I read a few newspapers daily and watch TV news daily and the only place I see where there are problems with African refugees is in Melbourne, which prompts me to ask why?

Surely Melbourne is not the only place that African refugees go to, so why do not other places have problems as well? If it is lack of law enforcement in Victoria then why do I not hear of other towns and cities in Victoria having problems.

I may be wrong but other state capitals would get their fair share of refugees so do they have problems and we do not hear about it.

If this is not an election issue in Victoria it should be the main issue.

My son in-laws parents live in Penrith NSW.

His mother will not shop in Penrith, or even get out of her car in Penrith, due to trouble with African youth gangs.

I guess the police & media in some states/areas refuse to report African & other ethnic migrant problems. Islander & aboriginal gangs regularly confront each other in parts of Logan Qld too. It keeps many off the streets.

Dear Banjo,

Back at it again mate? You will need new hides on the drums soon.

Dear Hasbeen,

We have quite a few in the larger town near us with very few issues. There are quite a number playing for our club and all are fine.

However some the clubs from more affluent areas have far less or no representation. So there is definitely a socio-economic distribution which you would attribute to the fact that these are a relatively recent part of our refugee program.

And of course there is age and parental factors in the mix as well.

Good question. No good answers though. Something to do with Left wing laxity? Victoria is the most Left wing state in the country. They are the only ones who think it's OK for victims of Left wing violence to be charged for protection against Leftist thugs trying to prevent people from going to conservative gatherings. African gangs, though, can riot, rob and trash, while the cops just look on without making arrests. Victorians deserve everything they get while they continue to vote in rubbish governments like the current one.

Well put the PC in the nearest rubbish bin for a start.
Now yes they came, or their parents did, from a far different back ground than the streets of Melbourne.
And yes they feel a solidarity in being different, it is the cement that binds gangs.
NO it is not racist to highlight any of the above,just as it is not wrong to highlight the roll PC plays.
Some rush to defend any minority charged with any crime, right or wrong.
This is being used and has been for several years by politicians as a weapon, just as damning as PC in this case.
The problem exists, it is real, and only by dealing with it like every other problem, without becoming politically correct,without discounting the crimes because of race age or family history will it be fixed

Australia is merely 20 years behind Europe with that dilemma. If we had a media that reports fact it could have been averted altogether, alas !

individual,

That's it. All the goody goodies, and the media, and the political class are in in denial. If they admitted to the problem, they would have to admit that they caused it. They were warned that Africans were not suitable immigrants, but they put up their usual thoughtful 'logic' that anyone who said that was a racist. It is not racists who are responsible for the black gangs. It is the mealy-mouthed, ignorant relativists and multiculturalists who are responsible

Belly,
You miss the point. Why does it appear that only Melbourne is affected

Do the police in Sydney, Brisbane and other places do a far better job of law enforcement than the Melbourne police do. Is it a failing of the Labor government in Victoria or has the police there been told not to take any action to control these young. Are the police in Melbourne scared of being labeled racist if the get tough?

So there may also be a problem in Penrith but never hear about that, so is the media to blame for keeping it quiet, like they did when the gang rapes were occurring at Bankstown.

Interesting to know the extent of this criminal act by contemptous youth.

Belly is incapable of answering questions, but I will say yes, you have given most of the reasons in your second paragraph. Victoria is a chronic, relativist, PC state. They would rather offend Australians than aliens. Apart from AFL, they are good for nothing.

There are quite a number playing for our club and all are fine.
Steele redux,
I recall many european leftists remark similarly until, yes until they became more than quite a few after which it was too late.

Henry L we know Victorian police do not want to highlight this.
I can only guess fear of being seen as racist is the reason.
We have always had gangs, thugs and idiots.
Maybe these thugs and idiots know, as most youth does, they have a few get out of trouble free cards
if we want to fix it fix the court system first.
ttbn, you are a grub, not a very bright one but grub you are

ttbn, you are a grub, not a very bright one but grub you are
Belly
Come again ? Just because he stated the fact that you actually don't answer questions or offer solutions ? I'd think twice about the grub thingo if I were you. Looking into a mirror whilst typing is not recommended.

I live in Melbourne and despite what Mr Dutton has
said in the past - I am not afraid to go out at
night. In fact I go out all the time. As for young
African refugees being a problem in Melbourne? Yes
there have been isolated incidents - just as there
have been in other cities but we do have crime under
control due to a very good government. We have more
police numbers patrolling the streets. We also have
more community involvement with young people. The
African community has become involved and is playing
a vital part towards solving problems of exclusion,
unemployment. Family involvement is crucial and very
helpful. Also sporting clubs are also options that
are working well - especially when they involve
mixed groups playing together.

Derogatory comments by politicians in the media do not
help. But perhaps with a state election being on the
horizon (November 24th) , some people have their own
political agendas to satisfy. However, Melbournian
voters are smarter than that. In fact voters everywhere
are smarter than that - as the Coalition will find out -
at the next federal election. The outmoded model of
attacking your opponents using fear-mongering, sloganeering,
and spin no longer works.

individual,

Can you explain to me how agreeing with your post makes me a “not very bright” “grub”. I've been any abused for disagreeing with people, but never by one I've agreed with.

??

Lol.

Dear individual,

I think belly's point has just been rather poetically confirmed.

Made my day.

Dear Banjo and individual,

This is obviously a bit uncomfortable for you both. These are Christian gangs rather than Muslim so you are having to tip toe around your usual rhetoric.

All good fun.

Steel redux,
I find Belly's waffle too all over the place, wheras you don't seem to have any difficulty in getting his gist. I urge you to read again & ttbn I think misread it also.

individual,

Right. It seems now that you were quoting Belly. But, you did not use quotation marks, which means they look your your own words, not the idiot's, which I did not read.

individual,

Right. It seems now that you were quoting Belly. But, you did not use quotation marks, which means they look your your own words, not the idiot's, which I did not read as I know what the clown always says. 'Grub' is one of the words he can spell.

