Otokonoko,

<<AJ, your discrediting of a belief system you know "inside-out" does little more than discredit your claim to know it inside out.>>

I object to any suggestion that I don’t understand Christianity “inside-out”. It’s similar to the idiotic claim that those who lose their faith didn’t really believe - or know Jesus - to begin with.

I find that totally offensive.

<<For example, you show that you do not understand the difference between prescience and predestination.>>

What about prescience and predestination do I not understand?

You’re being deliberately vague here. Please give specifics.

<<Just because God knows in advance what decisions you will make doesn't mean that you have no free will in making those decisions.>>

And your reasoning for the above statement is?

Banjo Paterson

you ask

'I am wondering why you consider that "the right to pretend that God does not exist" is limited to adults only.

Inversly, what makes you think that children and adolescents "pretend that God exists"?'

Children are much more ready to believe in God despite their Adamic nature as they can see the obvious (we are created). It is usually when people get older and want to justify the seared conscience that they adopt the twisted unscienctific evolution myth.

'Doesn't everybody, including children, adolescents and adults alike, have the right to pretend that God exists or does not exist?'

Usually the conscience of a child isn't seared like that of adults who have rejected Christ.

'You also indicate that the right to "indulge in every perverted act they wish" is limited to adults only. It seems that children and adolescents do not enjoy the same right.'

That is right.

'And what about those who "pretend that god exists"?'

A fool says to himself their is no god.

'Supposing, for the sake of argument, that they do not have the same right as the others, is it not possible that the prospect of transgression may add fuel to the fire of whatever shameful desires are already torturing their souls?'

Transgression is a powerful drug that stimulates and excites the central nervous system of those of us who "pretend that God exists". It has all the ingrediants necessary to enslave us to the point that life becomes unbearable without our daily dose of infernal conflict between sin and devotion.'

Yes forbidden fruit always looks better. The sinful nature reminds us more of our need for Christ.

'Who can honsestly imagine that all the "perversion" in this world is perpetrated exclusively by those of us who "pretend that God does not exist"?'

Not me. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. We are all born of corruption

.

Dear Runner,

.

My question: "Who can honestly imagine that all the "perversion" in this world is perpetrated exclusively by those of us who "pretend that God does not exist"?'

Your response: "Not me. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. We are all born of corruption"

My response: Agreed. Whether one "pretends that God exists or not" does not appear to have much effect on the matter.

.

Actually Otokonoko, don’t worry about my request in regards to prescience and predestination. I was in the middle of putting together some reasons why they don’t explain away the free will problem Christians face, then it hit me...

Considering your post was (presumably) in response to my claim that I “totally de-constructed, destroyed and discredited the entire Christian belief system”, this is beside the point as free will is not central to Christianity - the alleged resurrection is.

It’s been a while since I was a Christian, so could you tell me, do theologians have a study that attempts to explain the fact that the god of Abraham was such a colossal failure, and why his method of saving us from himself was so inept?

AJP

I hope there were others who picked up on the coincidence as well. It is amazing how people like R10 will continue repeating their dogma as if nothing has happened. Blind faith indeed.

Question for the religious:

Please justify why YOUR particular religion should be taught at secular schools.

Why Catholicism over Anglican, or, more generally, Christianity over Judaism, Buddhism in preference to Scientology?

Not all religions can be right. And I do not want to hear the p*ssweak excuse that Australia is a Christian country - that does not mean that Christianity is god's chosen, let alone that there is a god at all (think Buddhism).

At the risk of suggesting that the entire issue could be easily solved by not teaching any religion in schools apart from a comparative study, as opposed to indoctrination, can not the religious understand how they would feel if the primary religious instruction at all secular schools was, say, hmmmmm, Islam? If that very thought sticks in your craw, then perhaps, you can use the value of compassion and understand how non-religious feel.

Is it such a lot to ask religious people to consider others do not share their beliefs? Where are all those positive religious values that you claim to have?

Walk the talk.

Otokonoko: << I don't think there's any place for compulsory religious education in public schools, or non-compulsory religious education along the lines of the NSW model. In fact, I'd say that state schools should be entirely secular. >>

I agree completely, and thanks for offering a reasonable Christian perspective. Your anecdote about the chaplain fits well with the concerns I've had as a parent since they were introduced into Queensland state schools. Quite frankly, I find the whole chaplaincy program creepy.

As I've said before, if parents want their children to receive religious instruction, they should send them to religious schools or Sunday School or whatever. Chaplains should be replaced by qualified counsellors with no religious brief.

I'll leave you to debate theology with AJ (whose contributions I usually appreciate here, as I do with yours).