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The Forum > General Discussion > ASIO: Intelligencers or Keystone Cops?

ASIO: Intelligencers or Keystone Cops?

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Apparently the Director General of ASIO,  Duncan Lewis, has made an ass of himself by denying to a Senate hearing that terrorism is not linked to Muslim immigration. (The Spectator online 29/5/17).

Writer, Andrew Urban, believes that Lewis is insulting all of us, including those in the Muslim community who assist ASIO, with his lying about the situation. He rightly also points out that the public is fed up Lewis's sort of “ dissembling on this topic”.

Adding to his bizarre bulldust, the Director General of of our key intelligence agency, replied to Senator Pauline Hanson's question as to whether or not he could confirm that the four terrorist attacks and the 12 foiled on Australian soil were committed by Muslims, he replied: “Certainly of the 12 thwarted attacks, one of those indeed involved a right-wing extremist, so, the answer is ‘no’, they have not always been carried out by Muslims.

So, only 11 of the 12 involved Muslims!

Can you believe that that response came from the Director General of ASIO?

For obvious reasons we can know little of the activities and capabilities of ASIO field operatives. But their boss gives us no reason to feel safe!

Who appoints such people?
Posted by ttbn, Monday, 29 May 2017 2:18:54 PM
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shows why Trump was right to speak of draining the swamp. Also shows why the West is stuffed, Progressive dogma tells us that a baby born with a penis could be a girl, that if I feel like it I might be Chinese that I am and that Christianity is the cause of all the evil on the planet. How on earth do you expect them to understand that when Islamist call Allahu Akbar before beheading or bombing that they are following the footsteps of Mohammed. You see they are the 'rational' ones and you are the racist one.
Posted by runner, Monday, 29 May 2017 2:48:57 PM
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Here’s a link to the article ttbn is referring to, since he is apparently incapable of posting links himself:

http://spectator.com.au/2017/05/asios-insult-to-the-intelligence-of-muslims

--

ttbn,

Both you and the author of the Spectator article have misrepresented what was said by Duncan Lewis.

<<Duncan Lewis, has made an ass of himself by denying to a Senate hearing that terrorism is not linked to Muslim immigration.>>

Not quite.

All Lewis said was that there was no evidence of a connection between REFUGEES and terrorism. Stating that there is no evidence for a connection between two variables is not the same as denying that a connection exists at all.

The actual dialogue, for those interested: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aw2h4BDJzvg

<<So, only 11 of the 12 involved Muslims!>>

No, as even you have quoted, he didn’t say “only”. You have added that in afterwards to make it sound like Lewis was attempting to downplay Muslim involvement. Lewis simply stated that one case was not related to Islam. The Spectator article you didn’t link to used the same rhetorical trick:

“Yes, Pauline, stop exaggerating. Only 11 of the 12 were carried out by Muslims.”

Hanson asked if all 12 thwarted terror attacks in Australia were planned by Muslims, and if not, then by whom? Lewis simply answered her question. What was he supposed to say?
Posted by AJ Philips, Monday, 29 May 2017 3:52:42 PM
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Simple fact very senior police and security services bosses are political appointments bearing that in mind with Turnbulls apologist manner anyone who expected the truth is deluding them self.

Politicians nearly never ask a question they do not know the answer too.
So Hanson asked the wrong question or maybe should have hit him with facts that he could not deny then ask about Islamic terrorism.

QUOTE The chief of ASIO Duncan Lewis is not telling the truth, "I have absolutely no evidence to suggest there's a connection between refugees and terrorism"

Abdul Nacer Benbrika, mastermind of the MCG bombing plot and currently serving a 15 year jail sentence was in Australia as a refugee fleeing his "unsafe" country of origin Algeria.

How is it The Australian uncovered these 22 cases published on 8 October last year - but the details somehow eluded the boss of ASIO?

