The Forum > General Discussion > China and the Liberal Party
China and the Liberal Party
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Posted by Paul1405, Monday, 4 January 2021 6:15:28 PM
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I TOLD YOU SO
Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 5:58:53 AM
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Yes you did Mr O, you did indeed.
BUT! If this guy is such a security risk to Australia, and I'm yet to see anything that says he's not, then we can't, and shouldn't, simply sweep this under the carpet. Several high profile Liberal politicians who were in a close relationship with this Chinese "business" man had access to sanative material related to national security. We have a right to question what these Liberals discussed with Liu and if the ASIO investigation encompassed these people as well. Gladys Liu and Michael Sukkar are both under a cloud, and should step down until cleared. Agree? p.s I though of you when i put this up for discussion. Posted by Paul1405, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 6:17:56 AM
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Paul1405,
And I also thought of ME when I saw it in the news yesterday. This is only the tip of the iceberg and although those in The Forum's pro-China camp like Foul-Mouth, Foxy, david f, etc will scream "You're looking for Reds under the bed!" it is imperative that ASIO and the AFP start looking deeper into this matter. Foul-Mouth indicated that there are about half a million non-Australian Chinese in Australia. Why so many? What are they doing here? How many are not non-Australian but are actually un-Australian? I think that this Huifeng "Haha" Liu affair and the aggressive stance that China has taken towards Australia over the past few months supports my long time fears that China holds ill intentions towards Australia and intends to invade Australia are well founded. So it will be interesting to see what Soot Morrison does re this new situation. Who is control of the country: Australians or Chinese? If I had my way I would cancel the visas of all non-Australian (or un-Australian if you prefer) Chinese and send them packing because it looks to me that Australia and China are definitely locked into their personal Cold War and I think China is looking for an excuse to invade Australia so if that is the case the last thing we want is to have the enemy already inside the gates. Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 6:57:35 AM
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Dear Paul,
I'm not an expert on China however logically thinking the only time I feel that China would attack Australia is if we posed a military threat. China has no motivation to do so. It has resources and can obtain resources via trade. It has less compelling population density pressure. Japan and India should have more motivation to do so. Our current government is standing up to the threats that China is currently attempting. It is refusing to be bullied. It is looking out for our own interests. What happens next we shall have to wait and see. A well thought out approach is always better than rushing into something that we may later live to regret. Australia is China's playground. Why would they want to destroy it? Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 9:15:19 AM
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Foxy,
I don't know where you get this idea that China is not suffering from overpopulation pressures and lack of resources. Either you don't know much about geography or you are deliberately trying to divert attention away from Chinese motives for its territorial expansionism. China would want to annex Australia primarily because it is a place rich in resources and is a place to which it can transmigrate its people to relieve pressures on resources. What do you think should be done with this Huifeng "Haha" Liu who looks to me to be a political and military agent operating in Australia under the guise of a Chinese-Australian? Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 9:52:19 AM
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Paul1405,
I remember writing a long time ago that the big decisions affecting Australia would be made behind closed doors in Beijing. And you guessed it! I TOLD YOU SO. Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 11:01:25 AM
