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Have a nice world war, folks : Comments
By John Pilger, published 31/3/2010On both sides of the Atlantic, serious dissent exposing illegal war has become a serious crime.
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Posted by Forkes, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 11:32:29 AM
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John Pilger's may make a lot of sense to him but the rest of us are left wondering what he is raving about.
Take this sentence: "In Gaza, the sick and abandoned population, mostly children, is being entombed behind underground American-supplied walls in order to reinforce a criminal siege. In Latin America, the Obama administration has secured seven bases in Colombia, from which to wage a war of attrition against the popular democracies in Venezuela, Bolivia, Ecuador and Paraguay." Gaza: if you're talking about the walls all around the Gaza strip then you also have to blame the Egyptian government which has also restricted movement on its side, and any investigation of that move leads straight to Hamas as the main culprit. I'm not suggesting that either Israel or Egypt are squeaky clean, but Hamas must bear a large slice of the blame for the deep problems of the strip. Ranting about US involvement in this issue is dated. Central/South America: come again? Some examples of what Pilger means by these wars would have been nice, as no one else seems to have noticed them. There is the war on drugs but armed action in other countries? Come now, a few examples please. All in all a dated rant. Pilger hates America, I get that, but that's all I really get from the article. Posted by Curmudgeon, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 12:53:29 PM
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John hates the USA, nothing new there, lots of people do ..
This one though is bizarre "“War is fun”, the helmets in Vietnam used to say with bleakest irony, meaning that if a war is revealed as having no purpose other than to justify voracious power in the cause of lucrative fanaticisms such as the weapons industry, the danger of truth beckons." What a bunch of crap - you have kids painting that on their helmets as a joke - not "meaning that if a war is revealed as having no purpose other than to justify voracious power in the cause of lucrative fanaticisms such as the weapons industry, the danger of truth beckons." Here's a man who just can't let things go without trying to find deep insightful dark depths permeating within every nuance and crack of their desire to dominate and subjugate the world. Talk about overblown verbose diarrhea, he must be getting paid by the word. John used to have interesting insights occassionally, but now its just strained hatred .. oh well. Posted by Amicus, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 3:09:01 PM
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Everyone who is critical of John Pilger and there are many (not today, but over the years) and as today, find the depth of his comment somewhat complex and slightly jaundiced should remember all the years in which he covered stories that no one else would, Chile, Venezuela, other South American countries, drugs, dictators and the list goes on.
I respect him for those difficult years and those difficult stories and when I became aware of some of the worst injustices as a result of his energies. I always thought that if there was 75% of the story that was factual and unemotional, I received enough detail to do my own research if the subject was on my favourite list of don't; that is hypocrisy, injustice and the abuse of power. Did I mention hypocrisy? Alive and well, everywhere and thriving daily in OLO. He still has an active readership, a great following in Europe and an interesting web page. But he can be hard and unapologetic on the subjects of his writings and at times, excessively analytical. And yes, I found today a little tortuous as well. Posted by rexw, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 4:35:05 PM
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Unfortunately for most of who live in our Western comfort zones John Pilger does hit the raw nerve of truth a bit too often.
The world is in huge turmoil,brought on by a corporate oligarchy who want too much power.If Israel is successful is pushing the USA into Iran,then a serious war will errupt in the Middle East, escallating oil prices and human hardship.Russia has warned the USA not to invade Iran as the consequences will be dire. If there is an invasion of Iran,look at who benefits.Oil companies,arms dealers and banks who loan $ trillions for weapons to our Govts who then tax us.Follow the money trail. Posted by Arjay, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 6:50:45 PM
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Arjay.
Your assessment is frightening but highly probable. Fortunately, under Obama, the US is fast waking up to Israel so they might find that even with the insidious influences from New York bagel country to the influencial Christian right, the remaining population are tiring of wars. Most of the average middle class people, from where the young men and women are chosen to fight, when questioned, do not want to lose any more of their young for a war brought on by Israel which is being engineered right now in Tel Aviv. Australians would feel the same way too. Perhaps in the very near future the wise heads in Washington, those not influenced by Jewish lobbyists, very thick on every street corner, may legislate for a loyalty (but to the US) vote for politicians and eliminate the practice of dual passports so that one person is loyal to one country...... only. Now that would be interesting, in Australia as well. Poor old Greg Sheridan and all his sycophants, would have to make a choice. Of course I would do all I could to tell them how lovely Israel is at this time of year. Could free up a lot of very expensive real estate, but just in the eastern suburbs. So Arjay, keep your fingers crossed that reason will prevail and that the strength of the Russian vote acts as a deterrent to the US. Never ever thought that we would be relying on Russia for the safety of our planet. Posted by rexw, Wednesday, 31 March 2010 7:36:12 PM
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[Deleted for abuse]
Posted by Shadow Minister, Thursday, 1 April 2010 6:50:08 AM
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"under Obama, the US is fast waking up to Israel" wrote rexw.
