From the outset let me say in that in my opinion all religions are silly.

Any belief system can be a source of good or evil, the cross over for these things is if you use your beliefs to drive the standards and behaviors of what you live by or do you use them to judge/condemn others.

I'm not sure What the Author would expect the Victorian Premier to do, other then to say that the idea that Terror acts are not part modern mainstream Islamic teaching.

"While Anti-balaka groups have been frequently described as Christian militias in the media this has been denied by Church leaders. Bishop Juan José Aguirre said: "But in no sense can it be said that the anti-balaka is a Christian group. The anti-balaka are made up of people of all kinds, terribly enraged, and including many people whom we call the 'dispossessed' – bandits, ex-prisoners, delinquents, criminals – who have got involved in these groups and are now extending, like a plague of locusts, across the whole of the CAR, murdering Muslims"."

Sound familiar?

There is no "religiously-related terrorism"; there is only Islamic-related terrorism. To suggest otherwise is gutless and absurd.

Dear ttbn,

In my suburb we have young men smashing the windows
of cars and trucks in the early hours of the
morning simply because they can. They come from
good homes and are in no way connected to Islam.
The police are still to arrest any of them.
Go figure.

The secular/feminist dogma of ripping apart unborn babies is just as sick ideology as Islamic terrorist. They are both as evil as each other.

Ttbn

I totally agree with you.

Time all governments across Aust – woke up to the fact, and so many others.

Bronwyn Bishop (on Paul Murray live) approx. Oct/Nov viewing stated there are (at her last info whilst in Government) 3.5 million Medicare Cards issued to persons over and above Australian population?

Hullo – while I viewed the programme NOTHING was followed up by any media outlet.

So I ask the question – WHY NOT?

I thought this would have been acted upon (exposed) as a matter of extreme urgency in regards to “false documentation” of persons living in Australia and utilizing taxpayers funding services.

How naïve am i.

Foxy,

Islamic inspired have acts nothing to do with straight thuggery. The title of this article was "The reality of religiously-motivated terrorism in Australia". Non-Muslim thugs are not religioulsy motivated. There are plenty of very nasty bad people who are not Muslims, but Islamic terrorists are not just anti-social hoodlums: they fighting an idealogical war against us.

Saints,

The Medicare card revelation is appalling. It is beyond understanding that the government and Medicare staff are not working overtime to put these surplus cards out of circulation and those responsible behind bars. Our politicians and bureaucrats have certainly reached an all time low.

tbn -

We (as taxpaying Aussies) are just mushrooms - which the Government want us to "live in the dark and not be heard".

Thank you Bronwyn Bishop....we as taxpayers are following.

Foxy – you state

"In my suburb we have young men smashing the windows
of cars and trucks in the early hours of the
morning simply because they can. They come from
good homes and are in no way connected to Islam.
The police are still to arrest any of them.
Go figure".

I don’t know what state you come from, but if from Melbourne says it all to me as Premier Daniel Andrews stated latest terrorist attack proposed in Vic sites – not being of any “religious” credo.

He would have to be the ONLY person in Australia to quote same.

Foxy

Welcome back, whilst we can agree/disagree on issues, we all respect your views/comments.

I wish you much health for 2017.

I guess now I have sated my quota for today on olo .....lol

Dear Saints,

Thanks for that.

I'm not familiar with what the Premier stated -
its' been a very busy time of year so I haven't
kept up with things. However, I did glance at
our local paper and that's where I'm getting all
this info from. The local police are concerned
about the recent violence by young kids in our
area who go round smashing cars and doing other
damage. Many people are getting tired of this
kind of irrational behaviour. It's so senseless.
I read about a local butcher who came into work
at around 5am and was about to go and make his
deliveries only to walk out and find his truck
had been smashed to bits. He was livid. And who
can blame him.

cont'd ...

I wish you and everyone on the Forum -
peace on earth, love in your hearts,
and joy in all of your days!

Jihad is only ever an internal struggle with your own demons! To externalize it, ensures those demons have won.

Moreover, there's no place in paradise for those who knowingly spill a single drop of innocent blood. Except in self defense or to survive!

Some of the community justify almost any evil, by claiming we're standing on their ground? Even though it was my ancestral ground centuries before it became their (purloined) ancestral ground?

Therefore, and according to their claimed rationale? Everything standing on it, is theirs to do with, or vandalize as they see fit?

At least this is the inculcated, brainwashed from birth belief?

When the day finally dawns that unfit parents are obliged to also stand in the dock beside the young offenders they've raised and indoctrinated with false belief and held to account for their indisputable part?