Up to 22 people trying to join Australia’s extra refugee intake of 12,000 Syrians face rejection because of fears they are linked to terrorist organisations, including Islamic State, which used refugees as “camouflage” to enter Europe and carry out the Paris attacks last year.

http://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2017/05/watch-chief-of-asio-shut-down-pauline-hansons-quite-reasonable-questions-about-refugees-and-terroris.html
Posted by Philip S, Monday, 29 May 2017 4:31:34 PM
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There was no misrepresentation, AJ Philips. You would call black white if it suited you. I cannot understand how anyone could be so badly damaged and deluded. You must have had a really terrible life, graduating from pulling wings off flies to stalking online. I don't know what your twisted aim is in trying to bait me all the time, you twisted nut job, and I don't care. It isn't working.
Posted by ttbn, Monday, 29 May 2017 5:01:31 PM
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Dear ttbn,

The problem is in your own mind.

AJ replies to you citing links and facts.

You are the one who persists in name calling
and personal attacks.

You appear to be the one with the problem.

If it "isn't working" as you claim, why do you
keep doing it? Can't you have a well reasoned
adult discussion?

No one is attacking you.
Posted by Foxy, Monday, 29 May 2017 5:09:14 PM
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Philip S,

Yes, I was a little concerned about the rate at which Lewis blinked when he answered that question, suggesting an increase in stress levels. It’s a sad state of affairs if someone like the top boss of ASIO cannot answer a question honestly out of fear that it will ignite a political firestorm.

That being said, I see no reason why he shouldn’t have been able to at least state that some refugees have been rejected out of concerns for national security. I think Hanson’s ignorance is overt enough to not worry about inadvertently vindicating it with the occasional bit of truth that, prima facie, appears to vindicate what she says, if that’s what Lewis was worried about.

--

ttbn,

It sounds like you’re getting a little paranoid there. I mean, “baiting” you? For what, exactly?

I have a very good life with a loving wife and children of whom I am very proud, thanks anyway for your concern.

If you don’t like my responses, then all you need to do is present a reasoned argument as to why you think I'm wrong. What better way to send me packing? Instead, though, you resort personal attacks every time.

I think that says a lot.
Posted by AJ Philips, Monday, 29 May 2017 5:36:00 PM
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ttbn,

You are right of course, generals are politicians. Sometimes generals are being obliged to play their cards very close to their chest.

However I wouldn't doubt his astuteness and fierce determination to counter any threats to Australia. You can imagine what he thinks of the gutless creeps and of those who might assist them.

He would have been gritting his teeth having to choose his words so carefully.
Posted by leoj, Monday, 29 May 2017 5:40:16 PM
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Dear ttbn,

No. You are not right. You have not cited all
the facts as AJ pointed out to you. You gave
a wrong impression of the facts to suit your
own agenda. Wrong thing to do. But still you're
not alone in this on this forum. You'll have
some support from a kindred spirit who does
the same thing you do.
Posted by Foxy, Monday, 29 May 2017 6:18:57 PM
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Does anyone recall the Great Critic, AJ Philips, ever putting up a topic for discussion himself?
Posted by ttbn, Monday, 29 May 2017 9:17:20 PM
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ttbn,

I have never mocked you for starting a discussion thread, so whether or not I have ever started one myself is not relevant to anything. Nevertheless, I state my opinions often enough to provide you or anyone else with ample opportunity to critique them if you so desire.

All you have to do, ttbn, in any given instance, is explain why I am wrong. Provide a reasoned argument. That's all. In fact, I even invited you to do so in our last discussion and you still declined. In every instance, you opt instead to attack others personally, even when it is pointed out to you why doing so is fallacious.

You will never provide a reasoned argument for any of your beliefs because you are more interested in what you want to believe than you are in what you can justify believing.
Posted by AJ Philips, Monday, 29 May 2017 10:07:31 PM
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As expected, nobody – including the person himself – can cite an instance where AJ Philips has initiated a discussion or ventured a personal opinion for appraisal, instead of lurking like a Rock Spider to pounce on the opinions of others and try to demolish and humiliate them as is the way with all cowardly bullies.

