The Prime Minister has described the recent
questions about MP Gladys Liu's suitability
for office as having a "grubby undertone."

The inference is that her loyalty is being questioned
because of her Chinese background and whether she does
have connections to mainland China. Whether ASIO did
warn the Liberal Party of her appointment and where
did the $40,000 donation that she received for the
Liberal Party come from?

Are these questions relevant - and should the PM
answer them - instead of brushing them aside?

foxy [excuse the no caps, problems with installation of new windows ideas any one]
This could well be part of my new thread
We are seeing bickering and verbal war but not the truth
China is a concern, we know that, both sides have seen members who are at least questionable
This is not, as scmomos rant says, racism
The concerns first came out of the woman's state liberal party
Never get results if we forget the very serious concern is about foreign interference in our politics
She should go
spell check put cap on name but even new key board will not do it

Questions are justified however actions are far more important. Whether it is asking a muslim pollie where his allegiance lies or Morrison his Christian faith or the Greens their Marxist connections. Nearly all Greens would be knocked out of Parliament if forced to disclose whether they would put Australia above the corrupt UN.

Australia now has what appears to be its own Manchurian Candidate in Gladys Liu and ScuMo is seemingly playing the race card to protect her against questions from Labor and others about her connexion with the Chinese Communist Party.

What the hell is going on here! Who the hell is the LNP government working for, the Australian people or Xi Jinping?

Dear Foxy,

Thanks for posting this discussion piece.

This is one of the most important issues I have seen put up on OLO and I expect to see some heated debate because this Gladys Liu situation is something that is of paramount importance to everyone. Especially ScuMo who is aware that the composition of the lower house is 76 LNP, 69 Labor, and 6 Xbenchers.

If he sacks Liu then after a byelection this could become 75 LNP, 70 Labor, and 6 Xbenchers. Yes, a hung parliament in which ScuMo will lose control of government unless he concedes to the whims of the Xbenchers. So I hope to see some fiery comments, especially from the right-wing conservative LNP types like Hasbeen, runner, Loudmouth, individual, mhaze, etc.

As Michelle Grattan and others have pointed out -
legitimate and important questions have been
raised about Gladys Liu.

These revolve around her past connections to
associations with direct or indirect links with
the Chinese Communist Party. And also the large
amounts of money she has been able to raise for
the Liberal Party. Then there's also the fact
that while it hasn't been officially confirmed
it is known that security authorities expressed
concern about some of the people she assembled.

As Michelle Grattan tells us - on a benign view,
Liu's story may be simple, as the Prime Minister
wants us to believe - a woman from Hong Kong who
overcame obstacles to get where she is. The ultimate
have-a-go to get-a-go narrative.

And, in the political furore currently surrounding her
Liu might be a victim of the growing worry about
Chinese influence and interference in this country.

However, there are concerns regarding Chinese interference
in Australian politics and it is potentially present and a
risk and this does need to be addressed.

Dear Foxy,

You said:

As Michelle Grattan tells us - on a benign view,
Liu's story may be simple, as the Prime Minister
wants us to believe - a woman from Hong Kong who
overcame obstacles to get where she is. The ultimate
have-a-go to get-a-go narrative.

This is why I referred to her as a Manchurian Candidate. What if those who helped her lift herself from an ordinary background and into the Australian parliament turn out to be none other than the members of the Chinese Communist Party. Good Lord, what if this was the case and she managed to become Prime Minister of Australia! All with the backing of the Chinese Communist Party.

Dear Mr Opinion,

Your concerns are understandable and I'm sure that
many would agree with you. Of course her reluctance
to admit her link to several CCP organisations when
interviewed by Andrew Bolt (the company one keeps
is relevant) was concerning. She now claims that she's
resigned from those organisations, and Mr Dutton
assures us that both the PM and himself would not
support her if there was any doubt about her loyalty.

I guess we have to wait and see what develops next
before we begin to panic. As Barnaby Joyce told
Alan Jones - the Gladys Liu situation is precisely
why we have ASIO.

Dear Foxy,

Have you seen the movie The Manchurian Candidate? I prefer the first Frank Sinatra-Lawrence Harvey version over the later Denzel Washington-Liev Schreiber remake.

runner highlights how far removed he is from both reality and the very base of Conservative politics
Remember the yellow peril? the red menace, both used by Conservatives endlessly
Morrison did a Donald Trump today, lied, he said he never called a Labor member shanghai what ever
This woman lied she is unfit to be in our parliament
She did not have a weak interview, she was trapped it to telling the truth
This truth will not go away China is planning a war, wants to rule us at least, this woman seems to be working for that too.

Misopinionated,

And some of us have read the book too. Please don't use the phrase 'Manchurian Candidate' again, it's not particularly clever. It's something that crossed the minds of most of us immediately this schemozzle started. But wow ! you've seen the film, or one of them. And you made the connection ! Genius !

It's unbelievable that anybody in Ms Liu's position wouldn't have done due diligence checks on any organisations that she was seeking to become a member of.

Right-wing, me ? I was a Maoist for twenty years, and a Marxist for maybe forty. I wouldn't vote for Trump in a fit. But if it pleases your little mind to categorise people easily as either-or, one-or-the-other, I-don't-have-to-think-about-it, then go ahead.

As you grow up, you'll learn that sometimes the world is not clear-cut, differences of opinion can be quite complex and not everybody should have to give a sh!t about you. Sorry for the bad news.

Joe

Dear Belly,

I totally agree with you. And Scumo knows she has to go as well. He's just more concerned about losing the numbers in the house of reps than he is about dumping Liu.

Dear Loudmouth,

So who are you trying to protect, Liu or yourself?

Dear Mr Opinion,

I do recall the film with Denzel Washington.
I suspect though you could be right - the
earlier version would have been better. I might
try to see if I can get hold of a copy.

Misopinionated,

I rest my case.

If you want to just troll, at least make it a bit subtle and biting.

Joe

Dear Foxy,

I might do the same. It was a very well made film and Angela Lansbury played an absolutely brilliant role as the loathful mother willing to sacrifice her own son for power.

Dear Loudmouth,

In respect to this particular topic it is obvious to everyone that you are the one guilty of being the troll. You just can't accept that your side has been caught out and that you are looking like a real loser.

PS No I have never read the novel The Manchurian Candidate. All my reading covers history, sociology, anthropology, and other humanities. For me these are a great narrative all about peoples across time and space. I am a big movie buff and I particularly enjoy film studies in theory and as a spectator.

One thing I can tell you for certain is that you and I are definitely not on the same level.

Misopinionated,

What don't you understand (sorry for the big word) about:

"It's unbelievable that anybody in Ms Liu's position wouldn't have done due diligence checks on any organisations that she was seeking to become a member of. " ?

I'll try to explain in simpler terms: I don't believe that Ms Liu didn't know what she was doing, in associating with organisations which were likely to have links to the CCP.

Too many big words and a sort of double negative. Okay, try this:

I think Ms Liu knew what she was doing, getting involved with groups linked to the CCP.

Get a secondary schooler to explain it to you if you are still confused.

Strange irony: that someone accused of links to the CCP is a Ult-Right supporter of the government. Maybe not: the CCP is a totalitarian organisation, after all. Do they teach 'totalitarian' in 1st Yr Soc ?

Joe

Scomo has put himself in the spotlight and he is not looking good
Right now LIBERALS are questioning the lady
No way round it, if she did not know she was a member of these two groups she lacks the intelligence to be in parliament
Yes Foxy the questions are justified and very much needed

runner, I take exception at your slur that Greens are less patriotic than other political activists in Australian society. What is known is people like you are beholden followers of the edicts of the Papist State in Rome.