Then maybe they'll stop! Or start taking some responsibility for the outcomes they've engineered, almost if they were lighting a stick of dynamite and then throwing it in our midst?

In conclusion, let me say, if there were no religious element in radicalization, then young thugs, murderers, butchering bastards, and scum of the earth, would just be common thugs, thrill kill murderers, antisocial animals, raping for the purely personal sexual gratification it gives them; and or, butchering for perverse pleasure and because they can! Even so, adding a claimed religious element changes nothing!

An evil act, regardless of how it is dressed or excused, or who gives alleged permission, will always remain an evil act! No ifs buts or maybes!

I who have opened death's door, looked and came back, am here to tell the aforementioned, you are not going to like what you find there or the unfathomable terror heaped on endless terror, each worse than that preceding it, waiting to welcome you, HELPLESS, to its DARK domain!

If you would but avoid that (your very worst nightmare) destination, then you need to completely turn your life around, now, while you still have some remaining time?
Alan B.

Dear Alan,

The build up to another year and a fresh start
gives us hope for a better version of ourselves.
If we would only focus more on others than
ourselves - it would give our lives more
meaning and fewer depressive symptoms.

I volunteer at my mother's nursing home. She's
in their dementia wing. The more I inter-act
with the people there the less likely I find
myself indulging in my own complaints and
frustrations. It puts things into perspective for
me.

Wishing you much Joy and peace of mind in the New Year.

So, Dear Foxy, you think I'm exhibiting symptoms of depression or dementia or am a self absorbed introvert! And therefore enable you and all you successfully influence to merely dismiss my near death out of body experience, as the ramblings of some poor demented fool?

Yes a stroke is a brain injury and what I witnessed could have been the hallucinations of an injured brain?

Conversely and equally, it could have been a real experience observed by my spiritual self? Given no reliable evidence to prove either outcome? Other eye witness evidence!?

Either explanation has apparent merit, even a denial, it couldn't have been real? My recovery by all accounts was bordering on the miraculous and I have full use of the formerly paralyzed side!

I am so lucky! This town my town is full of my friends, many of who go out of their way when they see me struggling with shopping trolley or what have you.

A recent visit from my kids and Grand kids left me in an ebullient effervescent mood! Normally, and thanks to years of meditation, I don't have massively swinging highs and lows!

Tomorrow I celebrate the new year with family and old friends! I'm neither irrational nor demented and I thank you for ensuring those who read these lines, are unable to reach any other conclusion, however personally unpalatable!

This is the season of goodwill and peace! Therefore, I wish you good health, all the joy and dream fulfillment you can possibly tolerate in the coming year!

I cared, cooked cleaned etc, for my Mum the last ten years of her life, which thankfully never included a single day inside a nursing home!

Notwithstanding, I don't envy anyone volunteering inside a nursing home, but simply can't find enough superlatives to tell them how much I admire and appreciate them for their tireless application to tasks nobody else would touch! Just want it over!
May your God bless and keep you.
Take care, Alan B.

Dear Alan,

I apologise unreservedly for misunderstanding your
previous post. I did not know what you had been
through and made the wrong assumptions. However
my intentions were well meant. Still there's no excuse.
I'm glad that you're doing well, especially that you
have the support of family and friends.

Thank You for your kind words and well wishes.
Especially your blessings. I also wish you and yours
good health, love in your hearts and joy in all of
your days.

Take care.

Alan B
I think you hit the nail on the head, when you said these terrorists basically
are thugs with hate in their hearts, using religious belief to whitewash their
murderous actions in their own minds.

What makes these people dangerous is that they believe in what they are doing. These aren't criminals, in it for personal gain, you don't blow yourself up for profit. The fight must be taken to these people by Islam itself, perhaps the non-terrorist Islamic world should agree on a new caliphate.

"Using religious belief" to cover up common or garden-variety thuggery? Come on, Cherful. Have you been smoking whatever they put in their hookahs too? Terrorism is firmly rooted in Islam. The hate is certainly there - hammered in by the Koran.

Ttbn
Humans act this way in wars without religious beliefs.

They usually come up with some other excuse to justify their own or their
country's actions.

This is classic, historical, human behaviour.

The hatred is in fact, racist,directed at other tribes, the majority of the time.
But it is also the rise of the warlords or gangs of bandits who prey on ordinary
people for their own gain.
Men who are powerless, who seek to gain power with a gun and a revolutionary
band of brothers.
The behaviour is as old as history, no matter what lie they come up with as a reason.