Even his faithful acolyte, Foxy is silent.

AJ Philips even thinks his failure to contribute anything but negativity and hatred of free speech to OLO is “not relevant”.

Philips is the what is irrelevant, and I am done with him and his kind – very few of which exist on OLO, thankfully.
Posted by ttbn, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 12:00:20 PM
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So, you’re just going to dig your heels in then, ttbn? Is that it?

<<As expected, nobody – including the person himself – can cite an instance where AJ Philips has initiated a discussion …>>

Perhaps that's because I had already explained why whether or not I had started a general discussion is not relevant? (Answer: because I have never mocked you for doing so.)

<<… or ventured a personal opinion for appraisal ...>>

I had also noted that I put my opinion up for critiquing frequently. How about my atheism, or my support for marriage equality?

You have not countered either of these points I made earlier and have, again, opted instead continue with the personal attacks.

Not a good look, ttbn. Not a good look at all.
Posted by AJ Philips, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 12:13:17 PM
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I would say ASIO have done very well as far as terrorism in AU is concerned, and probably did not deserve being called Key stone Cops. Your point could have got out without that lingo. That in itself is inflammatory wording.
Posted by doog, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 12:21:43 PM
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Let's just cool down and clarify the situation:

11 out of 12 terrorist plots involved Muslims, not moderate Muslims, but Muslims following a fascist ideology with its roots in Islam.

The other terrorist plot involved either right-wing nutters, Buddhist terrorists, Christian terrorists, Hindu terrorists or Yazidi terrorists. So the chances of it being one of those was a bit less than one fifth of a plot each, while 11 of 12 plots involved Muslims.

A differential of fifty five. So could it be said that terrorist plots were likely to involve fascists affected by their interpretation of the Koran, i.e. by Islam, fifty five times more than other terrorist groups, if they exist ?

Hmmmmmm ...... let me think about that one. No, no, give me time ..........

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 1:17:11 PM
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AJ: Both you and the author of the Spectator article have misrepresented what was said by Duncan Lewis.

Yes, these CEO types at Royal Commissions sure go out of their way to make sure they can't be pinned down on anything. Their answers are always gobble-de-gook they avoid answering the Questions. They are very practiced in this form of answering questions. If they get cornered they stretch the time out so time for the question runs out. I watch them on the ABC all the time.

AJ: "Only 11 of the 12 were carried out by Muslims.” Hanson asked if all 12 thwarted terror attacks in Australia were planned by Muslims, and if not, then by whom? Lewis simply answered her question. What was he supposed to say?

He could have said , "but 11 out of 12 were."

It's probably not really his fault. He has his orders from the Left Wing Public Service as to what not to answer or to deflect an answer in order to take the heat off mohomadeans.

Foxy are you siding with the DG of ASIO. Another one who pretends not to see what's happening when most of Australia can.

One can only look forward to a personal tragedy befalling all the mohomadeans apologists. It looks like the only thing that will ever change their minds about Islamists, like happened to that young girl in Germany who demonstrated for Islamists in Germany. She took a few home & they beat her up & raped her. She has now changed her mind.
Posted by Jayb, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 1:48:25 PM
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'. It looks like the only thing that will ever change their minds about Islamists, like happened to that young girl in Germany who demonstrated for Islamists in Germany. She took a few home & they beat her up & raped her. She has now changed her mind.'

if only Jayb. If only the community was more welcoming. I mean they get housing, welfare, hashtags, refuge from war but if only the west was more welcoming.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 2:37:23 PM
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AJ: AJ: "Only 11 of the 12 were carried out by Muslims.” Hanson asked if all 12 thwarted terror attacks in Australia were planned by Muslims,

Oh, I get it AJ. It wasn't that the DG of ASIO that was wrong it was Hansons mistake. She phrased the Question wrong. That's here naivety showing. ttn's way of putting thing is somewhat the same. I think most people know what ttn & Pauline are trying to say. I just comes out wrong. The Lawyer in you was quick to pick up on that & take advantage of that naivety & just like Pauline's naivety, her detractors are quick to make fun of her.