//Nearly all Greens would be knocked out of Parliament if forced to disclose whether they would put Australia above the corrupt UN.// What type of torture would you recommend to extract such a confession? 'The Rack', a favourite of the religious lunatics.

There certainly are questions to be answers concerning this Liu woman. ScumO' can't simply give it the brush off as he is trying to do.

'runner, I take exception at your slur that Greens are less patriotic than other political activists in Australian society.'

fine Paul but it does not change the truth. The getup clowns and those who push for open borders, decarbonising the country and the sick safe schools social engineering are as bad or even worse than those belonging to certain clubs tied to China. Personally I would not care if Gladys Liu was sacked but their are many Greens who hate Australia much more than her.

runner,

You're entitled to express your opinion of course but
if you want to prove your point you need to back it
up with evidence.

'You're entitled to express your opinion of course but
if you want to prove your point you need to back it
up with evidence.'

since when have you ever listened to evidence Foxy? What's changed.

runner,

All you've ever provided are sweeping statements
and insults. A new approach from you would be
good.

The government made a mistake playing the race card.
It was wrong. The issues around Gladys Liu are about
her connections. Questions raised need to be answered.

The concern about China's interference in Australian
politics relates to the behaviour of an expansionist
power. It is not based on race.

And in terms of tactics as Michelle Grattan has pointed
out - has the Government overlooked that on the Liu
issue ALP Senate Leader Penny Wong - whose father is a
Malaysian of Chinese origin would be very unlikely to
join the front line of a race-based exercise.

Questions need to be answered as stated earlier.

cont'd ...

Gladys Liu should step down - until this matter is
cleared up. People have been asked to do so for much less.

runner, you are full of it! The likes of Bob Katter, Cory Bernardi and Pauline Hanson, plus a couple of others, people whose politics I don't much care for, but there is no way I would call them out as Un-Australian.

Who are Un-Australian are people like you, those that with a blinkered view that start questioning the loyalty of the opposition.

I don't know which crackpot church you belong to, you seem to be ashamed to say, but given your opinions and beliefs expressed here, they must be way out there and a far bigger danger to society than those you mention.

Yes Foxy this time the scomo shine has worn of, he would I think, like to take back some recent words
This mornings press agrees he introduced a very untrue claim and must now confront the truth, he lost ground with China
We did not need that open wound, it did not exist until Scomo did his impersonation of Trump
Paul, read runners contributions in this thread
He is not a source of believable comment

What on earth is wrong with the people of Chisolm voting in this woman! It just goes to show that Liberal voters are no different from Labor voters or any other party faithfuls - they vote for the party and don't take any notice of the candidate.

This woman was barking about 'xenopnobia' well before the election in regard to queries about the level of Chinese investment in Australia. Of course she could he a Chinese Communist Party plant; and stupid Australians have put her into our Parliament! And, our stupid Prime Minister is inferring that the Opposition is 'racist' for reacting to the situation in the same way his mob reacted to 'Shanghai Sam'.

The undemocratically enforced policy of multiculturalism continues to tear Australia apart, and expose its politicians as the ignorant buffoons and pawns of Beijing they are.

ttbn, that is a distinct possibility "a Chinese Communist Party plant" these things can be worked on for years to achieve the desired result. Many years back it was claimed that PM Harold Holt was in the pay of the Chinese Communist Government, money speaks all languages. In Holt's case his disappearance without trace at Cheviot Beach in 1967, at the height of the Vietnam War was extraordinary to say the least. It was rumoured that Holt had been "working" to pull Australian and American troops out of Vietnam. Outwardly he appeared very pro America, going on to say of US President Johnson "All the way with LBJ!". Johnson was having great difficulties with very strong anti Vietnam sentiment at home. Holt was trying to cultivate a special position of influence with Johnson. What was Holt's objective in that?

BTW, Maybe Holt was dead before he hit the water, the Aussie spooks were on the scene.

There's no question that Gladys Liu must answer to
Parliament because there are legitimate doubts
whether she owes "allegiance, obedience, or
adherence to a foreign power." These words are taken
from Section 44 of the Constitution.

Many of our federal politicians have been disqualified
from Parliament because they have turned out to be
citizens from another country. The question of allegiance
to a foreign power is a far weightier and more
crucial reason for disqualification.

Parliament must grapple with Gladys Liu's case.
There is enough evidence to indicate she may owe allegiance
to a foreign power. Parliament needs to refer her to the
High Court where the claims can be tested.

Otherwise a dark cloud will continue to hang over her
as long as she sits in the House of Representatives.

A dark cloud will also overshadow the Liberal Party,
because more and more people are wanting to know why
the Party stuck with Liu when it knew that intelligence
agencies had concerns strong enough to deter a former
Prime Minister (Malcolm Turnbull) from meeting with her
donors.

This case cannot and must not continue to be swept under
the rug. We all realise that the woman is an exceptional
fund raiser for the Liberal Party - but the question needs
to be asked - at what cost to our nation?

Once without a doubt, the Liberal coalition would be in the lead calling for a full investigation of this woman
Now twisted super conservatives are her support
In multiple threads about concerns with China, we saw real fears they may even invade
Yet the not my side mob are blind to this truth, she may very well be a spy
Fact, both sides ran people with Chinese/Taiwanese back grounds in her electorate
Surely proving at least there the Chinese have influence
Had Labor won? had this been about the ALP member? we would be seeing a far different Scomo

Labourites never worried about Bob Carr with all his Chinese connections. Really are hypocrites.

runner,

Prof. Carr is known to the Chinese Australian community
since his days as Premier of NSW and later as Australia's
Foreign Minister. However, the difference between him
and Gladys Liu is that Independent Chinese Australian
organisations have never lobbied Prof. Carr on behalf of
China or the Chinese Communist Party. And Prof. Carr did
not have the connections that Gladys Liu obviously did.
You need to get your facts straight.

One of the big questions hanging over the future of
Australian trade and investment with China is - whether
it is possible to engage more closely with Beijing
while ensuring national security, sovereignty and
self-respect.

In the Howard years the question was set to one side in
the belief that Australia did not need to choose between
prosperity and security.

This cosy assumption was ruptured once Xi Jinping came
to power in 2013 and made it clear that for China at least,
trade, investment, and security came bolted together.

Hence we need to ask questions concerning the Gladys Liu
appointment to our Parliament.

Runner what connection? you think his wife was Chinese? do you in fact think
Here right now, we see my statement above confirmed, a 1970,s Liberal would be in boots and all, requiring her to be investigated
Some are so blindly loyal, to one side of politics truth is abandoned
I charge runner with that crime
If patriotism and love of country are secondary to one side of politics this country is doomed

Senior Liberals were warned against preselecting Gladys Liu for the seat of Chisholm before this year’s federal election because there were concerns about her links to the Chinese Communist Party. They were told it would not be wise for the Liberal Party to preselect her.

Liu has admitted to previous associations with three groups with links to China’s covert political influence operations.

So what should the Prime Minister do now?

Dear Foxy,

You asked 'So what should the Prime Minister do now?'

That really is the $64 question and a real conundrum for ScuMo. He has been forever playing off one party against another and at last it has backfired and he is now been caught between the devil and the deep blue sea. Serves him right.

If he asks Liu to resign he will lose the LNP majority in the lower house and incur the wrath of the Chinese Communist Party. If Liu refuses to resign he will be left as an impotent head of government with a majority that has a member who is linked to the Chinese Communist Party and he will be constantly confronted by a whole bunch of MPs including some from the LNP screaming for blood and a probable no-confidence vote that might just get carried by the house.

Wow! This is history making stuff.

