Dear david f,

>>Paul, he was a reactionary influence.<<

I grew up in a world where “reactionary” was everything that was against the official Marx-Leninist line, Americans and West Europeans (except for the “proletariat” and Communists) were all reactionaries. So for me “reactionary” means being against an official ideology, in particular going against “positive” developments in history. These associations of mine are, of course, not your fault.

>>Some opinion of his time was against slavery and for equal rights for women. Some areas actually had equal rights for women. <<

As I said, he was not a revolutionary, and we cannot tell how things would have developed if those opinions and areas became mainstream instead of what followed after the transformation of Christianity from a Jewish sect into what became one of the main religions, albeit still an outgrowth of Judaism, a transformation that Paul substantially contributed to.

Also in my (Stalinist) times people went to church not to hear revolutionary talks (those who needed them got them from Radio Free Europe, mostly jammed by those in power) but to find strength to live the life they had to live. In other times, and under other circumstances, religion, in particular also Christianity, did serve as a vehicle of social change. Paul, for better or worse, did not think these were his circumstances.

>>In some ways his views were against freedom.<<

I would agree had he lived in our times, otherwise I do not know whether his contemporaries understood freedom in the same way that most of us understand today.

As for your comments about the Ode on Love this was for me a rather unusual, analysis of what is, after all a piece of poetry. I take it as your personal, self-revealing and interesting reading and interpretation of the text.
(ctd)

(ctd)

>>1 Corinthians 13 is written beautifully. Perhaps one should be satisfied with the fine prose and not subject it to analysis<<

Here we are in complete agreement. One can “analyse” a peace of poetry, especially if it has become one of the defining text of a culture (see e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_Corinthians_13 ) but not in the same way as one would analyse a scientific text for its verisimilitude or plausibility or what, without taking into account the historical and cultural context.

Dear Banjo,

I agree that I should have written (about not judging medieval events) “in the light of how they (such things) are judged today” instead of “as if they happened today”.

DaVID/quote..<<..I think what Paul means by charity in the above is you must not only do the deed but do it with a certain feeling.>>

YES..to honour god/with their lipS
ISNT THE SAME AS HONOuring good with our heart.

see that IN HEAVEN/HELL THERE ARE NO SECRETS..[as man thINKETH IN HIS HEART..SO HE BE]..there you CANT DO CHARITY[the right thiong..but for the wrong reason/WITHOUT EVERY ONE KNOWING

THE QUARAN ALSO TEACHES THIS WHEN MOSUS WALKS WITH SATAN
http://www.irfi.org/articles/articles_901_950/story_of_moses_and_the_guide.htm

<<..I don't think charity should profit one.>>
yes like those giving alms in the market place have already reachieved their reward

like in looking up the mosus link/my REWARD WAS/THIS LINK[NEW KNOWING]wHO KNEW?
http://www.seventhfam.com/temple/books/black_man/blk55.htm

<<The deed should be sufficient.>.

NO..its like lying when YOUR ORDERING FOOD
your not getting what you really WANT..YOU GET AS YOU chose/order/

<<..If a person sacrifices wealth to feed the poor and even sacrifices life that person has shown charity because, to me, the act is important.>>

BUT NOT IF YOUR Expecting it to buy your WAY INTO HEAVEN
CHARITY MUST BE FROM the heart/not expectation

ie many think dead is dead/should we leave them feigning deATH?
IF WE KNOW THEY WERE LIED TO..OR WAKE THEM"?

ONCE we serve other for love of god or other
THE CREDIT HAS been given/but why is key..[pretender HEAVEN IS YET LOCATED in hell/hell isnt punishment..ITS WHERE Everything is a pretense/done because its seemly or fashionable/that IT BE DONE[YOUR Pleasing yourself not really loving the giving

EVEN TITHE ..CAnt buy..grace
http://biblehub.com/matthew/5-24.htm

<<..Charity is an act that both religious and non-religious people can practice.>>..AND IS ALL Charity good?..IS ALL Charity helping OR HINDERING..is it SETTING UP DEPENDENCE..sorry im not yelling..but the thing is doing the right thing spiritual..isnt the SAME as doing it materially.

whether..IF I GIVE YOU A FISH
OR TEACH YOU HOW TO FISH..

or whether..YOU SEARCH FOR GOD
or need a priest TO LEAD YOU TO WATER UNFIT TO DRINK

in tri-ble society/excreting into water..is a killing offense
but in white fella-way..if you dont poop INTO THE WATER/YOUR THE SAVAGE.

