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The Forum > General Discussion > Love the Lord with all your heart.

Love the Lord with all your heart.

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Dear Not_now.Soon,

«then we can approach the idea of there being a choice of which is right for each person»

Yes, but it is not a "choice": based on your complete situation, personality and history, there is/are religion(s) that is/are more right (or suitable) for you than others - that is already given, you just need to discover which is it (or which are they). Also try to find sagacious advice rather than act on a whim, which could later prove to be ego-based.

No religion can be totally and objectively "right" for the simple reason that God is beyond description.

Even if no religion is 100% right for you, it's better to just settle for the time-being on a religion that is 99% right for you, then stick to it through the rough parts and once your course is steady, make the necessary minor adjustments as needed. While your journey to God is unique, some of the difficulties, especially the gross ones, are common to most people.

«Just on the basis that most religions have a standard that if right make other religions wrong»

Well, some religions might teach the particular practice of believing that "other religions are not right" and I can see where it could fit. Assuming that the religion in question is a true religion for its adherents, all it means is that it would be helpful for the adherents (or for some adherents) to believe that other religions are not right. Fine, then believe so because it helps you, but that does not mean that other religions are actually, in fact, not right for others.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Sunday, 4 March 2018 11:35:52 PM
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To Yuyutsu.

"No religion can be totally and objectively "right" for the simple reason that God is beyond description."

Why not? Even With God being beyond our measure to understand Him, if He sent us a message and it became a religion, how could that message and teaching be wrong. God wouldn't lie would He?

Look at it this way. If Christianity is right, then so is Jewish faith based on the Torah. But if Islam is right then both Christian and Jewish faiths are wrong, because Islamic teachings that those scripture have been corrupted. If any Abrahamic religion is right then Wicca, Vodoo, Hodoo, and any other religion that uses magic or an occult force is wrong.

I am less familiar with many other religions but if any religion is right because it comes from God, then their standards and teachings also show how other religions are wrong. If any religion that believes in reincarnation is right, then the religions that believe in a heaven or a hell are wrong. It's that simple. If it is from God it is objectively right. It it is from God and gives teachings and standards that other religions do not adhere to, then those religions are wrong.
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Monday, 5 March 2018 4:35:08 AM
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Dear Not_Now.Soon,

«if He sent us a message and it became a religion, how could that message and teaching be wrong.»

It's like saying, "my neighbour received such-and-such medication from her doctor - can the doctor be wrong?". While the doctor could have provided the best possible medicine for your neighbour, if you took that same medicine you could, and likely would, be poisoned.

Now the concept of "message" is only metaphorical, because messages can only be sent between two separate entities. While we seem to be separated from God (and suffer as a result), we are not truly separate and thus no message can pass "between us".

More specifically, God does not speak in words (I assume you don't believe that He has a mouth, do you?). Seers and prophets experience God within them, but even the greatest prophet has to "translate" their experience of God into thoughts and then into words. Words are inaccurate and their scope is so much culturally-dependent.

Just a small example, you read about the "hand of God": of course this is a metaphor since God doesn't have hands, but even then arguments arise as to what was the prophet trying to convey? In English, a 'hand' extends from the wrist to the end of the fingers; what's above it is 'arm', but in Hebrew, the language of the old testament, 'hand' includes the fore-arm while 'arm' means only the upper-arm. Arguing about God's body-parts became ridiculously popular at a time: Exodus 8:19 mentions: "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God", while Exodus 14:31 (relating to the crossing of the red sea) mentions: "And when the Israelites saw the mighty hand of the Lord displayed against the Egyptians", thus the Rabbis argue that since a hand has 5 fingers and God inflicted 10 plagues on the Egyptians in Egypt, He must have inflicted 50 plagues on them in the red sea...

[continued...]
Posted by Yuyutsu, Tuesday, 6 March 2018 12:47:08 PM
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[...continued]

«Look at it this way. If Christianity is right, then so is Jewish faith based on the Torah.»

Then why aren't you following it? Probably because it is personally inappropriate for you.

Religion is not concerned with questions about what is objectively "right" or "wrong" in the sense of correct/incorrect (these, rather, are scientific questions). Religion is rather concerned with the question "what is right/good to do" as opposed to "what is wrong/evil to do". While many acts (say murder) are commonly evil for everyone (perhaps almost-everyone), there are acts that are evil only for some. Since you accept Judaism as correct, then one example for you would be pork-eating: OK for you, but sinful for Jews. Same for the use of magic: wrong for Judaic/Middle-Eastern tribes, but good for some northern/British or African tribes, etc.

«but if any religion is right because it comes from God»

Religion is right when it LEADS to God.

«If any religion that believes in reincarnation is right, then the religions that believe in a heaven or a hell are wrong.»

You may be interested to learn that Hinduism and Buddhism acknowledge the existence of both heaven (led to by good actions) and hell (led to by bad actions).

However, both religions set their standard higher than heaven and teach that one should not aim for heaven or be tempted and distracted by its lure. One should not be tempted for example by the prospect of 72 virgins or even by the prospect of singing with the angelic choirs, but instead continue to strive forward and not stop anywhere short of God.

«If it is from God it is objectively right»

Can you possibly conceive of anything that is NOT from God??

«It it is from God and gives teachings and standards that other religions do not adhere to, then those religions are wrong.»

It could only mean that religions which do not adhere to those particular teachings and standards are not right for you. They could still be right for others.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Tuesday, 6 March 2018 12:47:15 PM
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To Yuyutsu.

What you speak about is to remove any standard and to personalize the world to make it fit the person. It reminds me of a verse in the bible. 2 Timothy 4:1-4
___________________________
4 In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge: 2 Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. 3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. 5 But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.
___________________________________
In your perspectives there is no truth. No standard of right or wrong, or even when there are disputes, no measure for what is true, and what isn't. It all begs the question that it is all relative and has no standing foundation. Therefore should I respect your views more then my own?

You say it is ok to be Christian, but do not try to spread it to anyone else, I case I harm them in the message. Jesus told the Apstoles to spread the gospel to all nations and gave a great commission to teach everyone the good news of the kingdom of Heaven. In order to be a faithful Christian I must reject the idea that the message is not for everyone. Because it is for everyone.

(Continued)
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Tuesday, 6 March 2018 6:27:36 PM
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(Continued)

You've said that God does not speak. Is anything impossible for God? More then once God spoke in plain words to people in the bible. And even today there are people who say they have heard from God. If He spoke then would He be silent now? No I reject your view that God can not speak or will not speak. He can communicate in any way He seems fit. And sometimes that is through being lead, through dreams, through study and prayer. And at least a few occasions God communicates through the language of the person He speaks to.

These are things I am talking about when I say to set up a stable standard. To know what is correct and right, as opposed to what is in error, mistakes, or lies. If God speaks then it is wrong to say that He doesn't speak. It is wrong on the basis that it is false. Not a personal truth of it's true to some but not for others. No! If sonething happens anywhere, then it happens and shows that those who say it doesn't are wrong.
Posted by Not_Now.Soon, Tuesday, 6 March 2018 6:28:41 PM
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