Dear Mr Opinion,

It certainly appears to be history-making stuff.
What I can't help wondering though is - how come
we're not getting more responses and contributions
to this discussion. Do the strong supporters of
the Liberal Party on this forum - have nothing to say?

Dear Foxy,

You asked 'Do the strong supporters of the Liberal Party on this forum - have nothing to say?'

I think they're all dumbfounded and totally lost for words and in dread of what is more than likely to happen. I don't think they want to show their faces around me especially because they have been forever calling me a juvenile idiot for saying that Australia's politicians, bureaucrats and business class are in the pocket of the Chinese. I suppose I could skite by saying 'I told you so' but I won't. Never kick someone when he's down.

I bet ScuMo and his inner circle are locked up all weekend working out what to do about Liu. I'm looking forward to an interesting week with lots of surprises and twists and turns. I can't wait for the movie to come out: Danny de Vito as ScuMo and Jackie Chan in drag as Liu. I can see a few Oscar nominations coming up there. All we need is an actor who looks like Adolf Hitler to play Peter Dutton, who only has one line telling the PM 'I've got ya back mate'.

Right now scomo must be wishing he kept his mouth shut
IF he takes no action nothing he ever says about truth and accountability will be trusted
She may well go within weeks

The vixen says:

*...cont'd ...

Gladys Liu should step down - until this matter is
cleared up. People have been asked to do so for much less...*

The other opinion is, she should be exicuted as a spy.

Definition of spy:

a person employed by a government or other organization to secretly obtain information on an enemy or competitor.

At the very least, imprison the traitor!

Dan.

Diver Dan,

All that is being questioned in the Gladys
Liu case is whether there is enough evidence to
indicate that she may have allegiance to a
foreign power. And the general consensus
seems to be that she must answer to Parliament.

If there is enough evidence over
allegiance to a foreign power, then Parliament
needs to refer her to the High Court where the
claims can be tested.

Otherwise, as people suggest, a dark cloud will
hang over her as long as she sits in the House
of Representatives.

And a dark cloud will over
shadow the Liberal Party, because more and more
people will want to know why it stuck with Liu
when it knew that intelligence agencies had
concerns strong enough to deter a former PM
(Malcolm Tuyrnbull) from meeting with her donors.

I would like to Thank the people who added their
views to this discussion. I see no further point
in continuing with it. The matter is now in
government hands to resolve.

I feel confident that the right decision will be
made for us all.

I look forward to our next discussion.

Thanks Foxy I leave with the firm view she should be investigated
And that the issue has left Morrison looking very silly and not sure he can be trusted

Dear Belly,

In reality this entire affair is messy and fragmented.
While both major political parties cry outrage, they
both like and take Chinese money. And neither defines
what sort of Chinese influence they will or won't
accept.

Gladys Liu has provided the Liberal Party not only
money but being able to mingle with the rich and the
powerful. Her energy, access and fund-raising - the
very things that brought her to the Liberal Party's
attention are now a curse rather than a blessing.

Dear Foxy,

I have been saying for a long time that Australia has a Chinese future and I think Liu is just the sort of harbinger that supports my concerns. ScuMo is not only in damage control but his tenure as PM and the office of PM are both now tarnished by association with a woman who could turn out to be an agent of the Chinese Communist Party. This drama will not go away unless ScuMo gets Liu to resign both from parliament and the Liberal Party. Liu is carrying too much political baggage, especially when she is dragging that baggage into the very heart of our freedom and democracy - Parliament.

Foxy, Mr Opinion yes the very real fact is both sides, and lots more maybe, take Chinese money
Again, if this was 1970, the Liberal Coalition would be leading the charge for a full and open, investigation
IF our country's trade with China is more important than our security it concerns me
Even local government has seen such as this.

Foxy,

There are legitimate questions that can be asked of Mrs Liu and her potential allegiance to Communist China. However, until these questions have been investigated and it is shown that she has acted against Australia's interests the howls from the labor party that she be expelled are rank hypocrisy.

Labor's Sam Dastardly was fiercely protected even after he clearly acted against Aus interests, but what brought him down was his active soliciting for payments for personal costs and massive donations to the labor party from the chinese government.

That Liu grew up in China and that the Chinese government is active in the local community makes the linkage hardly surprising. What is absent so far is any indication of liu acting for the Chinese against Aus, and until then the cries for her expulsion are pure political opportunism.

Also given Labor's past history of using Chinese and Japanese racism against free trade deals etc, Labor's claims of purity of purpose in this case are laughable.

Even screwball Left 'The Age' newspaper thinks the Chinese woman should stand down and be properly investigated. Of course, that could be just because she is not Labor.

It is very naive to think you will be able to make a direct connection
from the Unity Front Work Dept to Ms Lui if she is involved.
There are a number of cutouts via different organisations with the aim
of relationships between China and Australia, scientific, student,
industry etc etc.

To understand the complexity I suggest that you read
The Silent Invasion by Clive Hamilton. I think most libraries have it by now.
I can assure you it is an eyeopener and should be a compulsory read for pollies.
Of particular interest is the merging of military research between
Australia and China.

Dear Foxy,

It's looking like this topic might still a have a way to go.

Liu doesn't have to answer questions to confirm that she was affiliated with the organs of the Chinese Communist Party when she was running for selection as a Liberal federal politician. That is an absolute given and nobody is questioning that fact. What she needs to explain is why she should be permitted to continue as an MP given that she was affiliated with the Chinese Communist Party.

Also, I would like to raise questions surrounding what knowledge ScuMo had on Liu during the election. Wouldn't he have known that she had been affiliated with the Chinese Communist Party? I suppose he was so desperate to win the election that he was willing to turn a blind eye to the ramifications.

http://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/intelligence-agencies-pinned-parliament-hack-on-beijing-report-20190916-p52rou.html
Read this link, you can find the story in other publications
Fifth columnists do not always understand that is what they are
I remind Shadow Minister, once his side of politics would lead the charge looking for answers from this woman

http://www.smh.com.au/national/something-has-shifted-morrison-senses-a-tipping-point-is-at-hand-20190915-p52reo.html
Read too this well thought out report on Scomos slip, slip it was
After saying he never used racist terms in relation to Sam [another fool] he has seen sentiment shift
Now why the links?
Surely in any discussion posting links to back an opinion is ok
And posting links to prove that story is not true should also be ok

It does appear that this discussion is not quite finished
yet.

I'm pleased that more valid points are being raised.

And of course we have to wait and see how all this is
going to play out.

On the one hand - it's fair to ask who her political
mates are of Gladys Liu. What her connections are.
Because if she was not aware of who her connections
were - then she's plainly inept. And if she was aware -
then is this the type of person we want in our Parliament?

Her connections have been clearly demonstrated on record
that she did have links to the United Front Work Department's
Guangdong provincial branch of the China Overseas Exchange
Association (an overseas propaganda and influence outfit headed
by high-ranking communist party officials). Documents reveal
that Liu has been a council member. She also had links with
several other suspect organisations including being an
honorary President.

Therefore questioning by Labor and the crossbench members of
Parliament on this is both legitimate and reasonable as even
conservatives like Andrew Bolt, Niki Savva, and others confirm.

What is concerning is that our PM and his team dismiss the
fact that ASIO warned the Liberal Party that neither the PM
or their departments should join the guest list of Liu's
functions. That I find troublesome.

Is pre-selection in the Liberal Party determined by how
much money you can raise - and by your ability to chat-up
rich-listers and not by the calibre of your thinking,
your humanity, or by your capacity to contribute honest,
constructive socially cohesive ideas to policy or your
demonstration of good faith and trust?

Of course, this case may be resolved if it turns out that
Gladys Liu is of no further use to the United Front ...
they may well cut her loose.