I wonder if the media has ever interviewed people who live in the actual suburbs these thugs riot in. How they feel about going out at night etc.

Can we not leap in to defend these youths or to hate them but start to look at them without race or color being involved.
YES Dutton is using them, but he need not, they by their every day acts are earning our dislike.
NOW from my first day as a young green as grass country kid in Villawood, Sydney, youth gangs [then white English] existed.
focus on the crimes, the courts failures, and the fear Police will be called racist, IF they do as we want give them a kick up the kiber and get them off the streets

Foxy,
To solve a problem first it has to be acknowledged that there is a problem which you do not see. There was a hell of a lot of gang activity last week for it to be "under control". 15 African youths attacked the staff of a popular St. Kilda restaurant and not one arrest. Then there were other attacks or on the night before.

This has been occurring for a long time and the conclusion must be that the police have been ordered off by the Vic government, at least for the Melbourne area.

If Victorians are prepared to put up with this and re-elect the same government then they have no one to complain except themselves.

Funny that few other places have a problem, can you name them?

focus on the crimes, the courts failures,
Belly,
That's why I am so in favour of a National service which is about the only method available to get young people into a healthier mentality.
Steele redux seems to think two wrongs make a right. Not a good mentality at all.

Henry,

I am not aware of the problems that you're talking
about and I can only speak from my own experiences
living in Melbourne. Do You live in Melbourne?
Also please supply a link to the news stories that
you are talking about if you want to be taken
seriously. The only mention of "African Gangs" in
Melbourne is the State's Opposition Leader -
Matthew Guy's campaign videos showing "African Youths"
and his claim that he's going to eliminate them if
elected.

Typical Liberal campaign tactics - fear-mongering -
in an attempt to garner votes.

Foxy,
Are you now saying that the media in Melbourne are lieing?

Try this from the ABC

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-02/police-investigate-st-kilda-foreshore-assaults/10461944

Apparently there was other attacks as well and one on a woman in a car in Brunswick. Is anywhere safe?

Foxy - He is probably referring to this link.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/brunswick-west-home-invaded-by-six-armed-men-as-crime-spree-hits-inner-suburbs-20181102-p50dqc.html

Brunswick West home invaded by six armed men as crime spree hits inner suburbs

Up to six men have smashed their way into a house in Brunswick West wielding knives and hammers the day before a violent 10-hour crime spree that spanned six suburbs on Halloween night.

Investigators have been told the group forced their way into a house on Yarrabin Street about 4.30am on Tuesday.

Once in the house, they confronted two victims and demanded money and jewellery before fleeing with stolen items, including a black Jeep Cherokee, police said.

The stolen car was found in Deer Park the following day.

On Wednesday night, five men ambushed a young mother in her driveway, threatening her with a machete and covering her mouth before stealing her car in the early hours of the morning.

Residents in Melbourne's southern suburbs were also assaulted, egged and threatened during the string of assaults on Halloween.

Police believe the same group of violent offenders may have been behind six separate attacks that took place between 5.30pm Wednesday and 3.30am Thursday.

Police had identified nine victims so far with CCTV footage being analysed for clues.

"It was definitely planned. They have targeted vulnerable victims," Detective Senior Constable Lal Devinder Singh said on Thursday.

"People who couldn’t defend themselves. You don’t expect someone to assault you while out for a walk or when driving home from work."

Foxy,
Am sure with your expertise in finding links you can find many more.

Surprized you do not keep on top of Melbourne news. Are you aware that these attacks have been happening for years and nothing is done. The question still remains as to why only Melbourne and that has to be political! Vic police are not that incompetent.

Henry and Philip,

Thank You for the links.

I had seen those incidents on the news - however the police
seemed to have things well under control at the time. And more
police have been allocated to patrol the streets. It still
seems to me that there is a huge trend in the media lately
about Melbourne being a very dangerous place to live. We have
an election coming up on 24th November - and Matthew Guy -
the Liberal Opposition Leader is milking this for all it's
worth. He has nothing else. He's the guy who was with Jeff
Kennett's cuts and wreckage of our state. Then he was with
Ted Baillieu's cuts - they wrecked our Health system, our
ambulance services, our TAFE colleges , our transport,
and the list goes on.
Now he's trying to come back - and sure as anything there'll
be more cuts that will follow.

I go out a great deal - including to Donovans restaurant in
St Kilda - and I've never had any problems. Of course there
are bad people out there - they exist in any city - however
have a look at the following link - which gives the crime
statistics and is worth a read. I don't feel that we should
panic just yet. Melbourne compared to other cities is still
one of the safest - no matter what suburb you live in.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-11/melbourne-sudanese-crime-statistics-victoria/10065402

Foxy quote "however the police seemed to have things well under control at the time."

http://au.news.yahoo.com/man-bashed-gang-storms-mobile-phone-store-101642180.html

Police are not in control, the only thing they are in control of is not investigating and therefore no crime committed.

Even if the victim is not willing to make a complaint they can and should still bring the culprits to justice but it is easier to do nothing.

The crime figures are a manipulated joke.
How many times have you read stories of rioting Africans and Sudanese where the police sit on the side and do nothing even after numerous cars have been vandalized you add all those to the rubbery figures you naively believe.

Those riots above are not recorded as crimes, please wake up to reality.

Quote "I've never had any problems"
Just because you have not had problems does not mean anything.

//Quote "I've never had any problems"
Just because you have not had problems does not mean anything.//

He's right; evidence is not the plural of anecdote.

//The crime figures are a manipulated joke.//

Oh no, wait, apparently we can't believe statistics either....

Well that leaves us in a bit of a pickle: if we can't trust anecdotes and we can't trust statistics, who are we left to trust? The media [snigger]? Politicians [snigger]? The constabulary [snort, guffaw, giggle]?

I guess we're left with old tried and true method of Chinese whispers. Although that's probably racist or something these days.