Too slowly and too little by far, in my opinion. This very week Obama is in the news drumming up supporters for punishing Iran, a country that is little threat to the USA but an admitted great worry to Israel. Isn't it likely that the USA is hassling Iran in response to demands from Israel rather than to safeguard citizens of the USA half a planet away? In coming weeks we seem destined to hear more rhetoric about the alleged evils of Iran and its scary nuclear ambitions, supported by the same "intelligence" that only a few years ago terrified us with Iraq's Weapons of Mass destruction, and coming from the usual hypocrites already armed with nuclear arsenals themselves. Obama and mainstream media are are giving every indication that they are grooming us to support yet another war. In Australia, without asking we citizens, expect PM Rudd to once again re-affirm Australia's support for Israel and the USA. What do you think the Jewish lobbyists that rexw mentioned will be doing about all of this? Posted by Forkes, Thursday, 1 April 2010 9:35:47 AM
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John Pilger makes many waves, as did Darwin, Dawkins and apparently Jesus. Therefore, it is easy to identify his doubters who splutter their indignation through a mouthful of salty venom.
We humans are living a lie, being indoctrinated with various rubbish since birth. As we populate more, so does our madness increase. If the population were able to return to the 1950's level of two billion, America's present war chest would be enough to keep every person in the world in comfort, barring the human propensity to destroy. We are very fortunate to have John Pilger among us. Truth, like love, hurts because it draws on our responsibilities. Posted by Sherkahn, Thursday, 1 April 2010 9:46:45 AM
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Forbes
forkes I am a laborer. How could I during my fifty plus years of working-life find the time an the energy to read anything other than The Argus, or The Age or The Sun-Herald? How could I see, through these papers’ official spin and search the real facts? Yes, John Pilger is getting old, but in his (and my) young years, he made me see the real goings on in the world. My grudge with him is that he has never hinted to a valid way of avoiding the ills he uncovers Posted by skeptic, Thursday, 1 April 2010 10:18:39 AM
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rexw,There are big changes happening in the USA.The US Military has not been corrupted as Congress and Wall St and they are beginning to realise how the oligarchs have raped and pillaged their country.
The military do not want to be king of a dung heap,nor the lap dog for Israel. After 30 yrs it is now revealed that it was Israel who attacked the US ship Liberty in 1967.It was an unarmed intelligence gathering ship.The intention was to totally destroy it and blame it on Egypt whom Israel was fighting.They wanted to draw the USA into their fight and destroy Egypt.This revelation is not going down too well with the US Military. Google Dr Alan Sabrovsky.He is making some outrageous claims about Israel and promises so soon back them up with facts. Posted by Arjay, Thursday, 1 April 2010 6:12:55 PM
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The disgraceful Israeli attack on USS Liberty has been known about for a long time Arjay. It was reported in a small Australian newspaper 10 years ago or more. Admittedly the facts have been difficult for members of the public to find in the past, due to the combined cover-up by both US and Israeli governments... but thanks to the Internet (which our lovely government is manouvering to censor) it is easy to read about at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident and elsewhere.