Runner, regarding the young girl in Germany recently. It's not the first time that sort of thing has happened. Greece, Italy, France Denmark, Sweden & Norway have had similar incidents recently. Not to mention Rotherham in the UK & apparently it's still happening & being protected again by the police afraid of the mohomedean backlash.
Posted by Jayb, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 3:19:10 PM
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How do you get that from what I said, Jayb?

<<It wasn't that the DG of ASIO that was wrong it was Hansons mistake. She phrased the Question wrong.>>

I think I know how: by chopping the “and if not, then by whom?” off of my paraphrasing of Hanson.

That’s dishonest.

<<The Lawyer in you was quick to pick up on that & take advantage of that naivety & just like Pauline's naivety, her detractors are quick to make fun of her.>>

Actually, despite how easy it is to make fun of Hanson, I have not yet done so in this discussion. I think I deserve some credit for that, now that you mention it.
Posted by AJ Philips, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 3:31:39 PM
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' Runner, regarding the young girl in Germany recently. It's not the first time that sort of thing has happened. Greece, Italy, France Denmark, Sweden & Norway have had similar incidents recently. '

Of course you are right Jayb. The elite know it and continue to lie. Like Islam if it suites the narrative the end justifies their means. I mean you can't tell me the ASIO boss is that thick despite decades of secularism dumbing people down.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 3:33:57 PM
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Yes JB, it is not just every now and then either. There is a web site
that distributes a monthly report on Islamic crime in mostly Germany.
Almost every day has an Islamic immigrant murder, vicious assault,
rape, gang rape robbery etc etc.
The German police statistics speak for themselves.

The attempt by the authorities in European countries is worrying.
They try all the time to downplay the reports, almost never give a
description that describes an African or someone of middle eastern appearance.

The attitude of UK police is also worrying.
This video came about as a report of racist party.
The party was normal drinks laughter etc and a UTube video was playing
in the background. On the video came an item with a song mocking
Usama Bin Ladin. A female police officer reported it and a squad of
police showed up together with a covering helicopter.
Here it is;

http://tinyurl.com/y73d2agc

This is what happens when the authorities try to hush up anyone
speaking ill of Islam.
We are already heading down the same politically incorrect path.
Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:03:52 PM
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When it took over 4 hrs to get someone from ASIO to contact me regarding a serious security breach at a joint ADF/US facilities, one must ask the question: "Who is looking after the gatehouse?" It is very reminiscent of the "Care-Line" set ups, "...leave a number and we'll get back to you..." almost. The security section at the base was informed some 3 weeks prior that perimeters were not up to scratch, and the lack of physical barriers to prevent entry onto the site...but nothing done. It was as easy as; slipping under a wire fence where the wallabies had dug, walking up to a 'Top Secret' facility and then swiping a credit card through a very dodgy door lock to gain entry inside.

It was only when I contacted the US Embassy in Canberra that anyone seemed to register any concern regarding the ease at which that facility could have been attacked.

Keystone Cops...you betcha !
Posted by Albie Manton in Darwin, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:24:19 PM
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AJ: That’s dishonest.

Only trying to get in your Club mate. See, We can all put a spin on things. Feigning Innocence with a Cheshire cat smile. You know she is not educated enough in the ways of Political Elite Speak. That's why the Journalists have a field day with her Naivety. (Please explain) That's why, those who are afraid of her type taking any Power away from the select few, try to belittle her as much as possible.

The DG of ASIO took advantage of that & so ducked the question. Not in the spirit of Truth, is it?