Philip S.,

No one is denying the fact that thugs commit crimes
in cities. However, according to the recent statistics
the overall crime rates are down in Victoria.
The following link gives more information on the
breakdowns.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-09-20/victoria-crime-rate-down-new-criminal-statistics-agency-figures/10284918

I am firmly from the section of society that defends such as these young men.
I understand the isolation they must feel, surely if we let our selves we all can.
I too know Whites, in fact any social or race based group, has such people.
Too that both sides use them as a tool of politics
We or most of us, know, courts are not, in any matter, representing our wishes.
That PC thing exists, it stands between justice and stops it in its tracks
IF we do not want a world driven by increasing hate, fear of difference, it will be us who demands in every case the law and abuse of it, will be the only measure not race or faith.
Too while finding new ways to help such people we must not, blindly, let PC make us overlook those crimes are still crimes and that you can never defend the indefensible, in the end these youths exist and do far more harm to their community than a car full of KKK members

"Police are not in control, the only thing they are in control of is not investigating and therefore no crime committed".

That sums up the problem. No more need be said. Victoria has had a useless, gutless police for at least since, and including, Christine Nixon. There are no arrests, no punishments. These African thugs, who should never been brought into the country, are child-like, and like all children, they will continue to test the boundaries as long as they are allowed to get away with it.

The real problem is Victoria Police and the anarchist Andrews Marxist government.

What a load of nonsense. Referring to Marxism no less.
Or does the confusion lie in whethe4r its Karl or Groucho?

"Four Corners" will be doing a program this evening on
the so called "African Gang" problem. One can only trust
that Matthew Guy will be watching. Perhaps he'll learn
something.

A Marxist 4 Corners program on African gangs. Wow. That is sure to be truthful and unbiased.

Some people insist on wearing a sign around there neck warning they are idiots.
African gangs commit one percent of the crimes, they are over represented as they number far less than that
Show me however the Marxist police, courts and those who put together this story at the ABC.

Dear Foxy,

Thank you for that link. It is very telling. It shows far less offending in the over 25 Sudanese population compared to the wider population. I wonder why that is, why the big turnaround?

Dear Philip S,

Yes it was a very ordinary week for assaults showing the problems with Sudanese gangs running riot don't just happen in Melbourne. One assaulted a young teenager after a whole Sudanese mob crashed a Halloween party in Sydney. The victim is now in a coma fighting for his life. Police had very little control at the height of the affray.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5030835/Teen-bashed-coma-Halloween-party-woken-up.html

It also appears two Sudanese attempted an armed robbery in a Brisbane home and left the victim with two stab wounds.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/aap/article-6326377/Brisbane-man-stabbed-row-two-charged.html

But some good news, the 5 apparent Sudanese teenagers responsible for the death of a man during a carjacking gone wrong in Melbourne finally faced court this week.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-10-11/paul-costa-murdered-during-attempted-supermarket-robbery-court/9040692

Dear Steelie,

I'm glad that you read the link I cited earlier.
I found the statistics interesting.

The "Four Corners" program this evening should be
more revealing.

I just don't get why some blokes on this forum
keep involving the spectre of "Marxism" to
account for things they disapprove of - things like
African communities, Islamic immigrant communities,
feminism, Leftists, Socialists, Opposition Leader -
Bill Shorten, the Labor Party, and of course the ABC.

What are they talking about? It appears that "Marxism"
is integral to the fantasy life of the contemporary Right.
In this day and age - that is scary.

Foxy with out insulting people we must not say why some are so completely lost in the use of that Marxist leftist trash talk
Do not look for intelligence in some, it is like fishing in a long dry dam

was quite problem with sudanese gangs in Scarborough perth a few years ago. The aboriginals and sudansese gangs did not get along. I don't know if the press just stop reporting on these Sudanese gangs or whether they disappeared. Crime rates among the aboriginals are still at a ridiculous level in Perth and Regional Wa.

feminism, Leftists, Socialists, Opposition Leader -
Bill Shorten, the Labor Party, and of course the ABC.
Foxy,
I think this is due to the fact that it is the groups above who are always at the forefront of excusing & even encourage feigned indignation & promote guilt industries in general.
In fact, anything that relieves them or rather makes them feel relieved of the responsibilities of normal citizens who appreciate what their forebears did for them & they want to protect.
It's a no-brainer for people with an ounce of integrity.

Dear runner,

The vast majority of these refugees were from South Sudan and come from a very Christian in culture.

The Four Corners episode tonight showed many attending a prosperity gospel, fundamentalist style church gathering.

Given one of the youths talked about having the chance to own a Ferrari and a mansion as a dream that was being thwarted by the attitudes of potential employers do you have any sense of that particular brand of Christianity failing them?

Foxy - Would you agree that once someone or an organization has been proven to be a liar they there is a good chance they will tell lies in the future or if it suits there agenda?

There are more instances available but this one shows how dishonest Victoria Police can be if it serves there interests.

VICTORIA Police faked more than 250,000 breath tests over a period of five years, a damning internal report has revealed.

A SHOCKING internal report has revealed Victorian police officers faked more than 250,000 random preliminary roadside breath tests (PBTs) over five years.

The report claims more than 1.5 per cent of 17.7 million tests were falsified by officers, many of whom are believed to have blown into the straw breathalysers themselves to meet quotas or to avoid breath testing motorists.

Victoria Police issued a statement shortly before 8.30pm on Wednesday declaring they had “let the community down”.

The statement includes an admission that the practice involves “an officer either (placing) a finger over the straw entry hole or (blowing) into the straw themselves”.

“It is believed the self-testing activity has been largely undertaken by general duties and highway patrol members, with some rural areas over-represented,” the statement said.

“It is not a practice found to be performed at supervised drug and alcohol bus testing sites.”

The activity was first reported to Victoria Police late last year. Once aware of the claims, an intelligence assessment was undertaken that involved “a very complex and protracted” analysis of five years of data, 1500 PBT devices and more than 17.7 million tests.

