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The Forum > Article Comments > Papandreou to the EU: let my people vote > Comments

Papandreou to the EU: let my people vote : Comments

By Jonathan J. Ariel, published 4/11/2011

Given the scale of change required of the Greek people, any deal needs the seal of public approval.

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Given the economic devastation of a default to Greece, that this author is proposing rejecting the bail out package and an exit from the euro shows a profound misunderstanding of the consequences.

While I agree that Greece should never have been allowed into the Euro, an exit now would bring Greece to 3rd world status.
Posted by Shadow Minister, Friday, 4 November 2011 8:40:22 AM
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One of the problems with articles like this, is that they are really easy to write. Take a complex problem - say, the GFC - and boil it down to some simple sound-bites that will sound really good when regurgitated to your mates in the pub. The really difficult stuff - what the alternatives might be, what level of politics is at play both in Athens and in Brussels, what does "democracy" mean in situations like this - all get swept away in a bunch of simplistic generalities.

It is a classic illustration of the complete dumbing-down of our news media, the price we pay for condoning news-as-entertainment for so many years, and exacerbated by the mindlessness of our new tweet-and-retweet mentality.

This is only superficially about "democracy". It's about complex political manouevering in a highly volatile environment.

Questions that would shed light on the situation are ignored. Why did Papandreou not advise Sarkozy and Merkel of the need for a referendum during the negotiations? Did he only consider "democracy" as an afterthought? Is this simply a way to leave the Eurozone with "honour", leaving behind only a long tail of broken promises and worthless financial instruments?

The likelihood of full default on Greek bonds is now back on the cards. With it, comes the inevitable ejection from the Community, and increased hardship for the people of Spain, Portugal, Italy and Ireland, to name but four, who will be forced into even greater belt-tightening exercises than they already face.

Nevertheless, you have to give the guy points for his negotiating tactics. If he forces an even "better" deal for his citizens out of SarkoMerkel, he will be a hero to his people for a short while. Until they realize that after all the bluster, the underlying problems haven't changed: the country is a financial basket-case, and has only been part of the Community for as long as it pretends otherwise to itself.

It will all end in tears, that much we know.
Posted by Pericles, Friday, 4 November 2011 9:26:56 AM
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Looks like the referendum is off the table, at least.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15586673

Does that mean that "democracy" wins, or loses...?
Posted by Pericles, Friday, 4 November 2011 10:24:19 AM
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Apart from the typical 'blame every European crisis all on allegedly generous EU welfare states', not pollies corrupted by Goldman Sachs backroom deals posing as European bond markets, this essay fails to acknowledge the real dilemma a referendum poses for the Greek people.

Opinion polls show that 54% of Greeks oppose the bailout but 70% want to remain in the EU. On this basis, the referendum will no doubt overrule everything the demonstrations have stood for. If it comes off, Papandreou will have played a brilliant hand and maybe keep his job.
Posted by Killarney, Friday, 4 November 2011 11:04:47 AM
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Ah yes - a nice conspiracy theory. It's all the fault of those evil bankers. Not the failure of Greece to construct anything remotely resembling a civil society since its independence from Turkey 180 years ago. Not the fault of the Greece that has defaulted several times before on debt obligations and was kicked out of the Latin Monetary Union for lying about the gold content of its coins. Not rhe fault of Greeks who openly admit refusing to pay taxes thus compromising the national budget. Not the fault of government after government which increased the Greek public service and improved pension entitlements, most of it on borrowed money,knowing there was no hope of repaying the loans. No, easier to blame Goldman Sachs.

I was actually in favour of Papandreou's referendum proposal because it offered a chance for Greek citizens to understand finally the situation they're in and perhaps resolve collectively to do something about it. They could even take the radical first step of paying their taxes.
Posted by Senior Victorian, Friday, 4 November 2011 12:00:08 PM
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Shadow Minister: there seems to be some misunderstanding.

I am not in favour of Greece rejecting the bailout per se.

I am all for a referendum where the Greek people will be made very aware of the troubles their republic is in and are given the facts so as to fully appreciate the consequences of voting yes or voting no.

Senior Victorian: as to the comment on Greece previously defaulting on its debts. Yes I agree. It's almost a tradition.
Posted by Jonathan J. Ariel, Friday, 4 November 2011 12:20:53 PM
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