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Pig-ignorant people, those still locked in the days of the White Australia Policy, commonly go on about China being overpopulated. On this site:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependencies_by_population_density one can see easily that China is barely half as densely-populated as the UK, and is less densely-populated than almost any other European country. But keep your prejudices if you wish, there's not much anybody else can do about them. On this site, one can see which countries have declining birth rates: China again has roughly the same birth rate, 11 per thousand per year (i.e. below ZPG) as the UK. On this site: http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.DYN.TFRT.IN one can check * the fertility rates of women in various countries. Again, China's is about the same as that of the UK. and * population growth rates by country. One can see that China (No. 169) as a lower growth rate than the UK (No. 155), or most other European countries. This is corroborated on these sites: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population_growth_rate and http://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?v=24 World population growth should level out by 2100, and decline thereafter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Projections_of_population_growth Joe Posted by loudmouth2, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 11:44:18 AM
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Foul-Mouth,
Your argument above comparing China with the UK tells us more about your lack of education than it does about the physical and human geographies of those countries. Maybe you can report back to Beijing and get another briefing on how to get your mate Huifeng "Haha" Liu off the hook. Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 12:10:29 PM
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Foul-Mouth & Foxy,
There's a photo in this article which looks like it might be showing Soot Morrison and Gladys Liu waving a big "Ni hao mate!" to Huifeng "Haha" Liu who was watching from the public gallery at the time the photo was taken. http://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/liberal-mp-gladys-liu-says-allegations-against-chinese-party-donor-concerning-20210104-p56rmt.html It's not a good look is it? And from the article it looks like Gladys has thrown old "HaHa" under the bus. You guys can tell us: Is "HaHa" a Chinese-Australian or an Australian-Chinese or a non-Australian-Chinese or an un-Australian-Chinese? All this multicultural lingo is just so damn confusing! Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 12:56:52 PM
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Here's another news item with an interesting video about how the Chinese spy network and propagandists have infiltrated Australia:
http://www.news.com.au/national/politics/chinese-businessmans-links-to-liberal-mps-need-investigating-labor/news-story/ba9081fab13d5d8f445a840826310911 The question that a lot of people are now asking is: Has China been able to put a Manchurian Candidate into the Australian Parliament? Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 1:52:52 PM
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"The Australian Emergency Assistance" organisation with 55,000 members !
Why would they need such a large organisation ? It would be a good "cover" organistion. If a "request" was made to it I wonder if they would reply "How High ?" Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 5:00:16 PM
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Bazz,
Like I keep saying: The enemy is already inside the gate. And Mr Opinion gets to say: I TOLD YOU SO. Posted by Mr Opinion, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 5:18:42 PM
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Paul.
"...this Chinese "business" man had access to sanative material..." Was he responsible for the great toilet roll panic? Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 8:24:44 PM
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Is Haha related to Gladys Liu??
Posted by Canem Malum, Tuesday, 5 January 2021 10:37:15 PM
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No and No
Posted by Paul1405, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 4:41:04 AM
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What Australian politician in his/her right mind would trust the Chinese?
But I suppose money can buy the Chinese all the trust they need. This past and ongoing connection between Australian politicians, bureaucrats and business people and the Chinese needs to thoroughly investigated. I think it is time Gladys Liu MP, who is apparently a former(?) affiliate of the Chinese Communist Party, stood up in Parliament and in front of the Australian people and offered an explanation. It might upset the pro-China camp on The Forum like Foul-Mouth, Foxy and david f, but who gives a damn! Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 6:57:41 AM
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"Haha" seems to have the same family name as Gladys Liu- at least in its Anglicised version- probably would have to compare the name in Chinese characters- and even then I'm sure there are many people with the same family names. Though the correlation is interesting.