“Disappointingly (the tests) found 258,463 PBTs or 1.5 per cent of all tests had been falsified,” Professional Standards Command Assistant Commissioner Russell Barrett said.

“This conduct will not be tolerated, any member found engaging in this practice from today has been put on notice they will be investigated.

Watched the ABC and it re enforced my view in all things a middle path is the best result.
Yes they are 0.1 percent of the population, and their crimes are 1 percent.
In one case they are responsible for 10 percent of the crime in that category, not good.
They are different, therefore in some minds a danger/target
They set out to have a culture, even if baby's on arrival here, more like African Americans than ours.
All together not an easy start, having mostly only mothers , who by the way wish they never came here can not help.
They are here, it is our job to fix this,racism will not get it done.
Let the criminal system work as it tells us it does, blind to race rank and faith, deaf to external claims,and silent on bias of any kind,that doco showed a quite stupid old couple, ringing police to wrongly claim a group of Africans had invaded their front yard.
That highlights some of us should not be let out without a carer

The report claims more than 1.5 per cent of 17.7 million tests were falsified by officers, many of whom are believed to have blown into the straw breathalysers themselves to meet quotas or to avoid breath testing motorists.
Philip S,
That explains why they don't let you see the result after you blow the gadget. I think it immoral not to be allowed to know what level you're at when tested. So much for Law & Order.

Belly Quote "a quite stupid old couple, ringing police to wrongly claim a group of Africans had invaded their front yard."

First I have not watched it so my comment is made with that in mind.

With the numerous accounts of actual home invasions, violent assaults etc in Victoria virtually all against victims like the old couple, vulnerable, unable to fight back. what would you do, wait to phone police from your hospital bed or the morgue?

individual Police would have done that to make the public think they were doing a better job against drunk drivers than they were so it can also be assumed the opposite applies they would manipulate crime figures that would make rising crime statistics lower.

“African gangs commit one percent of the crimes”.

Given their small small percentage of the overall population, this is a large contribution. Belly is not only illiterate, he is also innumerate.

The African gangs are so wonderful really that we should soon see plane loads of Melbourne Marxists emigrating to Sudan and Somalia to enjoy even more of their company.

Well folks, I'll probably get attacked for this
but I have to be honest. I watched the "Four
Corners," program last night and it scared the
living daylights out of me. Frankly I don't
know how to solve this problem of these young
people. And it is a HUGE problem. I can see that
now. So I'll just shut up and say no more.

Dear Foxy,

I'm keen to explore this further with you. I watched the program and it didn't elicit fear from me but then I've been working in one of the lowest socio-economic postcodes in the state and perhaps I'm a little numb to anti-social and criminal behaviour, some of it pretty extreme. I would take a Sudanese teenager intent on a burg over some of the ice crazed individuals I've come across. They are the ones that scared the bejabbers of me on more than one occasion.

However the testimony at the start of the program by the woman left traumatised by the home invasion was particularly confronting. The fact that on this occasion they failed to catch any of them is worrying.

But what pushed your buttons?

Foxy/Steelredux you would expect me to be on the side of the South Somali migrants.
It is in the DNA of my side of politics
We however gain nothing by defending the indefensible.
IF they had been a white gang, few of us, if any,would not wish to see them in prison.
Always, the middle matters, it is them who tell us who will govern
if one side of this debate won, clearly, the other side would feel let down.
Put them in prison, educate them while there.
Show them, by their actions, they damage their community.
Do not tell me hugging them is the answer

Dear Steelie,

What pushed my buttons?

The first instance was that home invasion scene.
The girl's fear affected me. It was real.
Then the attitudes
of the blokes who made that scary video. I found it
a stupid thing to do. What did they hope to achieve
by that? Then the fighting amongst the groups. They
can't seem to be able to get together even socially,
and behave. It just got worse and worse.

The community needs to take control themselves. They
need to provide more activities - such as sport - to get
the kids involved instead of looking for trouble on the
streets.

I don't mean to babble on - but it did affect me.
At the same time I felt sorry for the two young blokes who
got mistreated by the police in the library. As well as
the bloke who told us that people would rather stand on the
tram than sit next to him. I wouldn't hesitate to sit next
to him. I'd probably say - "Hi!" and smile.

There you go .

'The vast majority of these refugees were from South Sudan and come from a very Christian in culture. '

yeah steelie

Given that these young men attend state schools (when they show up) don't you feel these godless institutions are failing them? Maybe wew should send them to mosques to learn how to treat women.

Dear oh dear Steelie from complete denial that their is a problem with African youth to now blaming Christianity. Your identity politics leads you to very sad sick conclusions. Try thinking just a bit!

Foxy,
We should learn from our mistakes.

Bringing these people here from such a diverse culture was a mistake, the same as Fraser bringing the Leb muslims in the 70s.

Solution is to stop bringing them and offer them passage back to Africa.
The mothers apparently do not like it here, as it was not what they expected, so they would be happy and we would be rid of their troublesome kids. End of problem, all happy and money well spent. The worst the kids can do back home is to sexually harass a few female donkeys and apparently they can kick.

It still is apparent that the government in Vic has told their police to be easy on the Africans and not arrest any, and the judge needs to put more emphasis on protecting the public. Melbourne is not as safe as you thought!

Henry,

I admit that watching the "Four Corners" program
last night was quite a revelation. Knocked me for a six.
And I admit that there was much I simply did not know.
I don't know what the answer is - But I also am thinking
along the lines that if they go on committing crimes
and end up with a criminal record - rather than jail -
they should be deported. It might send a strong message.

Dear Foxy,

Thank you for the response.

It is absolutely fine to identify strongly with home invasion victim in what would have been a terrifying ordeal. It is very easy to put ourselves in her place and to imagine her fear.

On the other hand if I were a Sudanese mother perhaps I would have identified more strongly with the woman who had tried to hold her 14 year old son as he lay dying after being beaten to death by two white men who set out with the express purpose to “kill a n@gger”.