DAVID/quote..<<..Bill Gates and Warren Buffett,.two atheists, are the biggest philanthropists in the USA.>>>

not if their only DOING IT TO TAX AVOID
[AND THEIR CHARITY..IS TAX FREE..[plus even worse/their so called 'AID'..AIMS AT STERILIZING THEM FROM BREEDING[IE THEY USE CHARITY TO STERILIZE DARKIES]..to extinct them..so wE CAN PLUNDER THEIR ESTATES
like they TRIED to do/to..bundy
http://rss.infowars.com/20140414_Mon_Alex.mp3

IMPORTANTLY..IF THEY ARE Cruelly..OR Truly good..i just committed A MORTAL SIN..I MAY WELL HAVE JUDGED ANGELS..but thats not in my heart.[THEY DO IT FOR EXTERNAL CAUSE AND PERSONAL TAX Minimization

I CANT GET INTO HEAVEN/TILL I HEAL MY ERRor with them
[the alter REFUSES THE GIFT HORSE]

<<..CO1 13:5..Doth not behave itself unseemly,
seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;

Here again I differ with Paul. I see nothing wrong in thinking evil.>>

in the next realms/THE THINKING IS THE DOING
[IF YOU THINK IT/YOU JUST DID IT]

<<>.It is wrong to do evil...It is unreasonable to condemn a person for evil thoughts.>>

that's where..ignorance trips one up
without bodies//OUR MOTIVES ARE REVEALED FOR ALL TO SEE
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=lawrence+arabia+after+death
nope
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=after+death+new+birth
closer
http://new-birth.net/books_life_after_death.htm

http://www.divinetruth.com/PDF/People/Other/Jane%20Sherwood%20-%20Post%20Mortem%20Journal.pdf
ok paGES 19

<<I know a woman with a magnificent bosom.>>
AND IN THE NEXT LIFE SHE KNOWS..ITS IN YOUR AURA
REALLY LAWRENCE SAYS IT/SO WELL..THESE BOOKS NEED BY JOINED INTO ONE MORe booK in the trible

<<..I feel no guilt in thinking how it would feel....>>
WHAT..IF..she can read minds/how Will she feel then?

in the next realm..YOU HAVE..VIOLATED her in your heart
[I KNOW WE ARE NONE..WITHOUT SINS]..but lawrence says it so weLL

<<CO1 13:6 Rejoiceth not..in iniquity,..but..rejoiceth in the truth;

I am sure Paul does not mean truth as something subject to verification.>>

why truth must bE CONFIRMED
ITS affirmed by how we lived

if you MIS-believe..a lie/shows up in your aura/
not the lie..but that..you believe..THOSE TRUE..THUS RESIDE WITH THOSE TRUE.

just as lust/doubt..etc all are revealed..in our aura/
my first act.is to believe..everything ANYONE SAYS..is true/
because why..would they...RISK/THEIR SOUL..4/lie...why?..[im noT WORTH LYING..TO]..thus..dive/THEM..THE BELIEF...KNOWING/the lie cant hurt me.

<<..CO1 13:11..When I was a child>>.../sinner/THIEF/SCUM
<<....I spake..as a child,sinner/thief/scum
<<>.I understood as a child,..etc etc

<<>>I thought as a child:[PROJECTED/like a child]..but when I became a man,..I put away childish things.

I like the above.>>

me too

<<..Being a man to me includes accepting that other people may disagree with you on things you feel important and still treating them with consideration and not harassing them with your unwanted opinions.>>

ahhmEN

continued

CO1 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity,
*these three*;..but the greatest of these is charity.>>

because they neeD TO BE DONE
FOR THE RIGHT REASON..[OF THE THREE]
higher than charity is grace mercy love of other

<<.In the above I partially agree with Paul.>>ME TOO

BANJO/QUOTE..<<>.This does not necessarily mean,..as you suggest, “as if they happened today”..but, rather,”..in the light of how they are judged today”.>>

OR MAYBE HOW THEY will be judged tomorrow?

<<..Their true significance and importance, can only be appreciated when placed in “historical perspective”, in time.>>

NOTHING IS that clear/we have eternity to Finnish ALL we began here

<<..The storming of the Bastille..It was not until 1880, almost a century later, that it was officially recognized>>

recognized or subverted into..<<>.<<..the symbol of the French revolution.>>

<<This was not because it was seen “as if it happened in 1880” but, rather, “in the light of how it was judged in 1880”.>>

IN HINDSIGHT NO ONE GETs blamed for the WAY WE LIVED
WE TURN..OUR FAILINGS as motivations..INTO ever greater/GLORIES
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=6040&page=0

Notice in Ohio, USA ,that Muslim cab drivers are refusing to carry Gay people in their cabs, also Brunei has brought in stoning to death of Gay personnel as of now, Religion is the scourge of the whole world,always has been and always will be. Selective good readings from the so called Bible which spews from the mouths of the clergy should be abolished and more of the corrupt readings should be told to the gullible and stupid public, lets have so called truths, good and bad from this book instead of sugar coated bullxxxx.