Posted by Canem Malum, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 7:42:31 AM
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Canem Malum,
There are millions of unrelated Chinese with the same lineage (family) name. I think the connection between these two is a political one not a familial one. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 7:50:35 AM
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To Mr Opinion-
You're most likely correct in your assertion that it's somewhat of a chance political association... Gladys Liu's family apparently comes from Chaozhou but she was born in Hong Kong. Chaozhou is located in the easternmost part of the Guangdong Province, north of the coastal Shantou City. It is situated north of the delta of the Han River, which flows throughout the city. Huifeng 'Haha' Liu- couldn't find much on his birth place. Posted by Canem Malum, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 8:12:32 AM
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Canem Malum,
I never said the Gladys Liu - Huifeng "Haha" Liu connection was a "chance political association". I think you need to ask the Liberal Party what's going on there if you are looking for answers. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 10:07:03 AM
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Hi Paul
ASIO has learnt to its cost that it dare not directly point the finger at Politicians, especially Politicians of the Government in POWER. The ensuing political and popular Blowback in the shape of Royal Commissions of Inquiry, putting ASIO in a bad light, isn't worth the cost. AND The Government Politicians who are secuity risks tend to move on virtually unscathed. _____________________________ One need only point to the Combe-Ivanov Affair. This time of Labor in Power: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combe%E2%80%93Ivanov_affair "In 1983 David Combe, lobbyist and former National Secretary of the Australian Labor Party (ALP), was accused of compromising Australia's national security in dealings with a Soviet diplomat, Valery Ivanov. The so-called Combe-Ivanov affair developed out of a trip Combe and his wife made to the USSR in 1982, in the course of preparations for which they met and developed a relationship with Valery Ivanov then the First Secretary at the Soviet Embassy in Canberra. Soon after the formation of the Hawke government in March 1983, ASIO raised concerns that Combe, still closely aligned to the ALP might be being compromised by a Soviet citizen with KGB links. Ivanov was expelled from Australia on 22 April 1983 by Prime Minister Bob Hawke. Ministers were also directed not to use Combe's lobbying services, although the reason for this was not made known to them at the time. On 17 May Justice Robert Hope was [Royal Commissioned] to investigate the affair but also to review the general progress of the intelligence agencies... [and here's the kicker] "Mick Young returned to the Cabinet in January 1984. Combe was later appointed Australian Trade Commissioner to Canada and Hong Kong." ____________________________ Its up to Prime Minister Morrison to question and apply real penalties, if warranted, to Liberal Politicians in this 2021 affair. Posted by plantagenet, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 10:42:48 AM
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Dear Pete,
I read an interesting article by James Laurenceson Director of Australia China Relations Institute, ( ACRI) University of Technology, Sydney, (2 days ago). Prof. Laurenceson claims that "The fundamental driver of China's hostility in 2020 stems from its assessment that Australia's leaders have reneged on earlier commitments to never direct the country's security alliance with the US against China". Prof Laurenceson says that "A competition rather then cooperation has become the dominant frame through which both Beijing and Washington view their bilateral relationship, each is increasingly sensitive to evidence that other countries in the Asia-Pacific region are supporting their opponent". It's a difficult position for our PM. He's got to try to find out how to manoeuvre between the US and China in the future. As Laurenceson tells us in the title of his article: "China enters 2021, a stronger more influential power and Australia may feel the squeeze even more." Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 12:22:45 PM
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Foxy,
He is an economist (only). He does not hold qualifications in history, sociology or anthropology which makes me a bit cautious that his arguments are biased towards understanding the situation in terms of economics only. But I would agree that China is being aggressive towards Australia because Australia is aligned with others in thwarting Chinese expansionism in the Indo-Pacific region. I have been saying for a long time that the big decisions that will affect Australia will be made behind closed doors in Beijing and now I can say I TOLD YOU SO. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 1:12:18 PM
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Dear Mr O,
May I politely suggest that you have a read about what the Australia China Relations Institute is, and what it does and the researchers who make up the team. http://www.australiachinarelations.org Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 1:51:51 PM
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Foxy,
It will be interesting to see if that organisation lasts as relations between China and Australia worsen in the coming years. I would also ask how much funding they have been receiving from China. Quite a lot I suspect. I have said elsewhere that I anticipate that China will invade Australia as a precursor to its takeover of Taiwan. I have never trusted the Chinese and will always treat them with suspicion. I find myself agreeing with Jared Diamond's comment in his 'Collapse' that they are parasites. I have always said that the big decisions affecting Australia will be made behind closed doors in Beijing and China's current manipulation of trading arrangements and political connections in Australia is giving weight to the fact that I can now say I TOLD YOU SO. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 2:28:07 PM
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Dear Mr O,
You've certainly raised some valid points. I'm not sure how the Institute is funded. I had assumed it was funded by the university. And was an independent research facility. I shall have to look into it. If it is funded by China then that's an entire different scenario. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 2:42:47 PM