The music video was certainly ill-advised given the climate but it was certainly a parody. Smashing tvs have been a part of musical videos forever and has become a caricature.

None of the news reports I cited earlier involved Sudanese youths, not even the carjacking gone wrong in Melbourne. I feel the 4 Corners report was timely and didn't pull its punches. But it also flagged how easy it is to get caught up in the fear, and for decisions to be made that make matters worse rather than addressing what is a very real issue.

As for deportation the report mentioned over a hundred had been already. However I would not want to see those who were brought here without parents in their early years, who grew up in our culture, being threatened with deportation for fighting in a park or other juvenile delinquency. We need to properly understand why these kids are falling away and do what is needed to pull them back.

Foxy,
I may be wrong but if they are born here, like the 2nd gen muslims, they cannot be deported as they are natural citizens. Besides that it usually takes a jail sentence of at least 12 months before deportation is considered.

I commend you for changing your mind on this issue, as I do Belly.

"I may be wrong but if they are born here, like the 2nd gen muslims, they cannot be deported as they are natural citizens".

Australia abolished 'birthright citizenship' in 2007. To be an Australian citizen, people born here have to have at least one parent who is either a citizen or a permanent resident.

Had a quick look at 4 Corners on iView. Gave it away when the Keystones Cops indicated that they were still in denial about African gangs.

ttbn,
Suggest you have a look at it again. I was expecting the worst and was surprized as it was not too bad. Bear in mind the cops are under orders from the government, in Vic. They arrive late and make no arrests! The worst aspect was the Judge who needs to re-priortize public safety rather that think of refugees as victims. Citizens are the victims.

All in all it was not too bad for the ABC. It helped Foxy and Belly change from defense to offense which is rare. The Africans scored a few own goals. including a video they made of their exploits. Recall how the Lebs used to brag to the media about how tough they were, well this is similar.

Dear Steelie,

I fully understand your pointing out the incident of
Martha Ojulo whose son Liep Gony was beaten to death in 2007
by two white blokes armed with metal poles - who were looking
for blacks to kill. And I did find it surprising that
a Supreme Court Judge said during sentencing that the attack
was not racially motivated. I can't even begin to imagine
what the mother of that young boy must still be feeling.
Their community needs to get more involved with their
kids - to keep everyone out of trouble. The police need
to also get more involved.
Surely there are clubs that could work?

There does seem to be an odd treatment of both victims and
perpetrators regarding the inter-action of white and black
in these communities. The authorities need to take stronger
action on both sides.

The question now is - we need to look at what needs to be
done to prevent violence from happening again and we need
to do something about keeping those kids off the streets
and out of trouble.

But that I imagine is not going to be an easy thing to do.
Any suggestions as to what could be done?

Dear Foxy,

It may be instructive to look at what was done over the decade where it was primarily Vietnamese gangs who were conducting the vicious home invasions, especially in Sydney.

"4.62 These trends are most notable in Sydney and particularly in the Cabramatta district, where one such gang has the name '5T' - a reference to a tattoo worn by some members. This gang has become prominent in the distribution of very pure heroin in the district, but also in systematic extortion, home invasion robberies and other offences. Its members are frequently armed, either with knives or firearms. There are indications that the group is extending its operations outside Sydney."

"5.11 There are many media reports of 'Asian gangs' in Sydney engaging in violent robberies including 'home invasions', and in extortion from small businesses, in addition to drug trafficking."
http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/Joint/Former_Committees/acc/completed_inquiries/pre1996/ncaaoc/report/c05

You wrote of the problem at the nightclub where fighting resulted in a young man being struck by a car and ultimately losing his leg.

You will probably remember the Salt Night Club incident in Melbourne where a confrontation between two Asian gangs left three dead, one being hacked to death with swords. It resulted with 7 men getting life in prison.
http://www.theage.com.au/national/guilty-verdict-in-salt-nightclub-killings-20050920-ge0wdb.html

Hanson at the time secured a seat in our parliament calling it an Asian Invasion and citing Asian criminality. However it is not something she raises at all now.

Our Victorian state election may well be decided on the Sudanese gang issue. I see many Sudanese people in jobs, including as security at the Melbourne Cup if you watched it. My hope is that we will be able to work through this through both community and police resourcing and that in 10 years it will hardly rate a mention.

Dear Steelie,

Fingers crossed that what you're saying comes true.

cont'd ...

I forgot to add that I did watch some of the Cup.
I didn't notice the security - but what a magnificent
show it puts out every year. It just keeps getting
better and better. Next year I'm going to go. By that
time my hair will be shoulder length - so I'll do something
special with it - (and dress up) -I can't wait.

Sorry - I didn't mean to waffle on again. But Cup Day is
exciting.

Young African refugees a problem only in Melbourne, why?
Henry L,
They're increasingly problematic everywhere because that's the whole point of them being sent out into the world to gain absolute power by exploiting Christian stupidity.

Youth crime as many other issues needs a good mix of the carrot and the stick.

Programs to integrate these Sudanese youths are a good idea, but stiff conditions for bail and jail sentences should be waiting for them if they turn to violent crime.

The Victorian Justices and the feeble Andrew's government are no match for this task.

SM,

Not sure how good Liberal Leader Matthew Guy would
be - he's known as the "cut guy" in Victoria. Cuts
to schools, health care, hospitals, ambulances,
transport, TAFE, the list goes on. Under his
leadership there would be less programs for youth,
less police, less of everything.

Andrews has again demonstrated his unsuitability for leadership by signing a memorandum of understanding with China recently. If is amazing that he does not understand that only the federal government can conduct foreign affairs and make treaties with a foreign power.

Terry Barnes jokes that the Victorian election campaign was was “all but cancelled for lack of interest this week”. Hang on. Perhaps it it's not a joke.

Only two things about the boring campaign have been of interest to Barnes. The deal with China (all details secret) on the Belt and Road fantasy - a deal that only the federal government can make, if they are stupid enough.