Dear Foxy,

You wrote:

'Of course, this case may be resolved if it turns out that
Gladys Liu is of no further use to the United Front ...
they may well cut her loose.'

I totally disagree. Politically speaking she is damaged goods and cannot be trusted. The Chinese Communist Party will definitely have something on her that they will be able to use down the track in order to get her to do their bidding. It could be some secret she has that they know of or pressure they could put on her relatives in China. Just image if she ever became a member of the cabinet or God forbid the PM! She has to go and the rules should be rewritten to make sure this sort of thing cannot happen again. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that the Chinese Communist Party hasn't already been able to get to other members of the LNP government.

Dear Mr Opinion,

Gladys Liu's usefulness is now flawed. A shadow hangs
over her - and therefore she will never rise to a
top position because of trust issues. Also this
should be a good lesson for the Liberal Party.

I suspect that they paid her back by choosing her for
pre-selection for Chisholm, expecting her not to win.
Jennifer Yang (Labor candidate) was supposed to win.
I would be very surprised if Liu's career in politics
did not end soon.

Dear Foxy,

But wouldn't you agree that the really big problem is that if Liu resigns it will mean that ScuMo loses a majority in the house of reps? Isn't this really what the drama is all about?

Dear Mr Opinion,

Of course - that's a big part of it.
However, he may not have a choice.
He may be forced to act by members of
his own party - the Opposition, and the public.

Interesting times ahead.

Dear Foxy,

I understand that but isn't the numbers game the real reason he is refusing to ask Liu to resign? It would be an admission on his part that he and his party let an agent of the Chinese Communist Party into Parliament and I doubt if any of the six Xbenchers would give their support to him if the Opposition moved to have a vote of no-confidence.

Foxy et al,

1 No one can force Liu to quit unless she is convicted of a crime just remember the odious Craig Thompson remained on the bench until the next elections. So far there is only innuendo.
2 Even if Liu quit and labor won the seat, the coalition would still have 76 seats and a majority.

Dear Shadow Minister,

I thought the house currently comprised 76 LNP / 69 Labor / 6 Xbenchers.

Can you please check your figures and get back to me?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Australian_federal_election

Nope,

You were thinking of 2016

P.S. Katter also would not give labor the time of day.

Dear Shadow Minister,

You are correct. I was looking at old figures.

Dear Shadow Minister,

There's more than innuendo.

There is evidence of her links to the Chinese
Communist Party. Her associations of more than
12 years, as Bolt pointed out when she denied
it.

Then even prior to her pre-selection - her actions
in trying to - repealing laws regarding foreign investment
(especially in the purchase of farming land by the Chinese).
Also her attempts to encourage Chinese parents to send their
children to " camps" on the Chinese mainland. And the list
goes on.

More than innuendo. Judged by her actions and the company
she's kept.

The Liberal Party can "encourage"her to resign
until this matter is tested in the High Court.

And it should be.

Andrew Bolt points out in today's issue of the
Herald Sun:

At the 2017 Victorian Liberal Party Conference,
the Party's Eastern Multicultural Branch, of which
Gladys Liu was President proposed a motion that
would make foreign investment in agribusiness and
agricultural land easier - without approval by the
Foreign Investment Review Board.

And, like the Prime Minister now, the Branch played
the race card:

It also accused public attitudes toward foreign investment
as being driven by xenophobia.

Laura Tingle's take on Gladys Liu is:

Apart from anything else, Liu's job application shows
her at the least as a more than competent and determined
political operator - and a long way removed from the
picture of a victim who had overcome obstacles being painted of her by the Prime Minister at the end of the week.

Dear Foxy,

Wow! Going by the descriptions you just posted on Liu she's starting to look more like Mata Hari every day. God help us all if Liu doesn't get the boot. Goodbye dog on a tuckerbox, Hello panda on a stick.

you and Andrew Bolt Foxy. Wow must be a first!

Andrew Bolt on this issue mirrors the concern others have
The problem is not that she is a Liberal
Not that she is Chinese
The problem is her first interview is a train wreck, of miss truth
And her second only added to the wreckage
Support for her based on her being either Liberal or Chinese is blindness

Going by the standards ask Of Gladys I doubt any Chinese candidate would be able to answer honestly questions about loyalty to China if they still have family members in China or Hong Kong. The evil dictatorship in China would ensure these families got a hard time. This dilemma is one ignored by the proponents of multi culturalism. As I said earlier the same would apply to many muslims. If she has broken the law she should be sacked. If not the question of loyalty to Australia should also be posed to all pollies, As I said before the Greens by and large are a treacherous mob. The Liberal party itself had the likes of Turnbull, Banks, Pyne and other regressives who would happily give away power to the corrupt United nations and the gw scammers. The Greens would likely be the greatest traitors and well above those to fearful to call China the dictatorship it is. In fact the UN and China have much in common.

runner,

What on earth are you on about now.

Blaming multiculturalism? The UN, the Greens?

You are sounding more and more deranged.

I have two words for you:

GO AWAY.

Dear Foxy,

It is interesting that Morrison chose to outright lie about the use of the term Shanghai Sam referring to the disgraced former Labour senator.

http://www.smh.com.au/national/something-has-shifted-morrison-senses-a-tipping-point-is-at-hand-20190915-p52reo.html

As the article above explains this is hardly the first time Morrison has engaged in direct untruths. He really is getting shown up as duplicitous and capable of being Trumpesque in his brushing off the instances when he gets found out.

I do feel we are different to the Yanks in that it will very quickly wear thin with the Australian people.

Hi Foxy

'GO AWAY.'

becoming more and more totalitarianism. Who do you think you really are? I know you become deranged when people disagree with you but for one who preaches tolerance you display the opposite.

There is a real problem with Chinese in Australian politics.
The Central Kingdom states that all of Ancestral Chinese descent owe
allegiance to China.
The basis for this belief is that only China is a sovereign country.
All other countries are vassals of the Central Kingdom.
This has recently been reaffirmed by Pres Xi Jingping.
China was not a signatory to the Treaty of Westphalia in 1698.
That treaty defines what is a sovereign country and how its borders are defined.

This is the reasoning behind the seizure of the Sth China Sea islands and reefs.
It explains how they can just bring a drilling rig into Vietnamese
waters without even telling the Vietnamese government.
It explains how they can contact relatives in China and threaten them.
It explains how they can order other countries ships & planes out of
the Sth China Sea. They ignore them so far.

Therefore all Chinese everywhere are expected to accept any "requests."
Therefore can any Chinese be members of parliament ?
Can they ever not be dual citizens ?

On the TV tonight caught the end of an item about a milk company in
Tasmania has had its product banned in China.
There is a Chinese bid at present to take over the company.
Strange that ?

Dear SteeleRedux,

To my way of thinking it appears that ScuMo has become so conditioned to lying that he cannot tell the difference between a truth and a lie. When he is caught out for lying he refuses to admit it and creates another lie to cover up the previous lie. The sad part is that I think that he really is unaware that he is lying simply because it is all he knows how to do. I think he might actually have mental issues and be in need of psychiatric treatment.

"Senator Paterson responded by saying “it’s very important that we draw a very sharp distinction” between Ms Liu’s situation and Mr Dastyari, who was forced to resign from the Senate in late 2017 after he declined to denounce China’s position on the South China Sea.

“He was a lobbyist for Huang Xiangmo’s citizenship, calling the Immigration Department twice to personally check on the progress of that application.

“He hired out the media centre at the Commonwealth parliamentary offices, stood in front of a crest of the Australian government alongside Huang Xiangmo, and called for an end to the bipartisan Australian government position on the South China Sea and called for the government to adopt the Chinese government’s position,” Senator Paterson said."