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Foxy,
We face the situation with China that the world faced with Germany on the eve of World War 2. The Chinese Civil War cannot go on forever and sooner than later the PRC will reclaim Taiwan reuniting the Chinese under a single nation-state. Adolf Hitler did similar when he reclaimed Austria and Sudetenland for Germany. Unfortunately for us I think China will invade and occupy Australia before annexing Taiwan. I think it is a given in order to protect China's rear when it does attack Taiwan. The writing is on the wall. China's attacks on the Australian economy and the almost constant revelations of an adverse Chinese presence in Australia are the alarm bells starting to ring. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 4:24:34 PM
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Dear Mr O,
You're beginning to scare me. I still can't get my head around what you're saying. To me it doesn't make sense. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 4:53:01 PM
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Foxy,
Churchill was seen as a scaremonger when he tried to warn the world about Hitler and the rise of Nazi Germany. Everyone ignored him until Germany did exactly what he said it would do. Posted by Mr Opinion, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 5:01:30 PM
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Hi Foxy
Re your Wednesday, 6 January 2021 12:22:45 PM comment addressed to me. 1. Yes I agree with Prof. Laurenceson that "The fundamental driver of China's hostility in 2020 stems from its assessment that Australia's leaders have reneged on earlier commitments to never direct the country's security alliance with the US against China". China would see Australia's blocking of Huawei as a vindictive security measure rather than an economic decision. Also contradictively China is beginning to see that its own military power in our (China's and Australia's) East Asia/Oceania region is reaching parity with the forces the US can afford to deploy in our region. China recognises the US has worldwide military commitments (eg. NATO region and Middle East). So in the Long-Term the US cannot deploy more powerful forces than China can deploy in our region. This is especially in usable Conventional forces rather than Doomsday Nuclear forces China's Economic dominance is secured by Military dominance. And I'm illustrating in my "China's Covid Management Allows China to Gain on US" thread at http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=9358&page=0 China's better handling of Covid (than the US) is permitting China to catch up with the US in GDP more quickly than ever before. 2. Also http://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-01-05/china-enters-2021-a-stronger-more-influential-power/13006408 illustrates that "7 among 10 ASEAN countries are in favour of China" instead of the US. 3. Biden has much work to do to improve the US's alliance system in East Asia/Oceania to face China (Trump has done much alliance damage). Pete Posted by plantagenet, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 5:04:03 PM
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Dear Pete,
Thank You. I've got so much to learn about China. Over two centuries ago, Napoleon commented that China was "a sleeping giant, and when she wakes, she will shake the world". It looks like its happening today. Posted by Foxy, Wednesday, 6 January 2021 5:50:06 PM
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Hi Pete and Foxy,
Our efforts to "contain the tiger", rather than through peaceful cooperation, we've tried some kind of big stick approach, which is doomed to failure. I can only imagine the distain and contempt Chine must feel towards Australia with our sanctimonious lecturing on a number of issues. China sees Australia, and the west in general, as being owned nothing. In 70 years the Chinese without the slightest assistance from the West, in fact just the opposite, have managed to build for themselves a nation, not perfect by any means, that can provide for its 1.4 billion, mostly poor people. Australia in its stupidity rushed blindly into aligning itself with the US post WWII, a huge mistake in my opinion. Just as the Soviet Union before it had nothing but distain for Australia as a US lackey, China sees us as nothing more than a big resources pit, ripe for the plucking, populated by American sycophants. Its not too late for Australia through Scott Morrison to stand before the World, admit the errors of the past, and committing Australia to a new position of peaceful non-alignment neutrality, whilst symbolically tearing up the ANZAS Treaty, and possibly a bit of self flagellation by ScumO' before the world would by a good sign of our sincerity. Posted by Paul1405, Thursday, 7 January 2021 6:32:46 AM
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Dear Paul,
Without the help of the United States and the West to defend Australia our nation would be in the same dire straits as the Baltics were when the Soviet Union was able to invade and occupy. Scott Morrison has to tread carefully and try to be given some slack in his dealings with both China and the US. I don't envy his difficult position. Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 7 January 2021 6:50:43 AM
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Foxy,
The China-Australia conflict has now gone too far for Soot Morrison to reset the relationship and now China can only be seen as an aggressor harbouring ill intent for Australia and it will do everything in it's power to undermine Australian sovereignty and independence in a world that China wants to turn into its empire. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 7:16:03 AM
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Dear Mr O,
Predicting the future is risky at the best of times. I'm no pundit but I prefer to wait and see. I feel that with all the people who are advising our current PM - will know how to react in our nation's best interests. Anyway, I'm hopeful that things will pan out for us if we tread carefully. I have no doubt that we can find a solution that suits us, provided we do not succumb to the siren calls of demagogues, charlatans and ideologies. Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 7 January 2021 7:47:59 AM
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cont'd ...
