Hi AC "I think it officially makes us all cattle" I think that is okay providing we are given a free choice as to what breed of cow we want to be. I will be well satisfied if I can be a Jersey cow, but should they force me to be say, a Guernsey, I'll be sending the strongest of protests, in the form of a cow pat posted to the PM! What do you think of that?

Me thinks Adam was the first cow.

"I think it officially makes us all cattle" I
Paul1405,
But what about those who weren't indoctrinated ?

Indy, that was a quote from AC, BTW, how ya go'n on the welfare system, do'n okay I assume. I'm actually rather sympathetic towards the old folks in general, being one myself.

When I said "Such a retirement for Australians who have in reality, mostly contributed and deserve a reasonable standard of living in their final years."

That is not to say aged pensioners are not welfare recipients, anyone who receives a government payment as a source of income is a welfare recipients. There is no special cash resource from previous times held by government to pay pensions, it simply comes out of today's taxation, or borrowings. Governments of the day when you were a taxpayer, chose to pay pensions, which was politically acceptable, and still is. There is no obligation for today's government to do the same as previous, certainly not based on the fact previous governments did paid out. All sorts of changes to the welfare system are inevitable, if changes are not made to keep welfare sustainable, in my opinion.

Would you be happy for government to run balanced budgets, if revenue falls then things like pensions also fall accordingly.

anyone who receives a government payment as a source of income is a welfare recipients.
Paul1405,
Welfare is is Welfare, Old age pension has been paid for through your contributions via taxation !
What you're saying amounts to investors not actually owning anything, they merely paid for things ?
I find your analysis puzzling !
We HAVE ALREADY paid for our Pension & when we spend it we pay tax on it again, much of which is wasted on drug abusers et al ! The Tax we paid over 50+ years helped the elderly of our time & now we're the new elderly living of the new taxpayers. It's not Welfare, it's a well-designed system beneficial to all, paid for by all. Welfare is when people receive something for nothing, we have invested what we receive now.
I just hope people come to their senses & invest in a healthier mentality for the present young. A National Service is that investment. Nothing makes people more stupid than the lack of discipline !

Well Indy, that would be so if not for,say means testing the aged pension. Why pay it to those that never paid tax.
New Zealand pays national superannuation to all, which is not means tested, therefore its not welfare. Australia pay a supportive aged pension, which is means tested, so its welfare.

In our case my wife receives NZ government superannuation. As a married couple neither of us are entitled to claim a welfare pension from the Australian government.

I'm not opposed to paying tax again this year, at aged 66, to pay welfare to you and all the others. For some reason you feel you are a cut above all those doleies and diso's on a government handout, you're not, you're in the same boat. No need to feel ashamed, we should help the less fortunate whenever we can.

What about all that middle class welfare?

What about all that middle class welfare?
Paul1405,
I have stated many times to stop Commercial (Neg. Gear.) Welfare !