Dear NNS,

We don’t have to come to agreement on porn or anything else for that matter. What we have to do is be civil with each other and accept that the other person has a different view. I think we are doing that at this time. That is the way to get along in a society. Live and let live. All I can get from your use of the word ‘broken’ is that other group of humans and other species of animals do not behave the way you want them to behave. I think you have made a value judgment that that is wrong. I have not made such a value judgment. If a male lion takes over a pride and kills the cubs of a previous father that is neither right nor wrong. That is normal lion behavior. We humans have developed moral codes where that behavior from a human male would not be acceptable. There may be human societies where that would be acceptable. Different human societies have different standards. The ancient Greeks would leave a handicapped baby in the wilds to die. We would not do that in our society. That does not mean the ancient Greeks were wrong, and we are right. That means that the ancient Greeks have different standards of what is wrong and right from us. We live in a different situation from the ancient Greeks and have the facilities to care for handicapped children. However, if most children were born handicapped we would be unable to care for them all. To deal with that we would have to have a lot of children and only care for the ones who weren’t handicapped if we wanted our society to survive.

Most religions have some version of the Golden Rule. Treat others as you would be treated. There is one big problem with the Golden Rule. Others might not want to be treated as you would be treated.

Dear NNS,

You apparently think it is a good thing to be a missionary. I think it is a bad thing. I think other people with different beliefs from yours should be left alone. You might think that if you were not a Christian it would be great for someone to approach you with news of that faith. I am not a Christian and have disliked the many approaches of one kind or another from Christians who have tried to missionize me. Friday I was at a shopping centre, and I was approached three times by ladies from a local church trying to get customers.

If you adopted my views, it would be bad for you. It would alienate you from your church and your family.

I think there is a basic sickness at the heart of the Christian faith. The basic sickness is the belief that Jesus was a perfect man, and we should be like Jesus. Since no person can be perfect, trying to be perfect leads to failure, and failure leads to guilt. The guilt is neurotic since the failure to achieve an impossible goal is built in. So the sick Christian wails in his or her guilt, “We are all sinners.”

Other religions do not have that sickness. There is a Jewish story that tells of a different attitude. Reb Zosya said, “When I come before the Lord he won’t ask me why I wasn’t like Moses. He will ask me why I wasn’t like Zosya.” To ask that somebody achieve what it is in them to achieve is reasonable. To ask that somebody be perfect is unreasonable and a recipe for guilt.

Islam has Mohammed as a prophet not as a God. They do not have the Christian sickness.

Buddhists do not maintain that a God exists. They do not have the Christian sickness.

I agree with you that all religions are not the same. I think we could do without them all. However, I think Christianity with its record of violence and intolerance and its unreasonable demands is inferior to Judaism, Islam and Buddhism.

To David F.

Moral relativism is a hypocritical cover. Saying both that no one should judge, while also at the same time saying the judgements and the standards that the person holding moral relativism holds. For instance consider your standards. Should you live and let live, or a stand up for the right for abortion? Or on a personal level, should you judge someone on their behavior such as your comments to Runner saying that you think he is an angry person, or should you say their morals are equally justified even if it is criminal (not meaning you Runner, just extending the point from personality clashes of moral relativity to the harder reality of saying moral relativity extends to gangs and murders). With this in mind I find your views of not judging the Greeks by ourstandards to be a hypocritical cover while also judging your perceptions of my views or morals.

{Sigh}

As I write this message I've checked back to the topic on Pornography and see your second reply. Do we really need to repeat the topic of missionaries here? On your views on Christianity? Have I said any points that are weak in themselves that they are not worth considering on their own?

(Continued)

(Continued)

Porn is harmful to a relationship. That is not my morals being forced on anyone. Nor is it my being uncivil by saying so. That's the data known from both what's studied on the subject, as well as what's observed when one partner discovers the other looks at porn. Those in the porn industry have shown no sign of it being a healthy industry to be in. Even those who go into it willingly. That is an observation. If that observation is inaccurate, then counter it with accurate info. However, even if those willing to go into porn are fine through some unstated standard, those that are forced into the industry from an unknown online source, are not so lucky. Again this is not my standards being pushed on another. These are points worth considering themselves. Are these points so weak that they are not worth considering? That the focus should be on my faith, or on unresolved discussions in the past?

If the points I made are not worth considering then how about my request?

<<If you have any source of information of a married couple that wasn't negatively influenced by porn, I'd like to hear it.>> [Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Tuesday, 11 June 2019 2:37:01 AM]

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To Ezhil.

I'm sorry if I seem hard in this topic. David and I have some history in past conversations. If you're willing, I would like to hear what you meant when talking about the goals envisioned by religions.

Dear NNS,

I have no information about a married couple who was negatively influenced by porn. I have no information about a married couple who was positively influenced by porn. I have no information about a married couple who was influenced by porn in any way. I am sure that you have information about the negative influences of porn. I am equally sure that you would ignore anything that would mention the positive influences of porn. I would have to search for myself to make a determination about the subject, and I probably will not do it. I do know there is archeological evidence that porn has been around for thousands of years, and it is not a modern development. Porn like religion is a human invention. Banning porn or banning religion is a futile exercise. In my opinion religion is more harmful than porn, but it is futile to try to ban either.

You have gone on about your opinion of porn. However, you have cited nothing that would substantiate that opinion.

The centuries of intolerance, the Crusades, the Inquisition, the persecution of heretics, dissenters and Jews, the forcible conversion of native peoples and the Wars of the Reformation and the current attempt to roll back the rights of equality for women and homosexuals substantiate my negative view of your religion.

You don’t like porn, and you don’t like people doing things that you don’t like. That seems to be the reason for your negative view of porn. What you call an observation that porn is harmful is merely your opinion. I have no reason to accept your opinion.

All religions preach love.They teach rather preach matters that will civilize man. But what do we see on earth? Animosity, bloodshed persecution and what not committed in the name of religion. Certainly that was not the intention of religions.If man cannot change for the better based on religious teachings then what is purpose of all religions?They are not for fun and frolic and to dress in a particular style.Matters concerning the mind and heart are not followed at all but the physical culture and the meaningless rituals dictated are being adopted without fail. Let us ponder over.