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The Forum > Article Comments > The gay marriage debate > Comments

The gay marriage debate : Comments

By Ken Davis, published 30/7/2012

My chief concern is that when anyone expresses a contrary view, whether it is on religious, or like our PM - sociocultural grounds - they are abused and labelled as homophobic and intolerant.

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Dear Wearestardust,

<<@ yuyutsu: actually, marriage is a legal relationship governed by Federal law.>>

Then let them kiss my arse: I have plans to marry sometime in the future and when I do, I am not going to tell those bastards in the government - a religious sacrament and that's it, to which I will invite my friends and family, but not those tyrants from Canberra. I am then going to answer gayly, whenever asked, that I am married - I am going to relate with those I love however I want, and I am going to use that 'M'-word openly before others and before God - I need no permission from anyone, how less so from this stupid and evil government who count for nothing.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Monday, 30 July 2012 7:07:20 PM
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Jay-of-Melbourne your questions are essentially silly. You might deduce facts from ill-informed impressions of people you are clueless about but as a gay man I wouldn't pretend to know the future ideas of the communities I belong to despite my 23 years of gay liberation. And I use the word communities purposely because we are multiple communities with just sexuality and persecution as a common core. Gay men include the broadest diversity of heterosexual men as well as what straight men are too chicken to do or admit to. I think many gay men make the mistake that their social circle is The Community. In science and social research we refer to men who have sex with men (MSM) because 'gay' does not included everyone. Relatively few hold what you call bourgeois values. Not many of us are good at arranging flowers. You should know that just as many of the working class are not heterosexual as in other 'classes'.

So I wouldn't dare guess how lesbians, bisexual people, transgender, intersex and other sexually and gender diverse people are going to want to reduce stigma and discrimination against them. But one reliable guess is for everyone else to understand what is the natural diversity of biological sex, gender and sexuality - and the differences between them. We want people to understand marriage equality is far more than same-sex marriage.

We will be near parity when no 12 year old is afraid to express their emotions. Youth suicide will have dropped to near zero by then.
Posted by Eric G, Monday, 30 July 2012 8:21:28 PM
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Wait a minute? 12 year olds? Oh dear! nothing to see here, move along, despite it's obsession with youth the sexual Liberation of children isn't on the "Gay" menu is it?
So there's my answer, I guess, the next phase of the Gay struggle is lowering the age of consent to 12.
And youth suicide? how long can you hold that gun to our heads without someone pointing to a causal link between homosexuality and premature death?
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Monday, 30 July 2012 8:37:34 PM
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Kipp,

You say >"Love ... never harmed anyone"<, but even that's not true - as some suffer being harassed or stalked (or worse) by former partners or would-be lovers - and bad (or spoiled) marriages, relationships and unions harm many. 'Love' is a much ill-used, abused and misconstrued emotion. And, emotion it is, supposedly encompassing genuine bonds of caring, affection and responsibility - but all too often many neglect, misuse or outright abuse the 'responsibility' aspect.

"Love" has also been used as an excuse for 'crimes of passion' and even, in the case of Anders Behring Breivik (in the form of love of country, culture and ethnicity), as an 'excuse' to kill a great many people.

I don't have anything against true love, but I abhor the deceitful way some, or many, pay lip service to this emotion and/or take advantage of the needs of others for 'love' and to be needed and truly valued. Unfortunately our society is far from perfect, and there is a great deal of bad example going on out there which needs to be actively discouraged. I don't see the adoption of 'gay marriage' contributing in any meaningful way to the correction needed to our societal 'malaise', but rather that it can only exacerbate the already unsavoury deterioration evident in this noble and honourable estate.

Gays do deserve to have their rights respected, and much has rightly been done to ensure this with the recognition of 'unions' in law. However, a union does not a marriage make, and does not and can not represent the foundational fabric of ours, or any other, constructive, responsible and accountable society.

I accept that homosexuality, bi-sexuality and transvestism are most often a biological imperative, but I would submit that such represent exceptions to the mass-majority biological model and imperative, and logic would dictate that the exception should not make the rule.

Overall societal stability and harmony relies heavily on genuine 'marriage', and this should be a sufficient imperative to warrant its retention unencumbered by re-scripting for no genuinely worthwhile or constructive purpose.
Posted by Saltpetre, Monday, 30 July 2012 8:43:08 PM
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@Runner "He has kept his marriage vowels and been a good father (horrors!)."

I'd have thought one of the prerequisites for being a "good father" was actually knowing how many children you have!

Remember that time when Tony believed Daniel O'Connor was his bastard lovechild... and then he wasn't?!

3 children? 4 children? More? Who can say? Not Tony!

I dunno, most people I know can actually keep track of their families.

Later! ;-)
Posted by Jimmy Jones, Monday, 30 July 2012 9:50:36 PM
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I dunno, most people I know can actually keep track of their families.
Jimmy Jones,
How sure are you about your real father ? How sure are you that you don't have other siblings out there ? Your remarks about Tony Abbott are about as pointless & stupid & unfair as they can be.
Posted by individual, Monday, 30 July 2012 10:07:03 PM
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