I know ttn can be as dumb as they come sometimes but, like all of us, he is trying to make sense out of a deliberate ball of confusion. Help him with his load.
Posted by Jayb, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:35:10 PM
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There is one spark of rebellion in Europe.

http://tinyurl.com/y769fj7w

The Poles at least have told Angela Merkel where to go.
Anyone who criticises those who criticise Islam and the weak kneed
politicians should be asked;
Would you like Sydney to be like Paris ? or Malmo ? or Hamburg etc etc.
Interesting note, tourist traffic to Paris has fallen off.
I cannot find actual figures but they were around previously.
I may be looking in the wrong place. Anyway it is not a good
destination these days. A bus load of Korean tourists was attacked in
Paris about two months ago.
A friend just did a Rhine & Danube River cruise with no trouble.
By my experience those cruises are like a different world.
Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:37:04 PM
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Here are some reports on Paris tourism;

http://tinyurl.com/jq8ub4l

http://tinyurl.com/z9tj8ow

Anyway there is a lot more if you do not believe me.
Just google Fall in Paris Tourism.
Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:48:50 PM
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Clearly, not all Muslims are potential terrorists. Maybe only a minority are. Then surely, it's vital to be able to differentiate those who mean us no harm from those who do ? Surely it's just as 'racist' (assuming Islam wrongly is a race) to say

* 'they're all terrorists'

as to at

* 'there's no connection between terrorism and Islam',

if that implies that no Muslims are terrorists, or that they are no more likely to support terrorism as anybody else. Now, that would be dishonest, to say the least.

But in order to identify any potential threat from any terrorists, with limited manpower and budgets, we have to narrow down the possibilities. What would be the point of pumping money into surveillance of, say, Lithuanians just on the off-chance that, 'After all, they're as likely as commit terrorist acts as Muslims.' Are they really ? No, I don't think so, and it's dishonest to deny the statistical realities.

Islam has a problem. We help to protect law-abiding and peaceable Muslims by identifying who is, and who isn't, likely to support terrorism. We don't help anybody by denial, nor by wholesale blame.

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 4:54:19 PM
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the elite have been lying for years about crime let alone terrorism. Look at the lies Nixon told about the Sudanese in Melbourne. The sad part is that they create hell holes for vicitms of crimes and then walk away with fat pensions. Remember how they demonised Kevin Andrews when he warned pig headed Vanstone of problems the Sudanese would cause. And for her lies and denials she ends up with a job (guess where?) Your abc.
Posted by runner, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 5:15:29 PM
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Oh they are having a go at Pauline Hanson and the plane again.

I will bet quids that half the people complaining about the plane are
driving cars that are more expensive.
My son had the same ultra light aircraft. They are not as expensive
as many would think.
Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 7:54:51 PM
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Joe, you are just touching the real problem.
We have no way to know which moslems are or will be terrorists.
It is a very real problem but why should we bother to try & to sort it.
It is a no win situation.
Just do not let them enter. It is their problem not ours.
They are like crocodiles, if they are in your river they might not
attack you, but then they might.
They were in the river at Rockhampton so they deported them.
Posted by Bazz, Tuesday, 30 May 2017 8:07:08 PM
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If you want to dip into the history of all this Islamic war scene
here is an interesting talk on the history.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y
Posted by Bazz, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 12:01:22 PM
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Of the 12 terrorist attacks thwarted, he said 11 were being planned by young men who were radicalised in the spirit of this "Sunni Islamist extremist cult" and one was a a right-wing extremist who had nothing to do with Islam.
Posted by doog, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 1:20:50 PM
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Hi Doog,

Eleven out of twelve ain't bad. If there was a competition between Islamist, Buddhist, Hindu, Calluthumpian and Illuminati terrorists, it seems that the Islamists have it the bag. If there were such an event as the Fascist World Games, the Islamists would take out all the Gold Medals.