Apologies for the typo. The last word should be - "ideologues" not ideologies. Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 7 January 2021 7:50:14 AM
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Foxy,
Did you see Mr Opinion's 10 point plan for placating the Chinese? Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 7:55:03 AM
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Foxy,
In case you missed it here is Mr Opinion's 10 point plan for placating the Chinese: 1. Permit Huawei to operate unrestricted in Australia. 2. Rescind proposed federal legislation aimed at preventing Victoria and WA from signing up to China's Belt & Road Initiative. 3. Allow the Chinese to have unrestricted purchase rights to Australian industries and natural resources. 4. Ban Australian media from saying anything derogatory about China's strategic policies. 5. Withdraw Australian military from exercises in the South China Sea. 6. Rescind any alliances Australia has with the US and Japan. 7. Cease commenting on Chinese ambitions for Hong Kong and Taiwan becoming unified with the PRC. 8. Permit free migration for tens of millions of Chinese to Australia and allow them access to Australian business and property markets at a 50% discount. 9. Elevate former(?) affiliate of the CCP Gladys Liu to the position of Leader of the Liberal Party and Prime Minister of Australia. 10. Make Soot and the Boys crawl naked on their hands and knees to Emperor Xi and kiss his feet and plead for his forgiveness. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 8:32:33 AM
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Hi Paul
I think forced "neutrality" invites Australian appeasement. Australia's response do Authoritarian China's greatest military buildup since Japan in the 1930s involves at least 3 choices, eg: 1. to continue strongly in the Quadrilateral US-Japan-India alliance system http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrilateral_Security_Dialogue OR 2. continue strongly in the Quadrilateral AND Do an Israel ie. building up a self-reliant conventional and nuclear weapon deterrent OR 3. become "Finlandised" by China, effectively meaning Appeasement http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finlandization which seems to be increasingly trading on China's terms. Pete Posted by plantagenet, Thursday, 7 January 2021 9:58:36 AM
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plantagenet,
You forgot to mention our 4th choice: Mr Opinion's 10 point plan for placating the Chinese: 1. Permit Huawei to operate unrestricted in Australia. 2. Rescind proposed federal legislation aimed at preventing Victoria and WA from signing up to China's Belt & Road Initiative. 3. Allow the Chinese to have unrestricted purchase rights to Australian industries and natural resources. 4. Ban Australian media from saying anything derogatory about China's strategic policies. 5. Withdraw Australian military from exercises in the South China Sea. 6. Rescind any alliances Australia has with the US and Japan. 7. Cease commenting on Chinese ambitions for Hong Kong and Taiwan becoming unified with the PRC. 8. Permit free migration for tens of millions of Chinese to Australia and allow them access to Australian business and property markets at a 50% discount. 9. Elevate former(?) affiliate of the CCP Gladys Liu to the position of Leader of the Liberal Party and Prime Minister of Australia. 10. Make Soot and the Boys crawl naked on their hands and knees to Emperor Xi and kiss his feet and plead for his forgiveness. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 10:24:19 AM
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Paul, surely you understand why Huawai is such a touchy subject ?