Try reading say the SMH, Nine free to read news site, oh WAIT Sky/Fox!
The story broke there
And it was an unhappy BOLT who took to her
Fifth columnists some times do not know that is what they are
The woman's actions are not like Sams, he did not threaten national security

'To my way of thinking it appears that ScuMo has become so conditioned to lying that he cannot tell the difference between a truth and a lie'

It amazes me Mr Opinion that someone who has been taught there are no absolutes suddenly finds a conscience and now proclaims truth and lies. Amazing!

Dear Shadow Minister,

I know you are flying the Sam kite as a distraction but are you claiming this as a reason for Scomo so blatantly lying about having used the term Shanghai Sam?

Or is it a little whataboutism you always chide others for employing?

If neither I'm wondering why you have raised it?

Mr Opinion if your comments ever get even near as untrue as runners you can expect a tap on the shoulder from me, a very unlikely event on current form
Think folks! had this woman been a LABOR member you mob would be frothing at the mouth in rage.
That being the truth consider this
Are you a patriotic Australian?
Are you concerned about the China threat
IF there is no threat why is this woman trying to tell us she can not remember being a member of these two groups for 12 years

Belly said;
The woman's actions are not like Sams, he did not threaten national security

Yes he did, he told Huang Xiangmo to leave his phone inside while they
went outside to talk so he could warn him that ASIO was interested in him.

Dear Bazz,

That is not true. Sam Dastyari explained what
really happened on Q&A last night. The media
got it wrong.

Dear Shadow Minister,

Sam Dastyari has paid the price including owning up
to his actions and explaining them. He has quit politics.

Gladys Liu on the other hand need to make a statement
to Parliament and explain all of her previous links
to the Chinese Communnist Party and the undeclared
donations. She first denied any involvement with
the Chinese Communist Party before later back-tracking.
She has a case to answer.

Even Paterson said - Liu - should have been "more judicious
in her associations particularly with the Chinese
Community Organisations".

The questions are justified.

runner,

GO AWAY.

I will be happy to continue this conversation
when you can do so in a civilised manner.

Foxy, that might be a latter day wriggle.
I don't remember where I read/saw that but it was authentic in my memory; hmm thats a point !

Foxy

It takes more than a Hilary type dummy spitter to cause me to GO AWAY. Good to see though that you no longer 'believe all women'. Or is it just conservative Chinese women who are not to be believed. You really are confused and very inconsistent.

Belly,

Sam Dastardly clearly threatened national security by agitating for Australia to acquiesce to China's illegal seizure of the South china sea islands. That China was happy to dole out $400 000 to him would indicate that he gave them far more than polite conversation.

Liu by contrast has done nothing even comparable. Foxy's example of relaxing restrictions on foreign acquisition of property would reflect the views of many fiscal conservatives.

Dear Shadow Minister,

I'm going to sound like a broken record here - but
the fact remains that in her own application for
pre-selection to the Party Liu declared she raised
more than $1 million by organising functions and
bringing guests to fund-raising dinners. Apart from
anything else her job application shows her at the
least as more than a competent and determined
political operator and a long way removed from the
picture of a victim that the Prime Minister is
painting.

This raises the question of what people think they
are buying with such huge amounts of money?

And in turn that makes the underlying question of
what's been happening in the Liberal Party in
Victoria not all that different from NSW even if
there have not been ALDI plastic bags full of cash
involved.

And here we are now once again back to the point
where political parties are compromised and a
federal integrity commission is still not a first
order issue.

Sam Dastyari is right to say that the entire culture
of donations and fund-raising has been completely
corrupted. Action needs to be taken by our PM.

Dear all,

I think I have discovered the reason the LNP MPs don't want Gladys Liu to stand up in Parliament to explain anything. Just watch this video:

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/video/2019/apr/16/audio-of-2016-interview-with-liberal-candidate-gladys-liu-video

runner,

I don't know any female dummy spitters.
But if you're talking about American politicians -
then there's one heck of one currently as
President.

As for not believing conservative Chinese women?
I don't label people by their politics or
etnicity. I judge by their actions and behaviour.

Once again - to you, I shall repeat -

BE NICE
OR GO AWAY.

Dear Steele,

The Prime Minister needs to clear up the shadow
that's hanging over Gladys Liu and her connections
to the Chinese Communist Party. She's been on
the Board of their organisations, she's tried
to influence policy decisions in foreign
investment, she's even attempted to influence
elections by giving instructions in Chinese
languages telling people how to vote, (which the
electoral commission should investigate), and she's
been involved in trying to influence Chinese
parents to send their children to "camps" on
the Mainland of China. The list goes on.

Explanations are needed. Also greater transparency
of donations are a must.

If you have a look at the video I posted earlier you can see why LNP MPs don't Gladys Liu speaking up for herself in Parliament. She can hardly put two words together that make any sense. Maybe she could do it in Chinese.

I think this is what Labor might be trying to do: put her on show in order to ridicule her thus making the government look stupid in the process.

PS Can anybody tell me how to upload a link into my post?

Dear Mr Opinion,

Leave out the "s" in https.

It should then work.

Have a look at this video and tell me how you think Gladys Liu would go trying to explain things in Parliament:

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/video/2019/apr/16/audio-of-2016-interview-with-liberal-candidate-gladys-liu-video

Glady's is opposed to same sex marriage, cross dressing and the sick 'safe schools' indoctrination of kids. Wow Mr Opinion she just went up in my estimation. No wonder the Chinese population voted for her. As I stated before the Greens are far more dangerous to this country than her conservative views. Thanks for the post confirming this.

Dear runner,

I think you missed the point (as usual). I'll put that down to your incapacity to think critically as a result of your poor education and that you are probably thinking to yourself 'Wow! Gladys Liu's English is as good as mine.'

runner can not be nice, old age has taken his ability to do that away
SM you highlight concerns about Sam but give your sides women a get out off Scott free?
Are you fairdinkum, is her apparent lies and maybe some thing much worse ok
Because she is a Liberal
Balance is needed here
I would not want to be in the trenches with a few here, they put country behind party

runner, she didn't say if she supported paedophile cardinals like many conserves on here do. Need to chuck her out until its clear if she is, or is not a Chinese Communist Party plant.

runner,

It seems that you've found a kindred spirit in
what Gladys Liu is against. However, how about
her links to the Chinese Communist Party?
Does that also sit well with you?

Hi Belly,

According to SM;

"relaxing restrictions on foreign acquisition of property would reflect the views of many fiscal conservatives."

Selling Australia down the river, that's what these conservative are all about, as long as it means a quid in their pocket! Did you catch the 'baby food' racket the fiscal conservatives also support. The ScumO' government is likely to agree to the sale of Bellamy's baby food formula company to China. Australian infants will be starving, whilst Chinese babies grow fat on our products.
No doubt this Liu woman will be pushing for the sale, The Chinese government is in favour.

"A $1.5 billion bid for the Australian organic infant formula company Bellamy's by Chinese dairy giant China Mengniu Dairy Company is shaping as a fresh test of the government's stance on foreign ownership,"

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/meet-the-chinese-students-making-up-to-3000-a-week-selling-australian-vitamins-and-baby-formula-back-to-china-2016-6#x1

'It seems that you've found a kindred spirit in
what Gladys Liu is against. However, how about
her links to the Chinese Communist Party?
Does that also sit well with you?'

at this point no Foxy. I am yet to see any evidence of her influencing Government with dictatorial communist methods or policy. On the other hand plenty of regressives in Liberal, Labour and the Greens have handed power to the unelected UN dictatorship. I think if Glady's did not believe in democracy she would be far more likely to have backed and joined the Greens.

runner,

Liu's links of 12 years to the Chinese Communist
Party are on record. Her actions in Victoria
on their behalf speak for themselves. Why are
you defending this woman - and yet making
sweeping statements about other political people
and parties - that is the question.