A knowledge of this incident should disillusion anybody who believes that governments of the USA or Israel can be trusted. Posted by Forkes, Friday, 2 April 2010 8:40:28 AM
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Forkes and Arjay
You are both well informed. Firstly Forkes...the lobbyist6s will be working even harder through graft and corruption to ensure that the US Senate and the Congress do their bidding. Here as well. There is an active group out of Melbourne that have already had Julia Gillard to an "Education Conference" in Israel, Abbott saying last weekend that Rudd should go 'softly,softly' on Israelis caught with their hands in the passport till.This is the way they work. They are devious and find the weak politicians to corrupt. Believe me when I say there are plenty. (Hope you both noticed Malcolm Fraser telling Rudd to prosecute the offenders and getting castigated by the Jewish lobby, Melbourne again who called him a Jew hater, or words to that effect. Makes it a change from anti-Semetic, a phrase they have dined out on for 65 years). They have marketed that phrase for a long time. However, as we have sais, people are better informed now. If you have a strong stomach, youTube has some coverage of the 2009 AIPAC Conference in the US. The fawning sycophantic politicians at that event have long since sold their souls and their votes. It's nauseating. Abbott would be a compliant target. Just shaking hands with Greg Sheridan would be enough. Anything Murdoch touches is immediately suspect. Just look at his journalists. As for the military, Arjay, they are associated with a very active website, veteranstoday.com and have some wonderful writers including Jeff Gates, the writer of 'Criminal State'. But the veterans are lobbying strongly as well as you have said, being tired of being the group that carries the burden and still a group in the US that the Zionists cannot penetrate. A lot more informed these days and are fast becoming aware of the way they are used. Sadly here in Australia we have so few decent and strong politicians that they are easy marks for the schemes the Israelis use, per medium of smart suited business people, with their dual passports, coming and going as they please. Keep writing Posted by rexw, Friday, 2 April 2010 11:06:03 AM
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The American Israel Public Affairs Committee marshaled all of its congressional beneficiaries of Israel lobby campaign contributions. AIPAC demands [pdf] the administration stop publicly confronting Israel, take the dispute behind closed doors and get back to the AIPAC agenda against Iran [pdf]. But Obama long ago stated backroom deals with the Israel lobby were off the table, because such deals have a track record — like illegal settlements — of derailing efforts toward peace in the region.
For those interested, this is from a news broadcast today and probably requires no emlargement. An indication of the mood changes in train. You see how AIPAC "demands" support the administration. Also the "AIPAC" agenda against Iran". Very clear wwho has controlled foreign policy over in the US, fast coming to an end, hopefully. The sad thing is that regardlerss of the sometime arrogant commends from Iran, that country is the key to a new understanding with the Arab world. They are well educated, very western in interests and education and with a very active and progressive youthful population. However, nothing in that description suits the Israelis, hence using all their evil influence on the weak politicians in the US and all other countries, currently using their influences here in Australia. Look forward to seeing other writings on your thoughts Read Aletho News Posted by rexw, Saturday, 3 April 2010 8:07:16 AM
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rexw, We do not know how big a shift in the US mood toward Israel has taken.I'm part of the 911 truth movement and Sabrovsky's claims that Israel did it without factual evidence is a bit alarming.It was not just the influences from Israel who have caused 911 and these subsequent wars and economic collapse.There is a lot of circumstancial evidence but no proof.
Previous to these developments ,I thought that the military had to be complicit to some degree.While it is heartening to learn that the military do have ethics and integrity,we do not need to entertain some of the gung ho ideas of wiping Israel from the planet as a solution.All they will do is kill innocent people.The few perpetrators will be hiding elsewhere and money will buy their freedom. Perhaps Sabrovsky is playing mind games and just stirring he pot,but this could just make Israel do stupid things if his claims are 100%true.Israel is said to have well over 100 nukes and the means to deliver them.How can Sabrovsky say that they are a walk over? We also do not know the extent of the military awareness or their support.Admiral Mike Mullen,Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, was appointed by Rahm Emanuel and he would choose a weak leader that he could control you would think. I just hope that sanity prevails becuase the rise in awareness is shifting the balance of power. Posted by Arjay, Saturday, 3 April 2010 9:11:24 AM
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As it was reported last week that “AIPAC has persuaded more than three-quarters of the members of the U.S. House of Representatives to sign a letter calling for an end to public criticism of Israel and urging the US to ‘reinforce’ its relationship with the Jewish state (UK Guardian),” it is worth noting one fact of American citizenship: American servicemen and women, all federal employees, and elected representatives who swear to defend the U.S. Constitution do not affirm dual allegiance to Israel or any other country.
But the politicians will do anything else like sell their vote just to keep their seat. Nauseating. Three quarters? Hard to believe isn't it? Posted by rexw, Tuesday, 6 April 2010 10:44:33 AM
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Rexw,this is where Russia and China can come to the table and curb Israel's excesses.Israel with the power of Corporate backing has bitten off more than it can chew.The US Congress has been totally corrupted by the power of Fractional Reserve Money.
While there is nothing special about Russia or China in terms of democracy,they could curtail the excesses of Western Economies in the throes of self destruction. The war will not be nice. Posted by Arjay, Tuesday, 6 April 2010 8:58:31 PM
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Unfortunately, armed with a perspective like Pilger's, the daily news is dismal to follow, especially with so many Australians seeming happy to support the USA and its warmongering. I'm not surprised that an increasing number of westerners are turning against their "own" governments with violent intent. It's a reaction against a feeling of helplessness and hopelessness that they would otherwise feel.