Hi Bazz,

News flash: they're already here. They can't be rounded up and deported. So IF there is a problem in the Muslim community over Islamo-fascism, then it easily, if indirectly, becomes our problem.

So we have to differentiate between:

* terrorists,

* would-be terrorists,

* extreme Muslims giving covert support to terrorists,

* 'moderate' Muslims who wouldn't, and

* 'Muslims' who are wavering in their faith.

I wouldn't know the proportion of each, of course, but I have enough cautious faith in human beings to hope that the great majority are in those two last categories. Time will tell.

Incidentally, I wonder if that Muslim Legal group advising any Muslims going overseas to strip their email, social media accounts, etc. of any reference to bomb-making, under-age 'marriage', etc. were more likely advising any supporters of terrorists, not just those going overseas, to get rid of any incriminating material, perhaps also their ISIS flags as well, but in not so many words.

Cheers,

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 1:36:10 PM
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Joe,
Yes, it would be easy if muslims had a bar code printed on their forehead and we could sort them out. Unfortunately that is not the case.

I read sometime back that 15-25% of muslims have extreme views, which is far too high for our citizens safety. That is why I think we should stop all muslim entry into Aus from now on. At least that will help stop the risk from growing too much. You see I think it is the new arrivals that continually refresh the extreme views. But I think it will take a terrorist nuke attack to make our polys aware of that, and put a stop to muslim entry.

Foxy,
Made me smile to see your post (on page 2) whereby you chastised another poster for putting forward false evidence to support his view.
Posted by Banjo, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 2:31:37 PM
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Hi Banjo,

I would have thought that there were millions of destitute non-Muslim refugees, in east and north Africa, and in the Middle East, without the ten thousand $$ to pay for air fares to Indonesia and to the smugglers, who have done all the right things to apply to come to Australia, and sat and waited, and waited, ..... and waited, and who could be warmly welcomed here.

Sure, that's hard on the great majority of innocent Muslims stuck in similar situations, but that may be a cross they have to bear for the time being.

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 2:42:46 PM
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Joe (and Banjo),

I think Sam Harris provides a useful list of categories by which to separate the differing beliefs within Islam by extremity http://youtu.be/vln9D81eO60?t=250 (try to ignore Ben Affleck carrying on like a pork chop).

A comprehensive collection of polls, taken around the world, with regards to the beliefs of Muslims on various topics, can be found at http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/articles/opinion-polls.aspx.
Posted by AJ Philips, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 3:38:08 PM
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Joe etal;
Overseas experience seems to indicate those who are not radical when
the Islamists get control and start to enforce sharia just go along
with it all.

We do have to finally stop resisting acknowledging that we are at war.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y
If we accept that then we can put everyone who is a risk into internment camps.
We can of course offer them repatriation to enemy countries.
They were normal practise as a fifth column risk was unacceptable.
They would be interned for the duration, even if it takes another
1400 years.

To declare war on Islamic State is quite a reasonable thing to do.
A state of war then operates in a simpler and more straightforward
set of rules. Problems like the police had with shooting Manos no
longer matter,
Any that are caught can be shot by firing squad because they are
fighting without uniform or paybook.
Thems' the rules so lets use them.
They want to play then lets go.
Posted by Bazz, Wednesday, 31 May 2017 6:01:47 PM
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If we're not at war then what are we. I've seen a lot of evidence from Islam members absolutely stating that they are, on the news, on youtube, facebook and other outlets.... but we just keep on lighting candles, although we dress our cops like swat teams these days.

