Leslie,

The reading this thread has encouraged me to do has enlightened me to the role that diesel powered subs have. Comparing diesel and nuclear is like comparing destroyers and aircraft carriers. Both have differing roles and capabilities.

Diesel subs are typically much smaller, about 1/6th of the cost and very effective in protecting specific assets where they can ambush targets. Whilst Nukes are faster and carry a much higher range of weapons and can be used to seek out and destroy targets and flee faster than any surface bound ship.

The question is then: Why on earth are we going to build these diesel subs ourselves when we can buy them at a fraction of the cost. If we can lease Nukes of the advanced Virginia class cheaper than building the diesels then there is something very wrong.

Yes SM something is very wrong, when we can't build a little sub for the price of a large one. It is the same problem that makes all our construction costs double that of the US. It even adds to the crazy price of our housing.

Mostly it's Oz unions, but the hand out mentality that has become standard in South Oz had something to do with it.

I was having tourist boats, & other large equipment built by NQEA in Cairns, when they won the contract to build patrol boats for the navy.

They had to increase their work force, & that involved importing some heavily unionised labor from our deep south.

These unionists then forced all sorts of crazy conditions on the company, with union management inspired strikes. Penalty clauses in the contract forced the company to give in to effective blackmail.

Old hands that came to do warranty work would complain about all the strikes. They reckoned it would cost them thousands in lost wages, during a strike, for a $5 a week pay rise.

Some conditions such as the 9 day fortnight made it impossible for us to do business with the company. It just took too long to get an answer from them on anything. We did not have the luxury of waiting 4 or 5 days for a day when all the different experts were actually at work.

Continued

When the contract was finished the company announced the withdrawal of all the crazy new conditions, They had to, or go out of business. The inefficiencies were just too great for a business to survive in the north Queensland environment.

The ensuing strike & picket line lasted weeks, but slowly the deep south infection bleed away, & sanity, with the local work force returned.

From our point of view multi tasking returned. One expert would be sent to sort out any problem, rather than the 5 or 6 we would get during the union control period. The people we got were much happier too.

The company had learnt their lesson. No more defence contracts were sort. One experience of how business is done in the deep south was enough for them.