Irfan Yusuf makes the effort to respond when it suits him - e.g. his latest crack about brain cells. However, like all Muslims, he is unable to rebut any criticsm or questioning of some of his statements.

With Muslim terrorists, we know where we stand. With so-called moderate Muslims, we will never know. Where is the real danger?

>>Where is the real danger?<<

The real danger, Leigh, is giving the right to kill to anyone who views others as suspicious based purely upon their appearance and whether it is 'ordinary' or not.

For a satirical take on our new anti-terrorism laws check out Danny Katz's article

"Once upon a tram ride"

The Taliban was on the tram, and al-Qaeda was on the tram, and Chechen rebel separatists were on the tram — a whole bunch of terrorists were riding on the tram, and I was sitting among them, all of us heading down St Kilda Road, on the 67 from Carnegie. Sure, they didn’t actually look like terrorists, but terrorists can be tricky like that. The Taliban guy looked more like an ordinary businessman, standing up the back, picking his ear with a house key. And the al-Qaeda operative looked just like an old guy with a cane, sitting next to the door, wearing his toupee on back-to-front....

the remainder is at:http://www.theage.com.au/news/danny-katz/once-upon-a-tram-ride/2005/10/19/1129401316510.html

As Irfan clearly and succinctly stated, what happened in London can happen here too with the introduction of the new laws. If anyone believes that terrorism can be fought by the shooting of innocents, then they are indeed short of a few brain cells.

Leigh, I realize from our other interactions with you that it’s pointless trying to teach an old dog new ways of thinking about racism. But I'll try again.

It seems that in your little world of paranoid conspiracies and urban mythologies I don't look like an ordinary Australian. But because I’m indigenous I’m not an ordinary Australian. I doubt if you could tell the difference between Koreans and Chinese let alone Aborigines and Torres Strait Islanders but in your little world you and only you have these wonderful powers of observation. How clever are - you foxy lady !

Do yourself a favour and read some research on racial profiling and the law. Amnesty international published a report on these sociological phenomena last year: Follow this link - http://www.amnestyusa.org/racial_profiling/index.do

You also assert that IY and company are ‘deliberately vague and provide no truth in their claim that ordinary Australians are at risk of being detained.’

Irfan was making the point that ordinary Australians WILL become targets as a result of these new laws. Yes, this means people like me and other people of color and people like you too - who might be friendly with non-Anglo peoples. (I’m assuming you do know someone like this?) will become targets for investigation and detention without any regard for our civil and political rights.

By the way, just in case you didn’t know, Kath and Kim is satirical comedy show, Nieghbours is a soap - both are not serial documentaries about ‘ordinary Australians’ in the urbs

The anti terror laws are nothing for law abiding muslims to worry about

It's when the welfare system is finally overhauled. Then they'll have problems.

Terrorism 101:

In order to defeat a liberal democracy, or to cause a liberal democracy to stop acting in a rational and liberal way the following steps are useful.

1. In order to be successful with any terror campaign you must carry out sufficient attacks so that the population will become fearful. These attacks need not be more life threatening than the normal road toll, or even the number of people who die from bee stings or peanut allegies.

2. The fearful people will want security, and will accept the government taking action to restrict civil liberties.

3. The insurgent group should continue attacks, just enough to cause outrage.

4. The government will start acting harshly against those who are suspected of supporting the insurgency.

5. This will provide a propaganda victory for the insurgents, and will drive more people to their cause.

6. Attacks will continue, the government can only react more harshly, detention, concentration camps, arbitrary arrest will follow.

7. More people will oppose the government, the insurgency will grow, not weaken.

8. The government will be seen to have ceased being that of a liberal democracy and its legitimacy will be under question both domestically and internationally.

9. Liberal democracy will be shown to have failed.

10. Insurgency / terror activities will have achieved their goal.

Alternatives: Address possible grievances within the liberal democratic framework. Establish contact with dissaffected groups. Use pre-existing criminal intelligence tools to identify those who are actually plotting crimes. This will be assisted when the marginalised group is brought into a more trusting relationship with the rest of the community, leading to better intelligence and members of that community informing on offender.

Our current laws are sufficient, anything else is just accomodating those responsible for terrorism. Racist activities or comments about a group will be used to justify anti-community activites.

Perhaps it is only a coincidence that the bombers of Bali and the towers were Muslim.
The bombers did not discriminate, they included all in their vicious killings.
Maybe it is 'racist' to nominate them as "Muslims" but the facts are they were .
Australians have been targetted, Australians have been slain as the holidayed and if muslims take offence because we call a spade a spade, so be it.
When the so called moderate muslims call a jihad on their murdering brethren, we will be right behind them.
But we must be sure they are being dinkum.