I would like as an allowable response to any question a census-taker may ask:

"I consider this question none of the government's business."

I feel the government has the right to make head count and to ask any questions they will. However, I feel nobody has any obligation to answer those questions.

Great article by Dr. Andrew Leigh. The 2011 Census has generated a lot of interest, debate and volunteering in the Australian Macedonian community especially our youth who have used social media to engage and assist the elderly to complete the Census. The Macedonian community sees the Census as a historic opportunity to accurately register their identity through their place of birth, their Macedonian language, ancestry and Macedonian Orthodox religion.

The 1996 Australian Census was the first time in which Macedonians living in Australia were identified statistically as a separate ethnic group. The number of Macedonians in Australia is on a constant increase thanks to the way in which the Census is structured. The Australian Census could serve as a model for EU member states such as Bulgaria and Greece who do not recognise the ethnic Macedonians in their census statistics. It is sad but true, that Macedonians in those two countries are still denied basic human rights. Australia has a moral responsibility to assist the Hellenic Republic and Bulgaria to abandon futile and repressive policies and stop the de-legitimisation of Macedonians and the Republic of Macedonia. This is something that Dr. Andrew Leigh can take up with PM Gillard and Australia's foreign minister.

i was going to avoid any comment upon census

in the main under the theory..of ignor others insanity

""A constituent emailed me recently to point out that elections are virtually never decided by a single vote, but every additional person who answers the census brings resources to the area.""

plus i hate the qld govt loading us with odious debt to bailout mining and frakking gas mates..and them building up 70 billion in public debt building stadiums for mates..etc

and dont regard myself as a queen-slander
and want qld revealed as the vile it really is

""She argued that it was more important
to fill out the census form than to vote..""

i boycotted voting once i realised there is no true choice
we elect only sponcers/mates eith way we vote for
two party is treason

naturally..you as a person..say..""(a conclusion I could not possibly endorse,since I encourage everyone to participate in both activities).""

and you yes..as a person
a dead corperate ward of the state
are the 'person'..who's details must go onto the form
as demanded..because you begged govt to be a 'person'/under the act

ie under the birth's act..because
you begged to be 'regesterd''..as shattles are

a person..under the marrage act
cause you appLIEd/begged..to fall *under the marrage act

and even you the driver..'person' driving for income
ubnder the 'transport act'

anyhow in the end i didnt want to make an issue about it
as i got no income..[nor wage]..they ARNT the same..!

income is money earned by no value ADDING
and wage is being paid to 'drive[transport]..for money
without getting a share of the spiol's..[ie a wage]

anyhow i added in all the 'persons'
ie 'persons..under the act'
that i hold trust over

and i used the right colours pen
ie black means dead[ie a corperation]
blue means sick[a ward of the state/a person under the act

i didnt use capital/letters
[cause all caps means the 'person'..is a dead corperation]

and nouns*..[naming things]..
only have one capital letter

and i didnt sign in the box
because..by law anything..[in the box]..is invisable

besides..i DONT SIGN UNILATERAL CON-tracts

that will be used to sustain the lie of 'person' hood

all caps..[as mandated]..indicates a dead corperate persons details are required
under threat by force of law...is a lie created by ignorant tools of fools

anyhow the birth person cretification..[flesh/blood chattle]
is wrote in red...[not in caps]..

the licence person..in black[in capitals

and me...[excluding family name as sovereign truste..over the 'other persons'..was in bold purple..]..in lower case cause thats what i am

i can only be
what I chose to be
and thats not one who takes orders lightly

you want the person detail
you get the persons detail
if you dont know what a person 'is'
well i do

my job was done
now can we talk about me not signing in ya box

[on demand/with menaces?]
stuff you..audit real criminals

lets audit EVERYONE..fully..
declare into a dooms day census
definitivly what YOU own...

not the family trust
or other dead corperate person
you hold share on/over..[ie a dead zombie
only made living by lie and ignorance..by ommision

only living can 'own'[things]
only the living..can be 'injured'
let the dead tend the dead..the dead feel no pain

im hurting having to explain
that plainly wrong..in this patent blatent fraud

but govts too busy cross checking what you wrote
and prophiling your wage..[ignoring THEIR mates income]
and their family trust funds..safe in the corperate limited liability

[cause they are DEAD
but the brain dead following orders..
how well did that work for you in neuremberg?

well their simply brain dead
see ya in court]

I have to say that I was pretty unimpressed with the whole process. It's an anachronism.