The second thing of interest is the fact that the dozy Liberals have summoned up the will to field candidates in inner city seats where Labor will be under pressure from Greens.

The China 'deal’ will be ditched if Labor wins (even Andrews must know a state hick government can't do such things) and, if they lose, the whole charade will disappear anyway.

In the meantime, African gangs will continue to run riot until Victorians get the message and elect a proper government. It is hard to believe that they once elected people like Bolte and Kennett.

Foreign Minister Marise Payne according to -
news.com.au - stated that she was supportive of the
deal.

"We encourage the states and territories to expand
opportunities with China," she told ABC radio.

And -

Federal Trade Miister, Simon Birmingham also welcomed the
deal. He said that the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade
was involved in the drafting "all the way through."

Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews said that -

"Maybe the latest PM needs to get a briefing from the
Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade (DFAT) as well,
they're all a bit confused up there (in Canberra)
aren't they?"

Not only in Canberra it seems.

I would not be taking a lot of notice of Payne, Birmingham or Andrews. Until and if Morrison is proved wrong, I'm sticking with him. We are not talking about a 'deal’ here: we are talking about China's Belt and Road scheme which is designed to dominate countries in the region, as minor island nations who have signed up are just starting to find out.

As far as I'm aware, the federal government alone can sign a treaty with a foreign power, with the approval of Federal Parliament, after a 15 day tabelling of the proposed treaty. The three politicians mentioned by Foxy have certainly not indicated in their careers so far that anyone should take notice of them.

As for DEFAT, well who knows what they have been meddling with unbeknownst to the PM. Only recently they questioned an action of the PM’s because he hadn't run it past them. He ignored them for the public servants they are, and life went on. We elect politicians to make decisions for us, not public servants.

We shall see. But, in the meantime, there IS a lot of confusion among the dimwits we are supposed trust, and we have NO reason to be confident that the country is in good hands.

The PM should really talk to his own Departments first
before making comments to the media. He obviously is
not an experienced political leader.

No doubt the thread will get another life after the horrific news from Melbourne
Not sure us becoming haters will stop this
But hard not to hate the primitive hate that we saw
Education, bringing some out of the middle ages, seems a start
Think we can take one thing for granted, every one of us feels sorry for the victims and thanks both Police and civilians who tried to stop it.

Andrews has been confronted with the possibility of a Chinese staffer having links with the CCP, following the revelation that he was mixed up in Belt and Road discussions with a Chinese official. Who knows? But Andrews has certainly attracted the wrong wrong sort of publicity leading up to an election at the end of the month.

What alarmed me most about the footage of a large black lunatic waving a knife about was what looked, on the face of it, to be police cowardice - officers backing away with their hands up, from the lunatic. Good idea for civilians, but police are supposed to be trained for such confrontations; they are armed with pistols, batons, pepper spray and, often, tasers. So, one of them eventually had the guts to shoot the offender, but perhaps some Victoria Police officers should be looking for different employment. They don't have an easy job, and it is dangerous; but they all knew that before they signed up.

The problem is not just in Victoria, we are just not hearing about the problems in other states.
I have a friend who works in juvenile justice in Perth. She tells me that up until a few years ago, the demographic causing the majority of underage crime were the aboriginal groups. But they have now been surpassed by gangs of African youth and more frightening is the fact that unlike the aboriginals who didn’t usually carry weapons, the Africans are armed with machetes and huge knives.
My grandchildren in Darwin tell me that African youths are causing problems there, fighting with the aboriginal youth and making themselves very unpopular.
It has nothing to do with religion, it is a cultural issue, a violent culture where tribalism still rife and they learn early to dominate and terrorise people to get what they want.
The only cure is a totally hard line on all violent crimes they commit, regardless of screams of protests from the usual suspects.

Belly,

You need to take Muhammad out of the equation first, and that will be impossible.

ttbn,

Backing away is not cowardice, what would you have done, given the PC pressure that police are under?

Our dumb politicians were warned, but they took no notice. Their morbid fear of being labelled 'racist' has numbed their brains.

I don't know whether or not all black Africans are prone to violence because of their culture; but I do know that if there were no black Africans there would be no violent African gangs. It is the same with Muslims: no Muslims, no Muslim terrorism.

Is Miss,

It is cowardice on the part of management and ordinary cops. What would I have done? I would have shot the bastard after one warning, and taken the consequences. My life, and those of police, are always more important than those of violent lunatics.

But, I would never be a police officer in the first place, given the gutless politicisation of the job. Nobody in Australia can now rely on police for protection.

ttbn,

Fair enough; personally I'd have acted in the way that the Australian Government trained me, I'd have shot him whilst he was still outside of knife range and continued shooting until he went down.

A few points about the police conduct.

-It makes perfect sense to engage the offender by holding up your hands and backing off. The engaging officer is safer doing this and engages the offender. Keeping the offender in one spot allows other officers time to come to the aid of the engaging officer.

-It was clear from the footage that the officer discharging his sidearm only did so when there was no other option. He demonstrated great control and professionalism. Great caution with the use of firearms was required as there were bystanders in all directions who could have been hit by stray gunfire.

In short, I think that the conduct of the Victorian Police was professional and exemplary.

Dear Fester,

I totally agree. The Police Commissioner fully explained
the situation the police were under, and the reasons for
their behaviour was rational and logical. Made perfect
sense.

The police have now done their usual back down and are now treating the Bourke Street 'incident’ as a terror attack.

Sir Harry Gibbs, Chief Justice of the High Court from 1981 to 1987, ruled that “ …. a state is entitled to prevent the immigration of persons whose culture is such that they are unlikely readily to integrate… “.

There are about 500,000 Muslims in Australia now, and there more that there are, the more chance there is of terrorism, just the same as more of any culture that does not believe in democracy and the rule of law brings increased danger to our country.

And, the blame for this danger clearly lies with Australian politicians. None of these dangerous people would be here now if it was not for Australian politicians; they could have prevented it all, but they ignored the likes of Justice Gibbs and other people who actually know something about Islam and violent, uncivilised cultures.

