ijnutter:

"...the size of the Gaza territory has not changed since 1948...Gaza has Hamas and rockets. Conclusion. The Israelis cannot overcome people who stand up for themselves."

Do you read any background material before commenting here? Do you have any idea of the recent history of the area? Any clue whatsoever about the order of events?

The answer is obviously a resounding NO.
Between 1948 and 1967 Gaza was occupied by Egypt. No Hamas, no rockets. Israel took Gaza from Egypt in 1967, overcoming your non-existent Hamas and their imaginary rockets with ease. It was occupying Gaza until 2005, when it unilaterally withdrew from the territory. Hamas was not in power then, still no rockets were being fired into Israel and no terror tunnels. Your conclusion is utterly wrong, not surprising since it is based on fabricated facts. The only conclusion that any logical person might reach is that the current extreme violence is a result of Israel withdrawing from Gaza (not that I'm suggesting they should have stayed there).

How can you call David Singer a liar when you are so utterly clueless about the background to his article?

AVW

Why did you ignore the state of the reduction of the size of the other Palestinian territories during the same period?

Too difficult to face the genocide being undertaken by the mid eastern religious nutjobs?

Addressing only half of my position was dishonest. But what else would we expect from a bunch of genocidal liars.

inutter:

"Addressing only half of my position was dishonest"

Is there a golden rule on OLO forcing me to address your entire post, or not at all? I note that you did not address ANY of the points in my post. Why didn't you? Isn't that even more dishonest?

I thought I made it quite clear that the claim taking up most of your previous post was not valid because it was based on fantasy, and I backed it up with historical events. So now I'm a liar as well? Could you demonstrate what part of my comment was a lie?

It might work out better for you if you study the background to a topic before commenting, rather than accusing everyone who contradicts you of lying.

Awv
Realisticaly and fortunately my reading unlike yours appears to be broader in scope than the daily propaganda sheets and talking points of the Israel propaganda factory.

imanutter:

You still don't accept the fact that the claims in your post were mostly rubbish. I've provided you with evidence explaining why your claims are rubbish, evidence which you are unable or unwilling to contest, other than saying it's a lie. You even refuse to point out what part of my evidence is not true. Given the fact that my post concerned events that occurred in history, I assume you are disputing those historical events, labelling them as lies originating with "the Israel[i] propaganda factory".

Frankly, I don't think your reading, if you indeed do any of it, extends beyond radical left wing publications producing the usual Israel hating material. You obviously have very little knowledge of this topic as you're unable to justify your claims or counter the facts I provided.

@AVW and IJN: Gentleman, aren't you rather straying from the point? Since at least 1967 Israel has either occupied or controlled Palestinian territory. They have periodically mounted attacks on Gaza of which the current one is merely the latest. Even when they are not attacking Gaza they have maintained a stranglehold on the territory. It has been aptly described as the world's largest open air prison.

In the last 72 hours the Israelis have attacked UN shelters, killing large numbers of civilians. This is merely the latest in a long list of war crimes perpetrated by the Israelis. They do not have, and never have had, a genuine interest in any "peace process" that is other than on their terms. They are a disgrace to humanity.

As Patrick Cockburn recently pointed out in an article in The Independent, they use sophisticated pr techniques to justify the unjustifiable to the world's media. I can understand the slavish acceptance of Israeli crimes by the US. What I find incomprehensible is that Australia in really no better, as evidenced by, most recently, a stunning silence from Abbott and Bishop of the current Israeli offensive against Gaza. Our voting record in the UN is a further indication.

When people like David Singer in effect blame the Gazans for the atrocities perpetrated upon them I feel literally sick at heart. There will never be peace in the region while Israel is permitted to carry on the way it does with an almost complete absence of accountability.