qanda - sorry, my attention was elsewhere for a couple of days. What at AAAS?

Loudmouth - well I'm pleased you recognise the many ways we're trashing the planet, apart from global warming, as well as the precautionary principle. Most "sceptics" don't recognise either.

Regarding your question "Is that it?", the worry is that many of the consequences are accelerating. Ice melting is a big one, and it's difficult to rule out meters of sea level rise by 2100 (and more after that). (Also difficult to say it will happen.) The biggest danger with global warming is that we pass (have passed?) a tipping point beyond which natural responses take over and push the world to 4, 6 or even more degrees of warming. For example, if enough CO2 and methane leak out of melting tundra, they might become the dominant warmers. There are about 10 other mechanisms that could also cause runaway warming. I've summarised some of this in a longish article on my blog site http://betternature.wordpress.com/2009/03/09/last-call-on-climate/ .

The world is a complex place, so that much warming would have dramatic consequences that are impossible to forecast in any detail, but we know that many ecosystems would be ripped apart (some species can migrate, others can't), many species would go extinct, others would proliferate, causing plagues and epidemics. Modern global industrial civilisation would quickly collapse into more localised forms that would struggle to adapt. Food production would probably plummet. Political and social chaos, and wars over dwindling resources, would probably be widespread. And so on.

>> Are emissions really increasing exponentially ? Each Saturday, the national newspaper publishes emission totals for the previous week, for most states and nationally: each week so far this year, the total has been less than the corresponding week last year, and to date, this year's total is well down on last year's total to this time. Of course, that's The Australian, that muck-raking, capitalist-consumerist, lickspittle rag, but it's probably the best we've got to go on at the moment. <<

No Joe, you don't need me to instruct you, but it would help if you at least understood that there is another world outside Australia ... it is a global problem after all.

You could try here;

http://cait.wri.org/

All you need is the capacity to register and the capacity to tick a few boxes, and it won't cost a cent.

As far as doing something about it? Perhaps you can find some ideas from Geoff's web site. But to reiterate, you don't need me to instruct you.

And yes, you are under.
And yes, you are still being obtuse - fool or not.

Geoff

The current issue, with features on education and science literacy

http://www.sciencemag.org/current.dtl

Loudmouth,

"Yes, from memory Prof. Jones cited a figure of 0.07 degrees C, at the 95 % confidence level of about 0.07 degrees C, something like that ? i.e. somewhere between 0 and 0.14 degrees C, over fifteen years ? "

How about no. Apart from your memory being exceptionally poor, and your not understanding what confidence levels mean (even though Jone's didn't use confidence levels), the numbers you state are pulled from nowhere. Not one of them is correct in any sense of the word.

I don't think we are talking about angels and pins when discussing this. People are trying to do something about the real climate change, including what so many 'sceptics' say we should do, and thats prepare to adapt. Agricultural scientists are preparing to adapt, but they are still unsure as to what the changes are yet to be.

It doesn't help when you see science PhDs seriously misrepresenting statistics to laypeople just to push their own agendas.

The only way to protect yourself from appearing ignorant is to actually learn what the scientists are actually saying. Try reading and comprehending some commentary that you don't agree with for a change.

And when I talk about science PhDs, I do mean the likes of Marohasy, who has a PhD in identifying insects, but you'd never guess it with the tripe she writes.

At this moment there are bigger issues than perceived AGW.We have to stop Israel's push for war against Iran.I'mageddon very tense about this nonsense.