Shadow, the claim that FTTH ISN'T superior is complete bollocks! On financial terms alone it's better, as it's much cheaper to operate, much cheaper to maintain, and won't require the next generation to replace it. And copper wires are just as dependent on batteries in emergencies as fibre optics are - except that being less reliable, the copper wires are less likely to be used in emergencies.

Additionally there are some big non financial benefits: it's much more reliable, and future needs can be met as soon as the customers are ready rather than having to wait for a costly network upgrade. And these technical advantages are extremely important. With FTTH if I pay for 100Mb/s I know I can get that speed in all weather. With FTTN I can't be sure. And I currently don't really have a need for 100Mb/s so I'm not willing to pay the extra cost, but I don't expect that to always be the case.

But NBNCo are charging too much for fast internet that doesn't actually cost them any more than the slower speeds. If they reduced the charge, far more people would use it.

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ttbn,
How low would interest rates have to be before you'd consider infrastructure provision to be more important than "to balance the books"?

Dear Ttbn,

You already described the real problem - it's not about bandwidth (those who want/need more bandwidth, could simply have used two or more copper lines in parallel).

«If you haven't already got NBN, just wait until the internet breaks down, as it often does, and you not only lose your ability to use computers, but you will not be able to watch TV or use your telephone, either. Everyone will need a mobile phone for emergencies whether they want it or not. No more landlines, folks. Even if you don't have TV or a computer, you will be stuck with a you-beaut, state of the art, VOIP (Voice Over Internet Phone) telephone. A wonderful thing, modernity and 'advancement'.»

Exactly, and since I consider the sending of electromagnetic waves that pierce through other people and animals to be immoral, I don't have that emergency option.

I did however talked with a wiring guy and was assured that they can arrange something, with a strong battery backup and other equipment, so I can retain my existing phone. It could cost me about $2000, but it should work on the dark day when those bastards reach my suburb.

Nothing of course will work once this internet is hacked - and it will, sooner or later, be hacked to the point of being unusable.

Aidan,

You clearly know sweet bugger all about networks. Copper is by far cheaper to install and maintain, and copper can transfer power as well as data. Phones do not need power from the home and can rely entirely on the tiny amount of power transferred from the switchboard, whereas phones on FO require power from the house and battery back up in case of failure, so much so that fire and lift services will accept copper as a secure backup, but not FO, and where copper is not available will require secure FO with battery back up AND a wireless redundancy. FO cables are also far more fragile, and if hit by say a spade the fibers will break and generally the entire cable will have to be replaced, whereas copper can withstand a fair amount of abuse with no failures.

At work, while we get our internet via fiber, the internal network is copper and runs at 1000 Mb/s. The failing with copper is that the further you go the slower the data transfer, so while 1000Mb/s is possible up to 200m at 1km it is 200Mb/s, 10km it is 20Mb/s etc. For older type phone cables, the starting speeds are slower, but the same general rule applies.

My suburb has not been upgraded, but because I am within 2km of the hub, I get 25Mb/s which is certainly all I need, switching to NBN would simply increase the price of the internet by 100%. The whole point of FTTN is to reduce the distance of copper from say 10km to less than 500m which in most cases will deliver 100Mb/s and save $30b.

According to the all knowing Shadow Minister <<Copper is by far cheaper to install and maintain>>. but that is at odds with what the NBN chief executive Bill Morrow admitted before the Senate Estimates Committee; copper technology was more expensive to maintain.

"NBN Co revealed it had purchased 15,050km of copper cable from Australia, Brazil and Turkey, and the National Broadband Network may still require more of the old technology previously used to connect landline phones." One expert likened the investment in copper wire to investing in steam trains, must have been thinking about Malcolm's train wreck.

Money Bags Malcolm and his incompetent government don't have a problem "splashing the cash" on NBN when it comes to their mates. In the latest bit of largesse from MBM to the high flyers at the NBN $109 million in bonuses and other goodies has been paid out to show the taxpayers appreciation of what a fantastic job the NBN is turning out to be.

Yuyutsu,

I don't have a mobile either. I'm too busy dodging zombies on the footpath, with their heads down, texting or whatever it is that they do with the damn things. They are a menace to pedestrians and motorists.

How do you feel about having to pay $2,000 for something that you already have and have paid for? The NBN, mobile phones - all the 'advances', are just there to screw more money out of people who already have spend a lot on stuff they don't need in the saturated market. Have to keep the rich getting richer!

Shadow Minister,

Yes. Doing away with copper was moronic. We have to rely more on electricity, which is become less reliable, less available and more expensive by the day.