[Deleted for abuse]

Bugsy, that may be the stance of many people who call themselves "Catholic", but it is not a stance supported by the Catholic Church. Lumen Gentium - one of the more enlightened offerings of the Catholic Church in recent history, in my opinion - acknowledges that many live according to Gospel values without knowing the Gospel (http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html). This document asserts that these people are also worthy of salvation - in short, their lack of religion (or following of other religions) does not prohibit them from entering heaven. Articles 15 and 16 deal with this.

Obviously, there are many who have no interest in entering heaven, often because heaven is not part of their belief system. The Catholic Church does not expect them to change this, but still holds the belief that the gates of heaven are open to these people. The key is to lead a good life - not necessarily to be explicitly and devoutly Catholic.

I consider this document to be enlightened because, despite including lengthy Bible extracts and theological analyses, it acknowledges two important things:

1) Belief in God alone is not enough for salvation. Salvation comes to those who lead good lives.

2) Atheism alone is not enough for damnation. Damnation comes to those who unrepentantly lead bad lives.

While we can debate the extent to which a Catholic life is a "good" life, surely we agree that encouragement to live properly rather than simply going to Church each Sunday is a good thing?

By the way, askegg, I, like you, am fully supportive of secular education. Certainly not to the extent that religious education should be banned, but I believe that it is proper for state schools to be entirely secular.

Oh, good for them. What a progressive organisation.

I didn't realise they were so 'new age'.

Atheists in heaven?
Awesome.

Nice, Bugsy. Rather than finding fault with anything that is said, you ridicule those who say it. In your own words, I guess there's no pleasing some people.

Oh I'm sorry, do you feel ridiculed?

Oh dear.

No, Bugsy. I don't feel ridiculed. If ridiculing me was your intention, you failed dismally. A more successful approach would be to highlight the flaws in what I have said.

As a matter of fact, if ridiculing me was your intention, it raises serious questions about your capacity for intelligent and mature discussion.