Our weak Prime Minister is more concerned with praying and crying over ‘refugees’. The one before him often expressed his admiration of Islam.

It's not the religions that should be blamed -
it's how people behave that matters. Don't
blame religion for the actions of individuals.
And extremists and fanatics exist everywhere.
Whether they are white, black, or in-between.
All we can go by is the rule of law.

Well nice to see the suport for the police, no need to not say it, '
In an effort to not be American like those police put their own lives at risk ,by being seconds late in killing the man.
Our First Muslim terrorist act was during ww1, two Turks wheeled an ice cream hand cart, near the rail lines and opened up on picnicking passengers killing one.
Yes we all would*now* liked to have seen the man and his family deported
We however unlike the filth that they are abide by the law
Maybe we need harsher laws for them, not us,this will not be the last gutless murder in the name of a God

Big Nana,
Thanks for the info, that is what I was looking for when first posted this thread and only got one other problem area, that of Penrith. Now it appears that there maybe problems also in Perth and Darwin. worth keeping an eye on them and certainly need tougher law enforcement on African youth in Melbourne.

Foxy,
Whether it be African youths or muslim terrorists, it is culturally related. These groups have no respect for our society or laws. All cultures are not the same.

The only way is to stop further entry of the whole group and then get much tougher on law breakers. Appeasement and kid glove treatment just will not work. As shown, they laugh in our face.

The continued new arrival of those with alien culture refreshes the alien aspects of their culture.

The purpose of a knife attack is to kill the person attacked, the police should have opened fire once he was within four metres of them, if not sooner.

As far as the danger to others, there should be no stray shots by well-trained police.

Dear Henry,

A recent panel discussion on TV had a guest speaker
who expressed sentiments that many people might agree
with. Offenders who repeatedly break our laws instead
of being jailed at taxpayer's expense should be
deported to their country of origin or the country
of their parents. Possibly an option could be given
to permit them to migrate to another country of choice.
Should they be acceptable to the other country.
One example - New Zealand.

This sentiment has been repeated frequently of late.
It might encourage the communities from which these
offenders come from to react more responsibly.

Migrant communities in the past established activities
and organisations for their members and their children
assisting in the eventual assimilation process. For example -
sporting clubs, scouts, national dance groups, youth
choirs, theatre groups, and so on.

Surely we can sideline religion when talking of these youths.
IF and it is unlikely, they are Muslim, they are not living the faith
Their difference is impacting, we see them because they are different.
Too courts seem to be too easy on youth crime, always
PC driven insanity hold police to account even if they have done nothing wrong
Fear of being branded racist is well founded in a world that is PC driven

Culture and religion do affect how people act, but it is a waste of time trying to convince relativists of this, so I'm not going to try. I just hope that they never have to find out the truth the hard way. I wonder how long it will be before the next incident. I also wonder how the family of the cafe owner slaughtered by the terrorist is feeling about the 'religion of peace' today. The best our PM can come up with is asking Muslim 'leaders' to do something. Good luck with that!

Apparently, the Melbourne offender had had his passport cancelled because he was a risk, but he was not on a watch list as he was not a risk.

Is Mise,
Perfect bureaucratic reasoning ! This fully explains the state of affairs.

Morrison says that this creep had ‘ violated the nation's trust's. Bullshite! The nation never trusted him and didn't want him here. Idiot politicians can't drag the rest of us into their stupid mistakes. Australian politicians, and only Australian politicians, are responsible for introducing Muslim terror to Australia.

Morrison also yabbered about 'extremist Islam’, as though there was more than one Islam. Islam is extremist by definition. Read the Koran, bozo! We just can't seem to get politicians who know anything.

ttbn,
Well said, I cannot agree more.

Too late, the polys will awake as the damage is done.

Our grandchildren will suffer and our females the sacrificial lambs, just like Europe.

Is Mise

Have a look at the footage. I hate to use the analogy of bullfighting, but the coordination of the two confronting officers reminded me of a matador and muleta. My assessment was that the action protected the engaging officers and bystanders. It is funny how people can view the same footage and draw very different conclusions.

ttbn Quote "Australian politicians, and only Australian politicians, are responsible for introducing Muslim terror to Australia. "

You are wrong BLAME the UN. I submitted a thread late last night of what the UN want it is absolutely crazy for every Western Nation.

Hopefully if approved should be up later today.

Fester and Foxy

The coward was the Police Commissioner for not calling out trolley man as a complete idiot and dangerous.

If you watch the videos the trolley was too high for the Somali to fall backwards, trolley man was too weak and the assailant too big so there was no way he generate enough momentum to push him straight to the ground he was at 1 point pushing him toward police.

You will see at some point he nearly hit the police with the trolley if they were knocked down that would have been end game for them.

The police did make mistakes they backed them self over by the tree and wall not good they should have kept the situation in the open middle of the street, the assailant was large and lumbering in motion so they could easily have danced around him if they wanted even if one went behind him and shot him in the rear end. All of this while the idiot with the trolley was trying to push him, it could of been his actions that forced them over by the tree, I don't know for sure.

Why did they not use capsicum spray or a taser if they had them, that will be for the inquiry to answer.

Philip S.,

Both police attempted to use pepper spray and to
taser the guy bit it didn't seem to have any
effect.

The police behaved professionally and we should
be grateful to them.

Why are Sudanese youths allowed to be above the law in Victoria.
The Andrews Government has commanded the Victoria Police not to mention African crime.
A woman who had her car highjacked in Melton was told by Police NOT to mention to anyone that they were African but to say they were tall youths.

Three violent attacks this week on telecom stores in less than 24 hours were not mentioned on the Police Website and no mention in the media.
If you see any mention of African violence in the media multiply this by ten fold and you will get the correct figure.
Victoria Police do not put African crime into their data base (excepting Stabbings as Hospital records would show up the Police.)
It shows how they are losing the fight with African crime.