A bomb threat foiled on a flight from Melbourne to Kuala Lumpar today..they're not saying terrorist but he is not white nor indigenous Australian and a lot of people appeared to be terrified, and it was going to a muslim country. A lot of coincidental stuff going on there. A bit like the Melbourne Bourke Street incident where the fact he was a muslim convert was massively played down.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/incidents/malaysia-airlines-flight-mh-128-returns-to-melbourne-after-incident-on-plane/news-story/8b6f36d08bf5f11567665235e0066ed1
Posted by moonshine, Thursday, 1 June 2017 9:51:59 AM
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Well yes Moonshine, I believe we are at war.
However the rules of war do not apply until the government declares it.
ISIS set up the machinery of government, Foreign Affairs, Defence,
Social Services, Treasury, Taxation the whole bit.
They claim their Caliphate is the official government.
Its Capital is in Raqqua.
So let us take them at their word and declare war on them.

What is wrong with that ? Nothing, it removes all confusion.
Posted by Bazz, Thursday, 1 June 2017 2:57:53 PM
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This week so far:

Islamo-fascist atrocities:

* Two bombings in Bagdad;

* Massive bomb in Kabul;

* Killings in northern Kenya;

amounting to about 120 random murders of innocent people.

Other terrorist atrocities: None. Innocent deaths: None.

Islamists: 120.
Other potential terrorist groups: Nil.

But the week's not over yet :(

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Thursday, 1 June 2017 5:36:46 PM
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More:
Ramadan in Afghanistan: 80 dead, 350 wounded in bombing, Afghans
suspect Pakistani government involvement

Pakistan: Village court orders rape victim to be killed or sold as
slave because of adultery charges

Philippines: Islamic State jihadis shooting people dead for failing to
quote the Qur’an

The next time I see it I will put up the German monthly list.
Posted by Bazz, Thursday, 1 June 2017 6:58:07 PM
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Did anyone watch that video link I put up a few posts back ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_Qpy0mXg8Y

I have found the history fascinating so much so I did some more reading
on wikipeadia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Europe

It is an era of history that we of British descent did not really hear
about probably because Britain was untouched by Islamic invasion except
for the raids by Moslem slave traders.
Until recently I was unaware that Islamic armies had invaded France
to such a large extent and even into Switzerland.

Anyway let me know your thoughts on this history.
Posted by Bazz, Friday, 2 June 2017 3:52:24 PM
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Hi Bazz,

The great historian Marc Bloch (tortured and murdered by the Nazis in 1944) described the incursions by Moorish invaders along the French/Italian Mediterranean coast in the eighth and ninth centuries, where they invaded right up into Switzerland from the south, forcing monasteries to flee and re-build further north. Not to mention the Moorish incursions from the West as well.

He writes (in 'Feudal Society', in 2 vols., absolutely brilliant books) about one monastery having to move eighteen times, mostly from the Moors/Saracens but also from the Vikings from the north - and the Huns and Magyars and Avars and Mongols from the east. It must have been a bastard of a time.

Cheers,

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Friday, 2 June 2017 4:02:03 PM
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Yes Joe, it was not a good time.
I think after the collapse of the Ottoman Empire in 1918 the Jihadists
decided that they could not conquer Europe by normal military means
and have switched to immigration.
I did read one glint of optimism in that in Germany 30% of moslems
are dropping their religion.
It will be interesting to see if they stop replenishing the moslem
population, the percentage of apostates increases.
Posted by Bazz, Friday, 2 June 2017 4:48:33 PM
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Hi Bazz,

Yes, live in hope :)

Cheers,

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Friday, 2 June 2017 6:55:40 PM
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Once again Deputy Prime Minister, Barnaby Joyce, has demonstrated his unsuitability for office by standing up for the gormless head of ASIO, Duncan Lewis.

At the same time, so did George Brandis and even Peter Dutton, show that they were also in the Lewis camp when it came to refugees and terrorism; but Joyce compounded his stupidity by saying:

“In every religion, you have a corner of evil people, a corner of ratbags who have taken it upon themselves to murder other people”.

Joyce of course didn't give any examples of Christians, Bhuddists, Hindus etc currently murdering other people in the name of their religion. That's because there are no such examples.

