Dear Antoun Issa,

As a Jew I can only agree. Ethnic nationalism is a failed form of nation formation. In today's world one cannot have democracy along with special privileges for a category of citizens based on ethnicity or religion.

It is discouraging. I see little hope for anything but continued conflict.

Most shameful, most disgusting, what else can I say?

A well written article, but just two technical corrections:

1) The proposed law would not require an oath, but just a "declaration". This means that most people will just pay it a lip-service, say what's expected of them, then take a shower and forget all about it.

2) Judaism is not a religion, nor does the new oath/declaration require allegience to a religion. Judaism is and always been a national-movement, which just happened to strategically design a religion that would further its aims.

The only reason that a member of a society would not express his or her loyalty to the nation of his domicile and citizenship is that he does not HAVE Loyalty to that nation.

It's really simple. You can disagree with specific policies yet still have fundamental loyalty to the nation. Democracy is where you have the freedom to change what you don't like.

That should have no bearing whatsoever to your basic loyalty to the nation. If you cannot be loyal..then it's simple... move to Canada or somewhere.

Loyalty does not mean blanket endorsement of every government policy.

The bleating and whining from the Muslims/Arabs in Israel about this very honorable bill is evidence of disloyalty... it has nothing to do with 'racism' but of course..that's the first port of call for the propogandist...isn't it.

"It's Racism" = "smokescreen for seditious intent"

Dear Yuyutsu,

When did Judaism stop being a religion? It was one when I woke up this morning. There are three Jewish congregations in Brisbane. I'm sure all the members think it's a religion.

ALGOREisRICH,

"Society", "nation" and "state" are 3 different terms. No Australian immigrant, nor even an Australian Member of Parliament, is required to be loyal to the Australian society or the Australian nation. What a difference!

"If you cannot be loyal..then it's simple... move to Canada or somewhere"

Quite simple, is it? so what if you cannot be loyal to Canada either, or to any other country?

Dear David,

I suppose you should ask your Brisbane friends and Rabbis whether Judaism is just a religion, or whether it is also a nation: I think you are up for a surprise.

Judaism never stopped HAVING a religion, no doubt about that, but it was never that religion itself. Historically (as opposed to legends), the same person who formed Judaism also created its religion. This was Ezra the scribe, about 2500-2600 years ago, who was heading the community that was sent back to Israel by King Koresh or Persia. He realized that what's needed to bind his community together was an exclusive religion, and so he picked up, assembled and modified various texts to form the core of what is known today as the old testament. He even had the Chutzpah to shape God Almighty according to his political aspirations for that group.

The aim of religion is to uplift man, to help one to reach God, or at least to come closer to Him. In contrast, the Jewish religion brings down its god to serve national interests.

History must admit that Ezra's nation-building exercise, however ruthless and hypocritical, was quite effective, as the Jewish nation still exists 2500 years later and even recently returned to its country of origin. Whether you support or reject the idea of maintaining nationalism even in our day and age, is a separate question.

Zionism is the new Nazism.Israel will trick us into a global conflict if we don't stay alert.There is now a corporate facism which crosses all borders and Govts of all persuasions have been seduced by the power of money.

And I wonder what Radio Tel Aviv advises ordinary slow-thinking Australian citizens (who are not Joint Australian/Israeli citizens) , to think about the loyalty (to Australia) of their brother & sister Australian citizens , who are also citizens of the foreign state of Israel , and who support this Oath which the state of Israel so reasonably requires .

"And the barber kept on shaving".
I'm going to bed - OR visiting a less sanitised web site .

Dear Yuyutsu,

I guess you fall into the pattern of many who denigrate a religion that is not their own. Pity.

Dear David,

"guess you fall into the pattern of many who denigrate a religion that is not their own. Pity."

It actually used to be my own, I had my share of brain-wash, but I've done my research since and discovered Judaism for what it really is. Thank God for that.

Dear Yuyutsu

I see you are a fan of the Wellhausen Documentary Hypothesis? :)

Please..it's been discredited more times than I can count.

There are more holes in that theory than in a swiss cheeze.

Judaism, relates only to the land of Israel given by God. (Orthodox type) That does not include Australia.

If a Jew was to be faithful to the Biblical faith, he would be sharing the Grace of God with all he/she can.

//I will also make you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring my salvation to the ends of the earth// Isaiah 49:6

The modern Jew may or may not, depending on his traditions, see 'salvation' in very materialistic terms, but the original nature of salvation was 'faith in God' as demonstrated by Abraham. Gen 15:6

Yuy..please move on from Wellhausen and catch up :)

Dear David f,
What is your vision. As you seem to be against everything what do you stand on and for. There are 2 beliefs to my knowledge, positive and negative. To paraphrase Jesus if you are not for the positive you are for the negative by default. So be careful because the negative can present as a false positive as Paul of Tarsus explains in 2 Cor 11-14 and Gal i-8. The fact that the Jews make a stand for their nation is a positive not a negative as you seem to indicate.


Regards Richie 10

Khalid Amayrah a major Jewish Rabbi says that all non-Jews are donkeys,who are only permitted to exist to serve the chosen people.
Why has he not been shouted down? http://mycatbirdseat.com/

Dear Richie 10,

I have a vision of humans living in peace with each other and showing kindness and compassion to each other. I hope we humans will regard ourselves as a species which is just one of many and respect the natural world. I hope humans will realise that we have a limited time on this earth and behave in a manner so that those we leave behind will remember us with love and regret our passing. I have a vision of people being skeptical and discarding superstition whether it is named religion or something else. I have a high regard for the scientific method as a way of finding out about the world and hope more people will learn about it. I hope people will have less regard for possessions and more regard for art, literature, science and the natural world. I have a vision of people being more aware of human suffering and trying to relieve it. I hope humans will be more aware of overpopulation, militarism, racism and other social problems and do something about them.

I think we should be kind and question.

I don't believe life is so simple that we can divide everything into positive and negative. Your positive may be my negative, and we both may be wrong.

I also don't believe there is any authority we can look to for all the answers although I listen respectfully to Patrick Leonard when he talks about fungus. He really is an expert in that area. I think we can try to recognise wisdom, but ultimately we have to figure things out for ourselves.

Dear Arjay,

Rabbi Ovadia Yosef's remarks have been condemned by many including the prime minister of Israel, the US State Department, the Jewish Anti-defamation League and even other ultra-orthodox rabbis. I think it is no good to shout people down regardless of what they say. That just means the one with the loudest voice prevails.

Dear David f,
Thank you for sharing your heart.
Regards Richie 10

Leaving aside any consideration of the logic of the Israeli affirmation of loyalty, the author's statement: 'Instead of a Jewish-only oasis, we have a state implanted on a large non-Jewish indigenous population that, including the Occupied Territories, is heading towards becoming the majority" impies that Jews have no right to live in their own country. Any suggestion that all "Palestinians" are indigenous to Israel is a nonsense. There are black Palestinians, the descendants of Muslim slaves, while others are descendants of Lebanese, Syrian and Egyptiam immigrants. So who has more right to Judaea, land of the Jews? On top of that, Muslim "Palestinians" are busy forcing out Christians, making a mockery of any legitimate claims to "Palestine" based on a shared history.

Antoun Issa lambasts Israel for its "Jewish state" ideology, where is the concern over Saudi refusal (based on religious edict) to allow Jews to even set foot on the Arabian Peninsula- an area where they once lived in their thousands.