Hi Cherful,

As you suggest, terrorists are PARTLY " .... thugs with hate in their hearts, using religious belief to whitewash their murderous actions in their own minds" who, as Billyd points out, blow themselves up, and usually yelling out "Allahu Akbar !" as they do so.

Hmmmm ..... can there possibly be some slight, distant, indirect connection between Islam and vile, murdering bastards who hope to get to paradise by blowing themselves up, along with innocent people, while invoking the name of their god ?

May their heads hit the ceiling before their balls hit the floor, and the rest of them paste the walls, as my grandmother would say, perhaps in that instant when they realise that there is no paradise. Religions are wishful thinking (sorry, Runner) and so is the notion that killing innocent people somehow pleases one's god.

Cheers,

Joe

Loudmouth

I agree totally with what you say, Love the plain speaking by your grandma.

ttbn
I didnt mean to defend the Muslim religion I just wanted to point out the
delusion that absolves the perpertrators in their own minds.

The religion is like a dark cloak shrouding and whispering encouragement
to the hate filled hearts. Telling them their actions are holy and true.

Aiding and abetting. The light of truth needs to shine inside that cloak to dispel
the illusions and delusions and to show that the killing is all to human and not any
great holy deed. I think Isis has done quite a bit to convey to the world
and the decent people of the muslim faith that the dark side has to be cast out of the religion.

I heard the analogy with regards immigration. Imagine that someone gives you a large box of chocolates where 999 are delicious, but one has cyanide.

Do you accept the box and eat some of the chocolates, or do you refuse the gift?

Thanks Cherful,

Yes, my poor old grandmother gets lumbered with many unverifiable quotes. Actually she was a very sweet, hard-working woman, born in the Hull work-house at Sculcoates, raised by the Barnardos' in the south, to be a bookkeeper, she worked for Lord Samuel's family as the Shabbas goy and travelled all over Britain before coming out to a dirt-farm near Dubbo. She ran off with a Hungarian Jewish maths teacher and they both were nudists. Many times they took me to a colony near Waterfall. Wonderful days.

I suppose one problem with Islamist terrorism is that it springs directly - and probably has done so countless times in the past 1400 years - from Islam: terrorists can quote, perfectly correctly, from the Koran to justify, before and/or after, any and every vile act.

That's the problem with religious books, especially if that book is supposed to be the absolute, perfect, word of one's god, never to be changed in any way. [I'm not sure that Arabic had a written form in the seventh century, and that Allah didn't dictate the Koran to Muhammad in Syriac or Aramaic].

In that horrible way, Islam seems to be the 'perfect religion', with all the answers, as long as one adheres to the book. But it locks people into a strictly medieval way of life, from which they can curse or condemn all modern technology as alien or 'Western', while every day they are using it.

I'm struck by the two facts (1) that, by the year 1500, in Europe, after the invention of the printing press in 1485 (?) and translations of the Bible into local languages, a million (or maybe a billion ?) books had been printed, and the roots of Catholicism were about to be shaken. And (2) that the first printing press in the Muslim world was set up in 1824.

Of course, the Koran can be copied (and presumably now, printed) only in Arabic, which most Muslims can't speak. As well, a copy has to be kept at the highest point of a room in the house, unread.

Yes Joe, but let's not be half hearted? But end the ball bouncing outcome by adding, and then, may the fleas of a thousand camels infest your celestial armpits for all eternity!

We need to be thorough with any assigned task!

Can you imagine anything worse than a massive itch that eternally magnifies as you scratch to try and find relief?

I'd imagine the vestal virgins would be none too pleased either and may go out of their way to avoid all contact? Perhaps back into the bottle from whence they magically manifested as formless smoke?
Cheers, Alan B.

Err no, Cherful. ISIS, Pol Pot, the Nazis, the Muslim Brotherhood, Boko Haram, and many other extreme groups do not consider themselves immoral at all. As a matter of fact, like you and Foxy, they consider themselves to be morally upright and superior.

Now you might think that, say, the members of ISIS, who mass murder infidels and take Foxy for a sex slave, would consider themselves evil? But if you belong to a religion which promises you eternal life in the highest level of heaven screwing 72 "dark eyed, high breasted virgins" because you are doing exactly what your God commanded, then you would consider your acts to be the behaviour of a virtuous and devout Muslim. The ISIS boys know they are doing nothing wrong because God has OK'd it. Turning Foxy into a sex slave is good for her, and good for Islam. She can be forced to become a Muslim, and therefore her soul will be saved. Cool huh?

