Mr Garrit,
I am afraid of your confidence in our Justice system; we would have a greater chance of seeing pigs fly in battle before our Justice system does any justice, surly that is Orwellian.
The execution of your relatives in Germany is an interesting perspective on this matter. If you are not familiar with my arch enemy Karl Marx and associates, read some of his work. i.e., publications to news papers, and letters to family and friends. You would be forgiven in most cases, if you cover the date and the signature that the hatred of Jews, etc you would be forgiven if you thought it was Hitler, OOO no, the Jewish question apart from Islam, was the bastard child of the one and only Marx. So do not draw a simplistic conclusion on that matter that is a source and where Hitler drew his Inspiration and his Ideas, Mussolini was the bastard child of Fascism, or Modern day Leftism to day.
We are not dealing with civilized minds when we refer to the Islamic Murderous barbarians, Terrorism is almost a term of endearment, and I would agree with you if the Bill was referring to Australia 30 years ago, realize before that, and way back Cultural Marxism was not on the agenda when they were making this country what it was up until 20 years ago, That killed us, and that’s killed European or the Anglo sphere. Be assured, it is all down hill from here. International Murderous barbarians are a small problem to the Anarchistic Barbarian’s within our societies and those that destroy the will of the individual intellect and espouse to the utopian Social Justice system and that would be total self nihilism, we have made great inroads into that. Hay Miss Chomsky

Scout

I welcome and appreciate your comments, and they prove that my writing is not a waste of time, neither did I perceived to be so.
I do not and cannot expect to have everyone to agree with my views. After all neither do I with others, and we all are entitled to our own views, provided we do not express them in a manner that causes undue harm to others.

There are a range of political leaders/judges/members of parliament, etc, who correspond with me, at times seeking clarification of my writings, etc. The fact that they do in itself underlines they are interested in the subject, even if in the end they may or may not agree with me.

I deplore drug trafficking, but deplore also capital punishment, as once the population accept the killing of another human being then more likely will they for their own reason accept the same when it suits them to kill.

As my wife makes clear (what I am on about), “You could sit with your worst enemy at a table just calmly drinking a cup of coffee even so you know he might try to kill you”.
I experienced time and again, that using “words” to disarm a violent person was the best weapon.
As many made known to me (including in non-volatile situations such as in Court proceedings), they fear me because I remain so calm, and use “words” that are very simple to understand, that they are looking for what I might be hiding,

I try to calculate what are the rights of my opponent before I seek to react, so as to ensure that whatever I do is appropriate.

I view, that many, so to say, would-be-suicide-bombers may be avoided to go that path if just we showed restrain, and try to understand their reasoning, and then try them to understand our reasoning why such kind of killing is not appropriate. It has worked for me for decades, and I for one stick to that.
Hot heads that pursue otherwise might just cause more harm then good.

Just out of interest,

If I am unfortunate enough to witness or be in a position whereby I may have witnessed some part of, or part of the preparation of a terrorist attack, I can be arrested on that basis, and held incommunicado for 14 days. This would mean essentially the loss of my employment (as I could not explain to my employer where I was, or following my release I could not state where I had been), particularly in light of the workchoices package. Interestingly, as the actions by AFP / ASIO etc. would be lawful, as would those of my employer, I would then be without access to compensation for this loss, despite it being foreseeable.

Is this an entirely unplanned, accidental consequence of these proposed laws, or is this an additional form of duress, with which to force confessions / information from people scared of losing economically? I am not sure whether this would be covered by income protection insurance, so the possibility is real that this could lead to foreclosures and business closures.

Aaron

Gerit,

I take it from your post that you have read Patapan's article.

The fact is that it was foreseen in the convention debates that at some stage any government may attack basic, fundamental rights, although it was felt that no government in this country would ever try top deprive any person of their liberty, sans judicial process (which was defined in the debate)

Alakhem shalom,

Aharoni

Gerit, I appreciate your thoughtful and considered response. I am sure that you are not easily deflected, my words were more for the reactionaries who see in simple terms of good and evil. We are both aware that the world is more complex than that. Good to see that you practice what you preach and that is you do indeed LISTEN. Thank you.

Irfan's article makes me reflect that I am fortunate to be fair, blond and blue-eyed - unlikely to be targeted for suspicious behaviour. Not so many of my friends whose appearance does not fit the accepted caucasian "norm".

Now, even though our security level remains at moderate (as it has done since 9/11), by the most incredible coincidence we are informed by our PM that there is a specific terrorist threat. Who believes in coincidences? Who believes the proponent on 'children overboard', 'core promises' or 'never, ever GST'.

Irfan and other muslims have every right to be concerned. Until we receive detailed information regarding this 'specific terrorist threat' I will remain sceptical.

(formerly Trinity)

Peace

Scout, while I do actually share your sense of cynicism about these amazing (and politically beneficial) coincidences, we did have some detail this morning.

Some people in Sydney, discussing with associates in Melbourne, about possible targets. Perhaps a wire tapp..or.. maybe even that 'thing' which you don't believe I had any part of :)

Gerit, I'm quite amazed at you. You went to Germany to find out 'why' the German people did what they did to the Jews ? As far as I know, the vast majority of German people had no clue what was going on at all.

For goodness sake man, have you not heard of Hitler ? and 'megalomania' ? and history.... Look at the beginnings of WW1 and the aftermath, the mood of the Germans, put yourself in their position. I think (now with the benefit of some better reading and hindsite) that if I was a German after WW1, I would have felt VERY VERY disgruntled over the outcome. I now understand that it was more about various alliances and attempting to maintain geo-political advantage that it began, with the Serbs right in the thick of it, rather than some 'evil' aspect of German behavior. WW2 was different.

The Jews were used as scapegoats for Germany's ills, and a megalomaniac orchestrated this. What is to understand apart from this ?

Gerrit, just read the books of Kings and Samuel, Judges, its all 'been there done that' in terms of human/tribal/national behavior.

I tend to agree with your emphasis on due process, but I would not worry if someone was detained for 2 weeks without trial etc, it may mean the difference between a few trains being bombed or not.

Some of the London bombers were linked to or part of the group of Muslims already detained (and then released) prior to the event. So, there 'is' evidence that 'such' laws will make us safer.

I urge you to consider these words:

vehu mekholal mipshaenu meduka meavonoteinu musar shelomenu alav uvakhavurato nirpa-lanu:

Shalom