For some time, Timmy, I've been noticing your tactic of listing "killer points" (eg "You are a handbag", with increasing irritation and contempt, and now feel compelled to pick you up on it. You add nothing to rational discussion by this. I assume your intention is to annoy other forum participants so much they give up and let you "win", but you add nothing to constructive discussion. It takes me back to the schoolyard, which you've clearly never left. Let's talk again when your emotional age is roughly voting age. Oh, and sorry: I'm male.

Hi again,
Revisiting my point on why embryos are human just as we are...

1) They are an organism with human DNA
2) They are self-moving (meaning that they are alive)

PS. I realise I left out "organism" before, so the confusion about sperms is understandable. However, with the revision, this confusion is removed (as a sperm is not an organism).

Enaj,
The 1973 Roe vs Wade case was important regards abortion legislation in the US, (and indirectly other countries), but “Jane Roe”, (the lead plaintiff), was actually a pseudonym being used by a “Norma McCorvey”, who has since became an ardent anti-abortion campaigner.

Eg :-
Once an abortion-rights supporter, the 50-year-old McCorvey has switched sides: She's now a vocal anti-abortion activist. She has started a ministry called Roe No More to fight against abortion rights with the aim of creating a mobile counseling center for pregnant women in Dallas.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/1998/roe.wade/stories/roe.profile/

The idea that crime in the US has dropped because of abortion, I’m rather sceptical about, as I think it would be difficult to tell exactly what the crime rate is in the US. There are now more people in jail in the US than in any other country in the world, (although this does seem to be for racial and gender reasons, and also those jails have become like slave labour camps for industry. See http://www.prisonsucks.com/ and http://www.granma.cu/ingles/2005/octubre/juev13/42carceles.html)

However it does not overcome the fact that contraception or adoption could have been used instead abortion. Also abortion in the US is a very big industry, and with so many people and so much money involved, many would obviously have a desire to maintain that industry functioning as it is.

Veryself,
You use killer points.
You have irritation and contempt.
You add nothing to rational discussion.
You add nothing to constructive discussion.
You have clearly never left the school yard.
Your emotional age is roughly voting age.
You are a male.

About 99% of your post had nothing to do with the topic, just maligning another poster. Report the comments you made about the poster called “Timkins” to the forum moderator. In the mean time, if you make such comments about someone, they can equally make them about you.

Jose,
I would agree embryo's are human, but that does not lead me to oppose a woman's right to choose to terminate her pregnancy.
I guess I see the whole dilemma fairly simply. Once a baby is born its life is to be protected as vigilantly as any other life. Prior to the baby being born, its right to life must be weighed against the rights of its mother. And, I prefer to have that decision made by the woman whose life will be most affected by either abortion or birth, than to allow others to make that decision for her.
As I have pointed out before, but no-one takes it up, society already responds to babies like this. I have had a miscarriage and a baby who very nearly died at 13 days. The response of the world to my miscarriage was mild, at best, most people were sorry, but saw it as just one of those things. When my daughter was at deaths door as a newborn, the world rallied round. Everyone saw it for what it was; a devastating event. My own emotional response to the two events was similar. I grieved over my miscarriage, but the impact was nothing like the fear and dread I experienced wondering whether my newborn would live or die.

enaj,
We agree that embryos are human.
You spoke about a woman's right to terminate a pregnancy. The reason I oppose abortion is because I see it as infanticide.
I do not oppose a woman's right to terminate a pregnancy, because I believe that that right does not exist.

Some may argue the classic, "That's just your opinion" approach, but it is important to realise that opinions are irrelevant because it is substantive (there are no grey areas).
This means that my opinion is either right or wrong- not in between.
The reason I believe it is right is because the criminal act murder encompasses the terminating of the life of any human being. If we agree on the fact that embryos are human then we disagree on my statement that the criminal act murder encompasses the terminating of the life of any human being.

Jose
You have obviously convinced yourself that you are right and women dont have rights to terminate an unwanted pregnancy. You wont convince many who are not blinded by religious zeal and the rest of the Ratbag Right.
You dont seem to understand that in this enlightened age, people actually have sex for pleasure and largely due to the obfuscation of the fanatical pro-lifers, safe contraception and morning after preparations are being witheld from women who do not wish to conceive and then go through the termination process. It is time for you to get off your circular argument of the moment when an egg becomes a life and take up an active role in stopping world poverty and war...Get a life Jose