Gladys Liu MP is the LNP's elephant in the room. Why don't they want her to go? Why do they refuse to discuss it? Why do they keep on supporting her? Are they that deeply in the pockets of the Chinese that they have to turn a blind eye to fact that she has affiliations with the Chinese Communist Party?

Enough is enough! Whether you support Liberals, Nationals, Labor, Greens, or Independents, we have to draw the line with the Gladys Liu situation. Haven't we sacrificed enough to China to keep the economy afloat? Do we have to sacrifice our freedom and democracy as well!

runner, does your church have a strong affiliation with any foreign government? Like most organised religions in Australia their headquarters are often to be found in another country.

Paul surely runner is not a member of any Church, his words are often not Christian
Darwin Harbor, sold by a Labor was it? government, to China
Prior to WW2 this country, even America, had Nazi groups openly working here, some born and bred here
Now if this woman has nothing to hide WHY did she LIE
In the end this thread PROVES conservatives BLINDLY without thought are standing by their side no matter what impact it has on our country

I just saw on ABC News that the Chinese State media (an arm of the Chinese Communist Party - nudge nudge wink wink know what I mean) has praised ScuMo for supporting Gladys Liu and allowing her not to answer questions about her affiliation with the Chinese Communist Party - nudge nudge wink wink know what I mean.

Come on ScuMo, give us the thumbs up and a big 'Howz that!'

Hi Belly and Mr O,

I don't want you blokes mentioning the infatuation the patron saint, and founding father of the Liberal Party, 'Pig Iron' Bob Menzies had with Nazism in Germany, after a visit lasting several weeks there in 1938. Menzies said ""abandonment by the Germans of individual liberty … has something rather magnificent about it". Despite almost 100% enlistment by eligible males in 1914/18 to fight the Hun for king and country, Robert Menzies failed to enlist. Then in 1942 Menzies famously proposed the 'Brisbane Line' whereby Australia would surrender all territory north of Brisbane to the Japanese.

Maybe Ms liu is being a good Liberal and following the Menzies principles.

Dear Paul1405,

It's good that you raised the point that what our PMs do can sometimes have international political ramifications. I have just read some of what the Chinese state media has said in it's praise of ScuMo's handing of the Liu debate. The Chinese Communist Party through this media release is using the Liu debacle as a weapon against America, suggesting that the Australian government is showing support for China's position in the trade war by advocating the acceptance of Gladys Liu as an MP.

What is ScuMo going to do here? Is this the point where he has to declare whether he is with the US or with China? He now has 1.2 million Chinese Australians looking at him with the expectation that he will throw his support behind their ancestral motherland China. (Keep in mind that in addition to this 1.2 million Chinese Australians there are also those other Chinese in Australia viz Chinese with permanent residency visas who are not Chinese Australians but in fact Chinese and the Chinese born in Australia who are not Chinese Australians but are Australians. That's a lot of Chinese who have empathy for their ancestral motherland in one form or another.) And now the Chinese Communist Party is using them through the agency of the LPN government to attack America's position in the trade war.

I'm sure Trump and his cabinet are watching to see what ScuMo is doing and I fear that if Liu doesn't go then the US will.

So why is China supporting Mrs Lui ? If she is an Australian citizen
and she cannot have other than Australian citizenship and be an MP,
then it must be because she is of Chinese ancestry.
Or could it be that the Central Kingdom considers her to be a Chinese citizen ?
I think it is as simple as that.

The question now resolves into what is the status of an MP who says
they are not a Chinese citizen but China does not accept that declaration ?
Can that MP remain an MP ? Is there a precedent ?

If the Yanks were to take another $20 billion in Aussie exports, we could love them just as much as we love the Huna Muna's.

Also keep in mind that if Liu is forced to resign it will probably mean that a whole lot of votes from Australia's Chinese will flow to the Labor Party in future elections, which of course would be absolutely devastating for the LNP at the next election plus it would probably happen at the State level as well.

Foxy

I am not defending Glady's in any shape or form. I have been all along making the point that many people including Politicians have affiliations with dubious organisations. How many Labour pollies have affiliation with the getup clowns, CFMEU and Antifa thugs. How many of our unis continue to be dumbed down by the influence of Chinese money and ties with the Confucius institute. Many Chancellors of unis are far greater traitors than a naïve woman in the Liberal party who has done nothing illegal. Yes I would prefer not to have the communist influence but I suspect the issue with this woman is 99% local politics.

runner, you failed to mention all those religious nutters, and their pseudo religious affiliations to foreign churches! Where is your churches HQ? Rome, Salt Lake City, pray tell where! Who barks out the orders to the foot solders on the ground?

Paul/Mr Opinion no doubt you both know the usual suspects are defending her
Fact is they belittle them selves in doing so an open full investigation of every such case no less
Amusing to see but sad too

Foxy,

Given that Rhiannon had far far stronger links to communist Russia than Liu that well known, but stayed in parliament(s) for roughly 2 decades.

I would of thought you would be thrilled Paul to have socialist/communist infiltrate the main parties. As I said its all about politics. If the regressives really cared about foreign influence they would denounce the corrupted universities, the idiotic UN agreements which do away with Australia's sovereignty and the money hungry gw alarmist who want to de industralise our nation. The warmist alarmist/fraudsters, the champions of the corrupt UN, the suppliers of money to terrrorist groups in Palestine are every bit as big a threat and as treachorous as anyone else in this nation. That puts the Greens on top or at least close.

Shadow Minister,

Rhiannon is not longer in Parliament. Gladys Liu
is. Rhiannon did not raise money from Communist
sources for her party. Liu did.

Our Prime Minister has won praise in one of the
Chinese Co0mmunist Party's key media mouthpieces -
The Global Times - which is regarded as a key
mouth piece for the Chinese Communist Party. It has
published a searing opinion piece on the embattled
MP's Gladys Liu's political controversy.

The Global Times, which is fiercely nationalistic
and a frequent critic of Australia has published
an opinion piece praising Mr Morrison's staunch
support for Liu.

That I find very disconcerting.

Obviously you don't. Which I find rather surprising.
But I suppose - predictable. "My Party do-or die!"

If this behaviour continues - it just may, whither and
die.

cont'd ...

Sorry - it should read - wither, (dry up),
not - whither (what place).

I rest my case any open minded honest look at the protection racket being run by the very right here will agree
Had she been Labor they would call for her head
Never forget that
She is under the protection of people who willingly let her off because she is one of theirs
The women could well be a full on known spy and these folk would protect her still

Chinese government, threat to Morrison?
Warning to Bolt?
Free speech first victim when Tory,s use same words as Chinese Communist Party
http://www.news.com.au/finance/business/media/tv-lynching-chinese-state-media-slams-gladys-liu-interview-warns-australia-not-to-be-pawn-of-us/news-story/cee8d91c63e0010fe5c3dcd4b046f583

I wonder if the CIA will fill ScuMo in on Gladys Liu when he is over in the US.

meanwhile right under our nose China builds hundreds of new coal powered stations and we have the totally ignorant trying to stop any from being built in Australia. Why would we worry about spies when we have such fraudsters and fools on open display.

runner,

The whole point is - who is allowing this and at
what cost?

the real point Foxy is that if we should be concerned about China (and I believe we should), why on earth would we allow the Chinese to control our universities and teach their propaganda and yet ban courses on Western civilisation. Western civilisation with all its faults is miles ahead of any socialist/communist ideologies which have always ended in murderering those who stand for freedom.

to de industralise ourselves and make it impossible through unreliable power as well as high prices for business's to operate while China goes on its merry way is totally idiotic. To use of pseudo science to justify this madness defies any logic. China and India will continue to laugh at our stupidity especially considering we supply them with coal.