Your policy would amount to a political surrender to the Central Kingdom. China has already given its list of demands on Australia. Are you suggesting we comply with those demands ? China does not consider Australia to be a sovereign country. Do you ? Posted by Bazz, Thursday, 7 January 2021 1:25:27 PM
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Here they come Foxy,
http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/china-s-soldiers-jump-into-action-to-get-themselves-ready-for-war/ar-BB1cwfKX?ocid=msedgntp Better put your face mask on; you don't want to catch the WuFlu do you? I told you we should have put Mr Opinion's 10 point plan into action. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 2:02:37 PM
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Dear Mr O,
Send your plan to the PM. I'm sure he'll give it the attention it deserves. Talking about it here on the forum won't achieve anything. Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 7 January 2021 2:41:59 PM
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Foxy,
Soot isn't interested. Something about him not wanting to get down naked on his hands and knees asking Xi for forgiveness. No pain, no gain I told him. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 2:51:38 PM
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Dear Mr O,
Sounds like you've got it all sorted. Posted by Foxy, Thursday, 7 January 2021 3:01:49 PM
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Foxy,
I can only try. You can lead a Soot Morrison to water, but you can't make it drink. Posted by Mr Opinion, Thursday, 7 January 2021 4:54:08 PM
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Dear Plantegenet,
«2. continue strongly in the Quadrilateral AND Do an Israel ie. building up a self-reliant conventional and nuclear weapon deterrent» Yes, this is my preferred option, EXCEPT that Israel itself is no longer what it used to be as they follow Australia's shameful and disastrous surrender of the Darwin port to China: http://www.beltandroad.news/2020/06/26/new-chinese-operated-haifa-port-a-game-changer-for-israeli-economy/ Never mind Israel's moral failure, never mind that America has been crippled - Continue working closely with other free countries AND do an "Israel" (getting our own nukes and other alternative weapons) AND pray: The Chinese regime crushes every religion in its path, so nothing is more strategically auspicious than aligning ourselves with God! Posted by Yuyutsu, Thursday, 7 January 2021 6:26:14 PM
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Loudmouth - you state - Pig-ignorant people, those still locked in the days of the White Australia Policy, commonly go on about China being overpopulated. On this site:
Response - No, society have moved on from the days of the White Australia Policy. However, if you wish to discuss via forum, please feel free to do so, and welcome a chat. Posted by SAINTS, Thursday, 7 January 2021 11:39:47 PM
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SAINTS,
To understand Foul-Mouth you need to recognise that he is in the The Forum's pro-China camp. I actually believe he is ether a Chinese agent planted on the Forum or a collaborator. Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 8 January 2021 6:34:15 AM
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MR O, how is it you got to be so smart?
Do you think it is a genetic thing? But since OLO has very few regular posters, you don't need to really worry about telling everyone (the few regulars) how smart your are. Try another line now and turn your self-declared OLO genius status into OLO legendary status Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 10:06:15 AM
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Chris Lewis,
I wasn't born smart. I got there by doing a lot of formal study. Anyone can do it if they put their mind to it. Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 8 January 2021 10:16:42 AM
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MR O,
but study does not produce uniform opinion. As you know, all sorts of perspectives emerge from the Arts, even when taught by the same people: left, right, green, centrist. Surely, education is only part of the picture, including your prowess. Come on, don't be modest. Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 10:49:46 AM
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Chris Lewis,
You know my educational background. What is yours? Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 8 January 2021 10:51:35 AM
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I have already told you.
But I don't need to explain myself to a clown. Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 10:56:23 AM
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Actually Mr O, I am a labourer and not educated. I left school at 16. The rest of my life was an illusion.