Take yourself and Foxy, Cherful. You and Foxy think that dumping on your own people and civilisation, and making excuses for an evil terrorist religion like Islam is the sort of thing a person of unimpeachable virtue would do. Others like myself consider it to be an act of treason and sheer stupidity. But like ISIS, we know that you and Foxy don't see it that way. You refuse to believe that Islam teaches it's adherents to spread Islam through violence and terrorism. Even though it's true. And it is in black and white in the Koran.

So you see nothing wrong with importing Muslims into an advanced society. And when the predicted rapes, crime waves, terrorism, welfare dependency, child brides, female circumcisions, and white flight become manifest, you make excuses and defend Muslims. You blame Muslim dysfunction on everybody else but Muslims.

But if a group of people have a written belief system that sanctions rape, terrorism and murder, and they don't do anything to change it, then reasonable people like myself and ttbn would consider them to be complicit, and yourself and Foxy as collaborators.

Hi LEGO & Cherful,

Arabs/Muslims as invaders: I can't get around the fact that the mitochondrial DNA of 80 % of Iraqi women is Kurdish and Persian; while 80 % of the Y chromosome of Iraqi men is Arab.

I wonder if that's a typical pattern of invading societies around the world, those historically considered to be 'uncivilized': successful invaders in 'traditional' and 'pre-modern' societies slaughter the men and enslave the women.

If Islam is supposed to be a 'religion of peace', which one isn't ? Which religion sanctions more violence than Islam ? Let's not go back thousands of years: now, in 2017 ?

Joe

Dear LEGO,

«eternal life in the highest level of heaven screwing 72 "dark eyed, high breasted virgins"»

Can you think of a more selfish motive?

This is not religion and this is not surrender to God (=Islam), this is a lustful desire!

How do you tell? Well ask those people what they will do if, once in that heaven, God asks them: "Now would you leave these women behind and come back down to earth to help me with my work?"

Now people do what they do - first they do it, or at least plan it, then they seek a teacher that will approve and tell them that what they do is good.

There are Imams who will tell you that the Koran says this and others who will tell you that the Koran says the opposite - and if you look hard enough, you would find the Christian and Jewish version of both. It may be that violence is in the Arab genes, then the males with those genes shop around for a teacher that will tell them what they like to hear.

Hi Yuyutsu,

That's an interesting scenario: God promising no eternal virgins, but only the power - for those who really love him - to go back to Earth perpetually, perhaps in different bodies, to do his work tirelessly, throughout eternity. A crowd of Barabbases doing good forever.

Shades of Schopenhauer: explain the logic of that (which I think is pretty strong) to devout believers and they would become atheists in twenty minutes.

Cheers,

Joe

Hello LWH, Thank you for this robust argument clearly demonstrating the folly that grips the so called leaders of the nation. Mr Andrews has a lot of form in his efforts to deny reality in favour of his Marxist philosophy. Australians must be prepared to face reality - call a spade a spade - if they are to survive the politically correct left wing socialism pervading the nation. The attempted murder you describe was due to one reason only - that is Islamic theology.

Joe,

My treasured copy of the Koran is printed (very handsomely too) in both English and Arabic and was a gift, courtesy of the Saudi Government.

Thanks Is Mise,

I didn't know that the Saudis did that. I thought that would be viewed as blasphemy, especially in what would be seen as a barbaric and ignorant language like English.

But my bet is that, say, in an Indonesian home, the Koran would be in Arabic, and kept up out of reach, never read. Maybe I'm wrong ?

Back in the Middle Ages, when the Bible was only in Latin, and only priests could (barely) read it (if it was read at all), of course the ordinary people had to take the word of their priests about what was in it. Maybe a similar situation prevails in many parts of the Muslim world ? I don't know, but I suspect it would be so ?

Cheers,

Joe

Yes, I also consider all religions as stupid, but only one is particularly vicious as well.

Why do we lock vicious, dangerous people up for many years in the vain hope that perhaps they will reform, and turn into productive members of the community, when statistics and just plain common sense would argue that it won't?

Mass murderers such as Martin Bryant should be hung, not fed, clothed and housed, at something exceeding $100,000 per year, at my expense. Prison, it has been said, is an extremely expensive way to make bad people worse, and should be reserved only for those non-vicious criminals with a good chance of redemption. We have many better uses for our tax dollars.

We should not allow religious belief, or any form of insanity, to be used as an excuse for mass murder, or terrorism, or treason!

Hang the bastard!