Watch 3 hours of ww2 news real DVDs it focused on the Japaneses invasion of China
7 years before Pearl Harbor
It even, honestly, looked at some opinions that we should not have helped them, [silly stuff they helped us]
Far from that China now, then the USA thought, under a centrist ruler, now under a one ruler one country
Bent on? who truly knows
But again and again my thought is why would the right of reality crowd hide a possible fifth columnist?
[Just think, had the Chinese not held up so many Japanese fighting in their country how much harder the American Island hoping would have been]

Dear Foxy and runner,

Re coal fired power plants in China: How many of them are powering military-industrial complexes as China rushes to outdo America as the world's most powerful nation?

I'd once again like to Thank You all for your
contributions to this discussion however for
me it has now well and truly run its course.

See you on another discussion. Feel free to continue
with this one if you want. However, I've decided to
go.

Once again - Thanks.

A good way to end this topic is if we can all leave feeling that a Chinese Australia is looking more and more like a reality. Take a look at the headlines of this news article that was just published on the web:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-21/china-new-pacific-allies-solomon-islands-kiribati-taiwan/11536122

How long before China starts putting military bases in the South Pacific, creating a wall to the north of Australia that runs from the South China Sea to the eastern tip of the Melanesian archipelago? Maybe we will need all the Gladys Lius we can get when our government has to capitulate to China's demands that Australia becomes part of a Chinese empire led by Xi Jinping.

Well, at least I'll be able to say 'I told you so.'

No prob Mr O, the Liberals will take a leaf out of their founding father 'Pig Iron' Bob's book, and cede all Aussie territory north of Brisbane, goodbye Indy, to the Chinese, aka Japan WWII. No prob, 25 million Aussies should do okay with 250 million new neighbours.

ScuMO' has developed some new government telly adds to get you in the mood. BTW it also plays the new Aussie national anthem. You will need to play this clip to yourself at least 100 times a day, its a new law, Glad got through the parliament with One Nation support.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DqvweTYTI0

Dear Paul1405,

I don't think it would take long before the 3 million Chinese living south of Brisbane decided they wanted to join hands with the 250 million of their brothers and sisters north of Brisbane. Like I've been saying for a long time, Australia has a Chinese future. It's not a matter of if, it's just a matter of when.

Dear Mr Opinion,

I have worked and lived along-side people of
diverse cultures and backgrounds all of my
life. Chinese people have been part and parcel
of this country for hundreds of years. They
have contributed so much - as have others
from various cultures.

That's why the song with the words - "We are One
and We are Many, and from all the world's on
earth we come..."means so much to us.
Chinese people are included in that sentiment.
It's not where you come from - but your behavior
and character that should concern us.

cont'd ...

Dear Mr Opinion,

Of course it's a different matter concerning
the Chinese Communist regime. But I doubt
whether Australia's future is in any serious
danger from them. They need us for trade, as
we do them. We provide mineral resources,
they provide other necessities for us.

What we should be worried about is the Communist
Government influence - not the Chinese civilian
population. But our strong allies have enough
commitments in this country that they will help
us and protect their own interests here.

Dear Foxy,

Unfortunately we do not live in a utopia and there are as many evil people in the world as there are good people. And when big adverse events impact on normal peoples' lives it can change them from angels into demons. Take a look at the Germans during the revolutionary and economic turmoils of the 1920s and later under the Nazis during the 1930s and 40s. Unfortunately we cannot see into the future but we can look to the past for pointers and in history we can see some really rotten examples of how good people can turn to savagery and primitiveness. (God I love being a sociologist and being able to talk like this.)

Dear Mr Opinion,

Of course there are many things that can influence
any person's behavior. However, usually for most
people sanity does eventually prevail - and even
during very bad times in history there have been
examples of people who have come to the rescue of
their fellow human beings. I prefer to look for
the positives rather than the negatives.

Dear Foxy,

Problem is that if one is only looking for good then one may only find good. Have you seen the film The Road? Scary stuff.

Dear Mr Opinion,

Try thinking only positive thoughts and see
how your life changes for the better.

You should not allow the behavior of others
destroy your inner peace.

As Maya Angelou once said - "People will forget
what you said. People will forget what you did.
But people will never forget how you made them
feel."

See you on another discussion.

Foxy et al,

Given the intrusive nature of the communist chinese regime into the lives of its citizens both domestically and abroad, the chances of any one of any competence emerging from China free of any connections to the regime is close to zero.

Given the nefarious pasts of a large chunk of Labor MPs and the vast chunks of illicit donations it is wildy hypocritical and a little racist for left whingers to sanctimoniously point fingers at liu.

Dear Shadow Minister,

There have been questions raised for some time
about whether Gladys Liu is a fit and proper person
to be in the Australian parliament.

As many have pointed out this is a test for Scott
Morrison. Sam Dastyari was a test for Bill Shorten's
leadership.

Gladys Liu should be held to the same standard that
Sam Dastyari was. A standard the PM set. Sam Dastyari
took responsibility, and resigned. That was the
right decision in his circumstances.

The PM needs to assure parliament and the Australian people
that Gladys Liu is a fit and proper person to be in
the Australian parliament.

Dear Foxy,

The LNP government supported Liu as a fit and proper person to sit in the house last week in the Senate. It was telecast on the ABC. Mathias Cormann did so in response to the question from Penny Wong. The LNP is now inextricably linked to the affiliations of Gladys Liu. If she goes down they all go down.

Dear Mr Opinion,

Interesting times ahead.

Foxy,

I agree that Liu should be held to the same standard as Sam Dastardly, however, you have failed to demonstrate that she has even vaguely reached the same benchmark.

Sam, standing as representative of the Australian government with a senior representative of the Chinese communist party at a press conference claiming that the Aus government should submit to the illegal Chinese territorial annexation of the South China Sea in return for a $400k "donation" is a pretty hard benchmark to reach.

Fifth columnist? or just another very rich person buying political influence?
Ban private donations, fund election campaigns and out law all other funding

Dear Foxy,

Yes very interesting especially now that ScuMo has come out in open support of America's position against China during his visit to the US. I don't think Xi and the boys are very happy with old ScuMo anymore and I think China will now ramp up its presence in the Indo-Pacific region to the detriment of Australia's strategic interests. It will be interesting to watch and see to what extent little Gladys Liu becomes the pawn in the bigger game of international politics.

Mr O do not disappoint me!
Unlike some I see intelligence in your posts but how did you arrive at that?
The view Scomo took Trumps side on China
Do not get me wrong, I think he is mini me to Trump
But he walked a fine line reminded me at least all sides here must do just that
IF we lost China right now as a trading partner we would be a banana Republic with an instant lower standard of living than ever before

Dear Belly,

I have been following ScuMo's speeches and comments in the US with interest and my interpretation of what he has done is that of throwing in his lot with the US in its stand against China. I've been studying things like history and sociology for almost half of my life and to me it's not grey, it's clearly black and white. I'm now waiting to see how China reacts to ScuMo's visit and his obvious over the top friendship with Trump. I don't think the Chinese like it and I think they will react sooner than later.

Dear Mr Opinion,

Despite The US President's over the top welcome
of our PM in Washington, our PM was very careful
in what he said and did. He trod a very diplomatic
and careful line and even the US President admitted
that our PM was not a push-over but a man made of
titanium.

China needs us and our trade. As we need them.
I'm sure that they will be careful in their actions,
as will our PM. That was made clear in his US visit.