I would say that Joyce is that “ratbag” in a “corner”, and if we are relying on him, Lewis, Brandis and Dutton to carry out the most important and basic function of government – protecting Australia and Australians – then we are in big trouble!
Posted by ttbn, Sunday, 4 June 2017 9:45:06 AM
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Hmmm a chorus of "Now don't you worry all is well".
Sounds like phone calls from the prime minister.
Posted by Bazz, Sunday, 4 June 2017 10:18:35 AM
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Another terrorist attack in London.

That's the first for this week; wonder if the attackers were Muslim?

Anyone offering odds?
Posted by Is Mise, Sunday, 4 June 2017 12:05:57 PM
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Is Mise, what odds are you offering ?
Not many takers there.
I bet they wish they never let them in.

No one has an answer as to what can be done.
It seems to me that under the law we just have to stand and take it.
At some time there will be a widespread demand that "something" be done.
There is nothing that can be done without destroying our legal rights
and freedoms. We cannot declare a race or particular religious groups
non citizens without leaving ourselves open to repression by left
or right wing fascists.
We have already seen left wing attacks on freedom of speech.
Remember both communist and Nazi socialist left wingers have that in their history.

So what can we do ?
Who is "we" ? Any country that has been attacked or threatened.
My conclusion is that we have to accept that we are at war.
Granted it is a different type of war than what our laws have normally
accepted, but we must adapt to the changes or be overcome.
The only conclusion is to declare war on ISIL and Al Quiada and their affiliates.

Under a state of war people who are considered to be a risk can be
deported, their freedom restricted or to be interned indefinitely
for the duration. They can be repatriated to their national country.
If armed they can be shot on sight, all the rules of war apply.

This does seem to be the only path available.
I am sure the breeding hearts would have a fit at the very thought.
Posted by Bazz, Sunday, 4 June 2017 12:52:43 PM
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Ten to one, Is Mise, and you'll still be paying out :)

This bloke has a brilliant article:

https://outlook.live.com/owa/?path=/mail/AQMkADAwATE2ZTEwLWY3YzctZDE2OC0wMAItMDAKAC4AAAPwLFVHw9aDSaZNKzChV%2FZBAQBB2sPMAwi5Q7TYLUddFtDWAAACPAYAAAA%3D/rp

Then along comes that other HuT agent Anne Aly (so sue me) who, in the interests of buckling to terrorism, advises that people shouldn't mix in crowd, and where possible, people should walk in single file.

News flash, Anne: Kiss my hairy arse, I'll LOOK for crowds to mix with and laugh at your snotty little bomber. Of course, it may be the last thing I do :) But it'll be worth it - to quote the great Jamaican poet, Claude McKay:

If we must die—let it not be like hogs
Hunted and penned in an inglorious spot,
While round us bark the mad and hungry dogs,
Making their mock at our accursed lot.
If we must die — oh, let us nobly die,
So that our precious blood may not be shed
In vain; then even the monsters we defy
Shall be constrained to honor us though dead!
Oh, Kinsmen! We must meet the common foe;
Though far outnumbered, let us show us brave,
And for their thousand blows deal one deathblow!
What though before us lies the open grave?
Like men we’ll face the murderous, cowardly pack,
Pressed to the wall, dying, but fighting back!

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Sunday, 4 June 2017 4:18:31 PM
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Joe: If we must die—let it not be like hogs

Wow! Joe, That Poem is just the best & says it all. Wow!

Bazz: I bet they wish they never let them in.

It won't be long & those who support them now will be wishing they never let them in. It's all on their heads.

How long before it happens in Australia like it's happening in the EU & UK. Not long now, I bet.

Where are our usual sculkers? Hiding? Not coming into this Conversation? I wonder why?
Posted by Jayb, Sunday, 4 June 2017 7:20:02 PM
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Yeah, I meant "Ten one on, Is Mise .... "

And you'd still lose your money :)
Posted by Loudmouth, Sunday, 4 June 2017 7:55:16 PM
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