Outside the basic data, I felt that I was simply being asked questions for their own sake. What on earth was the point of asking about internet access, for example. What possible policy initiative - or policy modification - could result from that? Anyway, I'm sure there are many more reliable ways to find out - the telcos and ISPs, for example.

And this line from Mr Leigh's article made me chuckle.

"Better yet, if you tick the box to allow your information to be revealed in 99 years, you might even help your descendents with their genealogical explorations."

Given the massive amount of information about every one of us, that is swilling around the thousands of commercial databases every day, I can't see the piddling few lines contained in the census being of any additional value whatsoever. And who is to say that in 98 years time, the government of the day might not decide unilaterally to declare the information "in the public interest", and release the lot?

They might decide to do it anyway.

Next Tuesday.

Who would know?

What would the importance of taking a snapshot of Australian society every few years?

There are the obvious advantages of knowing about population statistics to help in planning for hospitals, schools and other infrastructure. Information about income might assist in planning for community services. Why ask about ethnicity? Unless it helps in assisting in ensuring relevant services for various ethnic groups where there might be special needs eg. translation services, refugees, those who have experienced torture (though the census does not ask those questions).

I am not sure I see the relevance in asking about religion. That information might be more useful to a religious organisation in planning for future building projects... but governments. Any thoughts?

Re the census, I have no issues with it, given the salary, place of work etc is already in the hands of the ATO, if you pay taxes that is. Education is also a matter of public record and as for religion, say what you want or say nothing, I found nothing obtrusive.

Macedonian advocacy: >> Bulgaria and Greece who do not recognise the ethnic Macedonians in their census statistics. This is something that Dr. Andrew Leigh can take up with PM Gillard and Australia's foreign minister.Posted by Macedonian advocacy,<<

Macad, I am not being combative.

Why should Australia take up the internal issues of two other nations that are not humanitarian issues of them self but identity issues primarily to attain status as a lobby group. Perhaps the Greeks and Bulgars want a society that melds rather than a fifth column holding an old identity into further generations.

Why as a resident and perhaps a citizen of Australia do you take up an "identity" campaign outside Australia, the Macedonians want a say in Bulgaria or Greece perhaps and you are their agent here. If you feel so strongly fly over and protest directly, I don't give a tinkers cuss if the Macos are or are not on the Greek and Bulgars census. My advice is to not be a measurable minority, ask a Jew or Jewess if they are comfortable stating they are Jews on a census form or other public document, from experience these folks know that anonymity is best in the long run.

OUG, don't worry about it, I get your shorthand, message gets across, I don't read it like a novel rather like a news bite.

OUG, I posted the last one in the wrong thread I think, it was in response to another poster having a shot at your punctuation...anyway.

UOG - I have one question, and I imagine I am not the only one wondering.

My question is, "huh?"

yes i noticed the same comments
so many times sog...i tried and grayham got tricked into thinking i was trying to short circit the word count[when someone couldnt rebut what im saying..so complained..[and im over getting banned]

so post
the way i post
trying to be as clear as i can
without self incrimating my self..too much

which answers the other questioner

anyhow i wont destract the topic more
explaining things that are self evident in my words
[to those willing to take the time to let the words speak]

and them others
well let them self incriminate..all they like
cause thats what the census has wrote upon it...self confessions
UNDER OATH..and if you lied...well thats an other charge

word *you
used genericly

make sure you get a reciept from the 'collecter'
[who in not cross checking the voter rolls..allows the courts to be too trickey..and the jury process the be corrupted]..[dead voters voting..is more than one fraud]..[just one more fraud]

there is no excuse
for govt agents going bad
but verifies the lies inherant in any system

OMG you do crap on UNG. Can't understand a word you said. Has anyone ever told you that?
I think the Census has missed a great opportunity.
Just what is Australias' make up. In just what direction do ordinary Australians want Australia to go. How ordinary Australians feel about issues affecting Australian values.
Just a short list of things that should have been asked on the Census form;
1. Illegal immigrants. What to do with them.
2. Abortion.
3. Chemical additives in food.
4. GM food crops.
5. Gay marriage.
6. Guns.
7. NBN.
8. Legal age.
9. Standard adult age.
10. Multiculturism.
11. Foreign Aid.
12. Politition must tell the the unadulterated non-PC truth.
13. Polititions must declare all forms of bri. sorry, (donation.)
No matter how small & from whom & the purpose.
14. Standard Superanuation for all Australians.
15. Standard medical & Dental care for Australians.
I can't see this ever happening. If that result is actually down in numbers it might force Political Parties to radically change their thinking.
There's a few more that I'd like to see on that list, but that's enough for now.