What of it? Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 11:01:06 AM
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Chris Lewis,
No probs. At least you're being truthful about it. Foul-Mouth told me he had about 8 degrees A, B, C & D (including several Arts) in areas M, N, O & P. I believed him, but then three months later he told me he had 8 degrees in H, I, J & K (NOT including Arts) in areas V, X, Y & Z. I think Foul-Mouth is tied up with the CCP. Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 8 January 2021 11:19:52 AM
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At last ! Some truth:
"I wasn't born smart." No indeed. And some people never get any smarter. Joe Posted by loudmouth2, Friday, 8 January 2021 11:32:43 AM
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Foul-Mouth,
Well at least I was smart enough to figure out that you are a Chinese operative or collaborator planted on The Forum to promote Chinese interests in Australia. Posted by Mr Opinion, Friday, 8 January 2021 11:46:08 AM
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How so, Mr O?
Please explain your last post about Joe. Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 11:50:08 AM
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Hi Chris,
Just to clarify: I used to be a Maoist, and clearly Misop, as an pre-adolescent, can't get past that. I abandoned all that, slowly, from the time I learnt how Mao murdered Lin Piao in 1971 (by howitzer), but completely by the time of the Tian An Men massacres. Hand in hand with that went a slow realisation (thanks to Solzhenitsyn) that Marxist socialism ALWAYS degenerated into an executioner-run fascism in the name of the people. In fact, ALL Utopias necessarily degenerate that way, Right and Left. So there is only Democracy left, imperfect, forever unfinished, full of surprises, twists and turns. I'm happy to contemplate political positions right across a broad centre, the wide brown land of Democracy. I firmly believe in it, although mongrels like Trumpf are not doing it any favours. And the current Chinese leadership/Mafia has never, and will never, promote it. Joe Posted by loudmouth2, Friday, 8 January 2021 12:02:33 PM
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Joe, yes, I just wanted to see how MR O could justify his inaccurate assumptions about your views.
I encourage Mr O to lift his game as a brilliant Arts student. Posted by Chris Lewis, Friday, 8 January 2021 12:30:18 PM
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Hi Paul1405
Here's a very relevant China POSSIBLY bribing a Liberal identity episode that some would rather forget. This concerns Andrew Robb, former Minister for Trade and Investment (2013–2016) in the Abbott and Turnbull Governments. Robb was also a former Federal Director of the Liberal Party. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Robb SMH reported "Andrew Robb's secret China contract: money for nothing" of 6 December 2017. See http://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/andrew-robbs-secret-china-contract-money-for-nothing-20171205-gzzaq5.html "A secret letter to former trade minister Andrew Robb reveals that his consulting deal with a company closely linked to the Chinese government contains terms so vague and ill-defined he gets paid $880,000 a year even if he does nothing. Former NSW Supreme Court judge Anthony Whealy, who examined the terms of the leaked letter from Chinese firm Landbridge to Mr Robb, said that "on the face of it, he is required not to do anything and still get a whacking great fee". The news comes as the Turnbull government moves to establish a new public register for people who seek to influence the Australian political process on behalf of foreign interests. ...Attorney-General George Brandis suggested on Tuesday that Mr Robb would have to sign up to the new register. ...Though the $880,000 yearly payment from Landbridge to Mr Robb – beginning shortly after he left parliament in 2016 – was revealed by Fairfax Media and Four Corners in June, the full details in the letter to Mr Robb were only recently leaked by a source with concerns about the nature of the deal. One government official described it as a "disgraceful" look for a former cabinet minister." MUCH MORE see http://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/andrew-robbs-secret-china-contract-money-for-nothing-20171205-gzzaq5.html Posted by plantagenet, Tuesday, 19 January 2021 9:28:49 AM
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The Opposition leader Anthony Albanese has said; "The Liberal Party needs to explain the connections which are clearly there and why it was that a senior minister of the Crown seems to have a relationship with this gentleman."
This guy is no ordinary businessman and the Liberal Party, does need to answer questions as to Mr Liu's access to government MP's and ministers.