Dear Foxy,

I think it was obvious that he has shown that he is committed to the US and is ready to stand with America against China. He had to because Trump had him over a barrel and apparently according to one news commentator Pompeo even came out with it, asking ScuMo to commit to the US.

Now he has to come back to Australia and explain to China why he has thrown his weight behind the US. He didn't once bring up the idea that China and the US should settle their differences and end the trade war. But he did say that China should cease hiding behind the excuse of being a developing nation and should concede in using that excuse to gain a trade advantage over the US.

Dear Foxy,

PS Trump had ScuMo running around as his lackey and to show the world that Trump was the master and that Australia would be doing the bidding of the US in its dispute with China. I think Trump's message to ScuMos would be something like 'Thanks for coming, now go home and tell China whose side you're on.'

Dear Mr Opinion,

I think we shall have to agree to disagree on
our PM's behavior in Washington.

To me Mr Morrison behaved very diplomatically.
He said that Australia was keen that America
and China settle the tit-for-tat trade dispute
which is imperilling global growth but he said
that Trump was attempting to safeguard important
principles and set new benchmarks that would
ultimately "put global trade on a stronger
footing".

Very diplomatic.

And the US President returned the comment that -
"China wants to make a deal. I think we want to
make a deal. We'll see what happens."

Our PM is nobody's lackey.

Dear Foxy,

Take a look at what ScuMo is saying on today's news. I think it validates what I am saying,

Hi Foxy and Mr O,

I believe the fundamental difference between Labor and The Coalition on foreign policy as it relates to the United States post WWII is the notion of Australia's roll, and what obligations we have to American dictates. The Coalition has always very much seen us as a subordinate, obligated to take orders from Captain America. Labor on the other hand is a little more independent, believing we have the right to a free decision with the right to choose an alternate position, although our position will often be siding with America, but occasionally it could be something else.
The Coalition approach works fine when there is no possibility of any kind of fallout for not choosing the position of the sycophant. In this China/America issues there could be severe consequences for Australia should we side with the US, and take a belligerent attitude to the Chinese.

Dear Paul1405,

I am interested to know if the CIA briefed ScuMo on what they have on Gladys Liu and my gut feeling is that they did and that she will be asked to go when ScuMo returns to Australia. Interesting times ahead.

Mini me [Scomo to you] needs no help, he like most Tory leaders remains on his knees when talking to any American POTUS
He may regret that if he continues parroting another country's policy's [we however know he has no policy's of his own]

I think we should all just wait and see what
happens next. My gut feeling is that Gladys
Liu will not be the Liberal candidate for
Chisholm at the next election. She will quietly
disappear from politics then - if not sooner.

As for the US and China? I think the results of the
US elections next year will be interesting.
In the meantime - our PM needs to tread carefully.
His future and that of his party's depends on
the stance he will continue to take.

More and more people are becoming dissatisfied with the
way the Coalition is currently performing. There is a
lot of criticism being heard.

Foxy,

Given the frivolous nature of most of the accusations against GL, pretty much, I have the feeling that concerns against GL will pretty much only be sustained by the rusted on labor and Greens supporters. However, the chinese community that forms a large % of GL's constituency have been significantly pissed off by the overt racism expressed against their MP again.

Shadow Minster,

Give it a rest.

Nobody's buying what either you or the government
is selling on this one.

Foxy,

The point is that no one is buying your side either.

Shadow Minister,

Actually the media is saying quite a lot.

And this is not a question of taking "sides."
It's a far deeper situation that should concern
every true Australian.

Foxy,

The media interest has all but evaporated after nothing of substance has come to light. GL's "links" to the Chinese communist party are of no more substance or relevance than Albo's links to the Australian Communist party amongst others with dubious histories such as Bill Shorten or Rhiannon and pales in comparison to Sam Dastardly's use of his parliamentary position to actively campaign against Australia's interest for personal and political monetary gain.

Dear Shadow Minister,

We shall see how long the Liberal Party will last with
its maintenance of the same old tired and
outmoded tactics.

Foxy,

So far it appears that the tired old outmoded policies of Fiscal discipline, good governance and low taxes seem to be worked compared to the modern and edgy high taxing Labor policies that got it thrashed in May.

Dear Shadow Minster,

Amid the leadership coups, cultural offenses, the
revolving door of energy policy acronyms, the
Australian public has remained steadfast in
the belief that more needs to be done to address
climate change. The majority of the voting public
has not moved from the view that meaningful action is
required by government.

The Coalition comes across every bit as much a fossil as
the fuel they seek to dig up.

When being regularly asked whether people believe Australia
is doing enough to address climate change - the majority
(including one third of Liberal voters) give a resounding
No!

The failure of this government has been not just the
toppling of its leaders. It's been the reason for the
topplings - which has been more than the blind pursuit of
power - but power in the name of energy.

The reckoning is coming. It will be harsh.
Even adding One Nation to its Coalition won't save it.

Foxy,

Everything you accuse the coalition of has recently occurred in both Labor and the Greens, and the electorate has not forgotten. As for GL, the labor party has been consistently selling out Aus for donations:

"Anthony Albanese and Richard Marles, Labor’s leader and deputy leader, are taking their party on a dangerous, foolish, counterfactual, frequently plain wrong detour on China policy. Their strange new departure threatens the ­bipartisan nature of Australian strategic policy, threatens their own credibility, gives Beijing an incentive to bully Australia ­because it can rely on a quasi-­appeasement response from the opposition and therefore hurts Australia’s national interests.

It is profoundly disappointing that Marles while in China did not raise the case of Australian citizen Yang Hengjun, who is in harsh ­detention in China, denied access to his lawyers and shackled while undergoing ritual interrogation sessions, all because he wrote some critical articles about the Chinese government. How can the deputy leader of the Labor Party go to China and not raise this case, in private or in public? Is Labor in favour of human rights except for human beings, especially Australians abused by the Beijing government?

Marles seems to have completed one of those Marco Polo-style journeys Australian politicians sometimes take, where on the road they discover Asia, especially China, with revolutionary new ­insights all unimagined before they left Australia.

Marles’s view here is so ridiculous as to be almost beyond satire."

Shadow Minister,

Your arguments have no credibility.

Give it up.

Foxy,

The election in May and recent polling show that my points have greater credibility than yours.

Shadow Minister,

You need to read other sources.
Yours have no credibility whatsoever.
And the government is currently hanging
on to power by one seat. Not a safe
and adequate win.

Foxy,

You need to read more than the left whinge sites you continually quote if you want to get any credibility.

Secondly the coalition has a 2 seat majority, with Katter as another potential back up.

Shadow Minister,

Right back at you.

You go first. Lead by example.

As for Katter? What about Pauline Hanson?

Desperate times for the government.

Interesting times ahead for us all.

See you on another discussion.

Foxy,

You claimed "And the government is currently hanging on to power by one seat. Not a safe and adequate win."

I pointed out that for Labor to challenge the coalition they would need the support of all the green and independent MPs and the coalition would need to lose 3 MPs.

As Pauline has no lower house seats that is a moot point, but one nation is the mirror of the greens.

Shadow Minister,

What is important is how will the Coalition seek
to renew itself - both in terms of ideas and
candidates?

Foxy,

I am puzzled as to why you are so certain that it is the coalition that is in need of renewal?

With all things being equal, after the dumping of two Liberal leaders and the pre election infighting labor should have won a thumping majority. That the coalition returned with an increased majority could only have been a massive rejection of Labor's policies and its swing to the left.

Given the selection of the left faction Albo as Labor leader I can't see Labor moving to the center anytime soon, and with Labor's primary vote at 33% Labor is in no shape to win any election.

As for the coalition, the promise of competent economic policies combined with low taxes and a rational program to reduce GHG emissions seems to be a winner.