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The Forum > General Discussion > Has the UN Just Lost it Completelt ?

Has the UN Just Lost it Completelt ?

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Dear mhaze,

Oh good lord my dear fellow, how on earth have the fatuous flailings of a blowhard president had any role in bringing North Korea to the table? Don't be a fool.

In reality what they have done is shaken the South enough to cause them to make the overtures because they know an all out war would be devastating for them. They have tried to gain some control of the situation and effectively drag Trump kicking and screaming into the mix.

What the North have always said is that they would not negotiate without a clear path toward getting the Yanks off the peninsula. The South and the US annually hold the world's largest war games complete with invasion practice just below the border. The also continue to make daily fighter jet flights directly at the same.

What do you think the words “A Nuclear Free Peninsula” mean? That will entail the US committing to moving all nuclear armed shipping, missiles and planes from the area in exchange for the North giving up its weapons.

It is something the North has been striving for for well over a decade and it looks like it might be a possibility.

Remember the behind the scenes deal to stop the Russians in Cuba was that the US would remove all nuclear weapons from Turkey within 6 months which they did.
Posted by SteeleRedux, Sunday, 29 April 2018 7:45:44 PM
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Poor SR, reduced to inanity to deny that the recent good news from NK is primarily due to Trump's diplomacy.

Of course, SR is so unalterably anti-Trump that there's isn't any chance that SR would be able to credit him with even a passing success. There's the old joke that's apropos here - if video emerged of Trump walking on water, SR would declare that its proof that Trump can't swim.

Roughly a year ago, when Trump lobbed a few missiles into Syria, I noted that it was a master-stroke in that the US's adversaries would be much more 'flexible' in the future. And so its come to pass.

China, fearing that Trump will follow through with his trade threats, have significantly increased the trade sanctions against Kim. As has the rest of the world.

And slowly the US has been increasing the pressure on the North.

Kim's main concern is to maintain his regime. Trump is making it clear that he has little interest in regime change while at the same time making it clear the regime has no future if it maintains its present coarse. Equally its clear that Kim needs economic help or, eventually, his nation and regime will collapse under the economy stranglehold being enforced.

SR is making up assertions that Kim wants nukes off the peninsula but that's rubbish. And indeed its Kim who is making concessions even before talks start, not the other way around as poor old SR fantasises.

In a little over a year Trump has made more progress toward resolving the Korean problem than his three predecessors did in 20 years.

But don't expect the likes of SR to acknowledge that or even understand it. They're still trying to work out while lobbing missiles into Syria was a success instead of the harbinger of war that they predicted or how Trump could destroy ISIS in such a short time while the 'experts' said it'd take many years.

President Moon said "I think President Trump deserves big credit for bringing about the inter-Korean talks." But what would he know, eh?
Posted by mhaze, Monday, 30 April 2018 10:43:44 AM
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I had not heard of Moon's praise of Trumps success mhaze. It looks like even the radical ratbag organisation that the UN has become, has read the tea leaves, & now realises they will have to modify their policies & stance, with a strong man, not a leftist dupe, in charge.

Perhaps they have realised that the UN can only exist with US generosity, & that the US is no longer prepared to be the whipping boy of dictators & con men.
Posted by Hasbeen, Monday, 30 April 2018 11:07:24 AM
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Dear mhaze,

You seem a little triggered old chap. I'm not sure why as you seem to have accepted most of my positions on this since you have not offered anything substantial to disprove them.

You wrote;

“Roughly a year ago, when Trump lobbed a few missiles into Syria, I noted that it was a master-stroke in that the US's adversaries would be much more 'flexible' in the future. And so its come to pass.”

So this is why the Syrians dialed it up and used chemical weapons recently? Because they had been cowered into submission by those missiles? Trump diplomacy at work?

You also wrote;

“SR is making up assertions that Kim wants nukes off the peninsula but that's rubbish.”

Here is an AP report from a couple of days ago;

By ASSOCIATED PRESS April 27, 2018
(GOYANG, South Korea) — The two Koreas have agreed to rid their peninsula of nuclear weapons but failed to provide any new specific measures how to achieve that. A joint statement issued after their leaders’ talks Friday says the two Koreas confirmed their goal of achieving “a nuclear-free Korean Peninsula through complete denuclearization.” North Korea has placed its nukes up for negotiations. It has previously used the term “denuclearization” to say it can disarm only when the United States withdraws its 28,500 troops in South Korea.

I ask again; What do you think the words “A Nuclear Free Peninsula” mean?

Trump is of course getting played even more than the previous administrations but you will be there polishing his boots as always and blaming others when the whole show falls apart yet again.
Posted by SteeleRedux, Monday, 30 April 2018 6:40:42 PM
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That warm and fuzzy feeling you of the rabid right are now feeling is only Cousin Kimmy keeping himself warm burning some of those billions of Yankee dollars The Donald is feeding North Korea in return for ditching their war toys.
Posted by Paul1405, Tuesday, 1 May 2018 10:53:16 AM
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SR,

“A Nuclear Free Peninsula” mean? "

Well I'll play. It one of those expression that means whatever you want it to mean. Ask 5 people and you'll get 6 answers.

But to me it means exactly what it says. The Korean homeland without nukes on its land. If Kim wants that, he can have it tomorrow since he's the only one with nukes on the homeland.

That's why what you say is rubbish. IF Kim wants no nukes in Korea he can have it without needing to negotiate.

Kim wants his nukes but is prepared to negotiate them away in return for that which he really wants - security for his regime. That requires two things:

* guarantees that the US/SK won't seek regime change if he denuclearises. This is a tough(er) sell because of what happened to Qaddafi who gave up his nukes in return for similar guarantees only to see those utter fools Hillary/Obama take him out anyway. I'd imagine part of the guarantee will entail the US reducing its forces in SK, a move that suits Trump's aims anyway, as part of America first.
* Kim also needs an improving economy to alleviate the chances of an internal uprising. The pressures Trump has placed on NK through the sanctions and though forcing Xi to abide by his promises on sanctions has devastated the NK economy. Kim can't allow that to continue.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/952749/kim-jong-un-north-korea-mcdonalds-donald-trump-usa

"you seem to have accepted most of my positions "

Such as?

"So this is why the Syrians dialed it up and used chemical weapons recently?"

Check this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_chemical_weapons_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War

and see how the use of chemical weapons dramatically declined following the Trump intervention.

But the unthinking anti-Trump crowd operate on the basis that if it isn't a 100% success its a failure. Of course, that only applies to Trump.

"Donald Trump deserves a Nobel Peace Prize, says South Korean President Moon Jae-in" http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-04-30/trump-should-win-nobel-peace-prize-moon-says/9712590

Because Nobels are often give to those dragged "kicking and screaming" to the peace table.

Peace may not come, but Trump has bought the Koreas closer than ever before.
Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 1 May 2018 5:56:34 PM
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