Google the percentage of crime rates in this country.
It's very small - most of the crimes are not by African
refugees. Check it out.

Fester,

I have viewed the footage and as I said earlier, when I was trained by the Australian Government (at some expense) I was trained to never let anyone with a knife closer than 15 feet before shooting them and to fire "double tap", that is two shots in quick succession and centre mass (repeat if necessary).

It is dangerous Political Correctness to expect the police to do less, they put their lives on the line so should be unfettered in protecting their lives and the lives of others.

Foxy,

"Both police attempted to use pepper spray and to
taser the guy bit it didn't seem to have any
effect."

Which is why pepper spray and tasers are a waste of space and just something more to carry on an already overloaded belt

Foxy Quote "Google the percentage of crime rates in this country.
It's very small - most of the crimes are not by African
refugees. Check it out."

I have stated on numerous occasions do you really believe the statistics provided by the Police?

Just like unemployment figures which would make the Government look bad are manipulated lower than they really are.

You want your cake and be able to eat it as well with your statement above.
1st "the percentage of crime rates in this country. It's very small"

Compared to what?
For argument sake assume you are right "we have a small percentage of crime"

Please explain why Africans who are a very small percentage of the population have a higher percentage of offenders than other groups.

Remember those riots lately some by up to 100 Sudanese no one was arrested even though property damage was caused police were told to stand down and monitor situation, for statistical figures crimes committed equals ZERO.

Also Africans come here after 2 years or so are granted citizenship, for statistical purposed they are now Australian or as the media says Australian Africans something like that.

Foxy, I think I asked you this once before.

Do you honestly believe the statistics the Government publishes when if they were high it would lead to public unrest?

Foxy,

"Google the percentage of crime rates in this country.
It's very small - most of the crimes are not by African
refugees. Check it out."

Google the number of people stabbed to death in Australia by Muslims, also check the number of police employees shot dead by Muslims.

Sure we have our own criminals, but is that any reason to import followers of a political movement that aims to overthrow our way of life?

Philip and Is Mise,

Crime Statistics in Victoria committed by the following
groups:

1) Australians
2) New Zealanders
3) Indians
4) Vietnamese
5) Sudanese

Source: Victorian Crime Statistics Agency.

The following link explains further:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-17/what-statistics-tell-us-about-melbournes-african-crime-issue/9336604

Is Mise,

Please provide a link to back up your claims about Muslims
Thanks.

Foxy Why do you fail to answer my question.

Do you honestly believe the statistics the Government publishes when if they were high it would lead to public unrest?

You conveniently failed to read my post regarding why the numbers are probably incorrect.

Foxy you even failed to address these points which could make a significant difference. "Remember those riots lately some by up to 100 Sudanese no one was arrested even though property damage was caused police were told to stand down and monitor situation, for statistical figures crimes committed equals ZERO.

Also Africans come here after 2 years or so are granted citizenship, for statistical purposed they are now Australian or as the media says Australian Africans something like that."

Above I posted this "VICTORIA Police faked more than 250,000 breath tests over a period of five years"

They have proven to lie and manipulate statistics, so tell me why I should believe them now?

Foxy - Answer the question instead of come back with your rubbery figures

Philip,

I can't give you what you want.

And I don't wish to argue with you. You believe one thing
I believe another. I think I'm right, and you could be
too.

You want an argument. I don't. If you want to continue to
argue - you're on your own.

Have a nice evening.

You didn't even read the link I gave - did you?

Is Mise

I agree with you that the officer would have been safer by firing more than once, but firing a single shot was what the officer was trained to do. I am sure that the officers involved were well aware that firing double tap was a safer approach for them, but to me that makes their actions more commendable. Hopefully the investigation and inquiry will lead to better and safer protocols. It might also allow a level headed discussion as to why a one shot policy is currently in use.

Foxy,

The link for the police employee,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Parramatta_shooting

the one for the stabbing,
http://www.news.com.au/national/victoria/car-on-fire-in-melbournes-bourke-st-mall/news-story/47635c260e97cf932516036aea0f336a

Short memory syndrome??

Foxy,
On what %age of these groups are those figures based on ? 100:1 ?
I never read anything on that but I'm pretty sure that most crimes in any Nation are committed by citizens of the Nation.

When the rules aren't enforced- rule breakers are emboldened. We need automated email reporting of crime into a database to avoid police filtering and filtering by politicians. Those from other cultures only grudgingly follow our rules - culture is too complex to write down- culture is an extension of family and is loosely genetically based, and based on family and parental values. What benefit would Australian's have in destroying their own culture- maybe they should have lunch with their families more- maybe they should find out why their own (usually male) ancestors fought for Australia. Global Socialists hate Australia. Free Trade Globalists just care about money. Sitting Bull says you can't eat money. Desmond Morris believed that mass human society is problematic.

The Bourke St incident appears to be a result of Global Socialist progressive social policy.

Is Mise,

Thanks for the links.

As our PM pointed out recently the Muslim communities
have to become more pro-active in dealing with
the radicalisation of some members within their
groups. Also police need to more closely monitor
"people of interest" within the community. Strong
laws and deportation - for those that continue to
break our laws.

Dear Individual,

I gave a link - perhaps you should read it - or Google
the information.

Four more you Africans, like usual they like overwhelming odds 4 on to 1.

A gang of African youths have smashed their way into a McDonald's restaurant and bashed a teenage employee with a metal pole.

The terrifying armed robbery unfolded in Laverton, Melbourne's south-west, in the early hours of Tuesday morning.

Four masked offenders demanded cash before fleeing the scene, leaving a 19-year-old man with a serious laceration to his head.

'Investigators have been told four masked offenders forced their way into a fast food outlet on Fitzgerald Road about 3.20am,' Victoria Police said in a statement.

'One of the staff members, a 19-year-old man, was hit over the head with a metal pole.

'The offenders, who are perceived to be African in appearance, fled the scene.'