I suppose that because I've relied so much in the past
both as a student and in my profession on
the information and data supplied by the Australian Bureau
of Statistics that I simply don't question the validity of
the Census. I've always assumed that an accurate Census
count will help people get the services they need.

Things like education, health services et cetera are all
planned using Census information - so there is a need
for everyone in their households to be counted. As for
religion? Perhaps that is related to the funding that goes
into supporting Churches and Schools in the area.

Either way I can't see why anyone would object as the
information is completely private and protected by law.

Jayb, much as all it would be a great idea, they could never do that.

Some other party, & the media, on a slow day, would get all that information, & flay the government alive with the proof that it is going against the peoples desires.

As it is ministers can claim they are doing what the people want, & some people actually believe them.

planning for future building projects... but governments. Any thoughts?
pelican,
hopefully soon we'll get a reasonable Government again which can make use of the revelations from the survey. The survey exposes many shortfalls & a more sensible Government will do more sensible thing & in turn people will become more sensible for some time until we're outnumbered again by the insensible. And so the wheel turns.

lexie might find census stats great
but the thing is a 7 year snapshot soon gets out of date

[recall big australia?...
all them 'boat people..that have added millions
to the 'stats'..in the last 7 years]

a yearly senseus
with our taxreturns
might make more sense..in todays instant info market

the facts are out of date mate
basing action on them..is putting faith on footings laid on sand
they get more wrong every year...

[people lie..
go figure eh]

make everyone declare their full asset value
[how much do you own..
not your income..[with mugs thinking income is wage]

the census is full of info
supplied by ignorants and self intrest

lets really get to the root of the issue
based on facts.,.not what people write at night by candel light
rehhed up in thin blankets while the rich sceme their latest tax grab

taxing hot air ans steam

Lexi wrote: "Either way I can't see why anyone would object as the
information is completely private and protected by law".

Private? It has the filler-inner's name on it - the collector can read it to his/her heart's content (especially if she's a nosy neighbour), show it to her friends and family, take photo-copies if she really wants.

"Protected by law"! Like CSA files? Like ATO files? Police files? All of which are regularly illegally accessed. We are protected by law from theft and a myriad of other crimes - anyone who has not been a victim despite being "protected by law"?

The fact remains that if people want to access our
information they can do it via electoral roles,
banks, insurance companies, local councils,
service providers, postal services, credit companies,
Medicare, hospital records, and the list goes on.

cont'd ...

An accurate Census count will help people
get the services they need. Sporting facilities,
education, health services are all planned
using Census information so we need everyone
in their households counted.

"electoral roles,banks, insurance companies, local councils,
service providers, postal services, credit companies,
Medicare, hospital records, and the list goes on".

Those sources do not have the information asked for in the census; if they did there would not be a need for a census.

The census collectors would have a great deal of trouble accessing the sources you list. The only way to ensure Ms/Mr Nosy Parker does not access one's private information is to not fill in the form.

The fact that truly does remain is the claim the census is "completely private and protected by law" is nonsense - the type of spin I'd expect from a politician or a bureaucrat.

Dear L.B. Loveday,

It actually isn't spin as you seem to think.

You should Google the ABS - Census 2011
- privacy and confidentiality section.

The facts are as follows:

1) The Census & Statistics Act (1905) guarantees
privacy and confidentiality and legally binds
all ABS staff (including temporary employees
working during the Census) never to release
personal information to any individual or organisation
outside of the ABS.

2) The Act provides heavy penalties (fines up to
$13,200 or imprisonment for 2 years or both) for
anybody breaching this obligation even if they're no
longer employed by the ABS.

BTW: The ABS destroys all name-identified Census
information after statistical processing has been completed.
The information you provide to the ABS remains confidential to
the ABS. No information is released in a way that would
enable users of the Census data to identify any particular
individual or household.

Organisations and government departments and direct
marketing companies cannot have access to personal
information from the Census.

Those are the facts. However, what you choose to believe Sir,
is out of my hands. I'm simply providing you with the facts.

The Census & Statistics Act (1905) guarantees.
Lexi,
there flies another herd of pink elephants.

"You should Google the ABS - Census 2011 - privacy and confidentiality section".

I have a hard copy of the relevant legislation, so why you suggest I SHOULD Google is beyond me.

I defer to Individual - "there flies another herd of pink elephants".

My form has just been collected from under the door mat where it has been since being placed there 2+ weeks ago. My privacy has been maintained!

Gentlemen:

Hats off to your wisdom.

BTW: I prefer donkeys to elephants.