object is a good focus for our worship of God, and that having many deities to help conceptualize God. In Christianity to worship idols is a horrible act against God. It is compairable to adultery with a wife or a husband cheating on their spouse.

Instead of this God has shown Himself through His acts, His miracles, and His prophets. When Jesus came He gave us one more element. The only way to God is through Jesus. And the only way to Jesus is if God leads us to Him.

It gets complex to think about but simply put God reaches down to us so that we can have a relationship with Him. It's a gift, not something we earn or deserve. It's love.
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Thursday, 2 November 2017 6:11:42 PM
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Dear Not_Now.Soon,

That differences exist is not surprising, but I consider them superficial. Religion is still religion, no matter which perspective you take to describe it. Looking deep enough, nothing you wrote is untrue.

The Hindu perspective is not that God is something to be obtained, because there is nothing else but God, including ourselves: what needs to be defeated is our ignorance whereby we see/feel ourselves as separate from God. Once ignorance is defeated and the veil of illusion lifts, we realise that nothing new was obtained, that we have been God all along.

The key question in Hinduism is not "Who is God?", but "Who am I?".
By solving this question, one automatically realises that they were never separate from God. This however, is not a question of understanding: intellectual understanding is relatively easy, but in order to realise our true nature, our identity with God, we need to give up our attachment to the world, including to our bodies and minds, we need to renounce all our desires, gross and subtle - and that effort takes many lifetimes, when finally our efforts are met with God's grace.

Jesus has realised his identity with God and his teachings, the Christian path, are one viable way to achieve this detachment from the world and desires. Christianity emphasises love and service to others as a way to overcome the selfishness which separates us (subjectively) from God.

As mentioned, Hinduism teaches that most of us require some object to concentrate/channel our devotion to God through. The object can be physical, mental or both, including exemplary persons. It can be referred to as "deity" or "idol" (if physical), but it does not replace God. Hinduism respects anyone's genuine choice of deity/idol, including the Hebrew Father and the His human Son, Jesus (which by contrast, Judaism and Islam reject as an idol). Should the method of worship through a particular deity require exclusivity, Hinduism has no problem with it.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 3 November 2017 5:46:47 PM
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