I heard a discussion on homelessness, and how the problem was much larger and more intractable then first thought. It's police who first encounter those who are obviously indigent, and it's the police who generally intercede whenever trouble ensures.

Years ago, there was little evidence of youth homelessness, though adult vagrancy has always existed and has generally been tolerated. Why then has there been such an escalation of youths living rough ?

Many former colleagues have suggested, in the last twenty five, thirty years, there's been a move by many of our social designers to petition educators to tutor, or at least acquaint young people of their 'rights' both socially, the law and even education. Ergo many teachers took it upon themselves to thoroughly educate their pupils as to what legal limitations where placed upon their parents, society, and the police.

Corporal punishment has all but vanished. Therefore many parents are bemused as to how and by what means, they should correct, regulate and place limitations on their children's behaviour, both in the home and in society.

In days one by, youth found domiciled on the street, or out very late at night, without a legitimate reason, the copper would have him/her in the back of the truck and home to the parents. My understanding today, coppers dare not even enquire of the kid, as to their bona fides, whenever they're found loitering or skulking around, or dwelling in or near a public street or place, unless a crime has occurred nearby ?

So inadequate things are today, coppers have a ( sad)little mnemonic, 'FIDO' which amounts to...unless the kids are involved in 'murder rape or mayhem', simply go the other way ? Certainly NOT what the public expects from their police in terms of law and order is it ?

Youth ALL Youths 'unequivocally' know and understand their legal RIGHTS in terms of what police can do or not do - personally I reckon we've regressed too far in terms of our children's 'rights' ? Their rights, do come with some accompanying responsibilities too !

Hi o sung wu, yes I think you are right there. When I was a kid, if you were out too late, or mucked up around town you got a cops No9 up the tail, & got dragged home by the ear for a real walloping. It appears today most parents would want the cops blood, not discipline the kid.

I have a nephew, about 28 now who absorbed all this stuff like a sponge. He used to taunt his father that he couldn't do anything to discipline him, or he'd get child welfare onto him. I think it was the strife this caused that broke the mirage.

He at least was smart enough to get jobs in resorts & in the snow fields where accommodation was supplied. Funnily enough, he is now working up the mines, & his wife, from Canada, & daughter stay with his mother when he's away, as his wife can't handle being alone.

Yes when ever our dogooders get involved with anything, the consequences they did not see coming are usually disastrous. Usually others warn them, but they refuse to see, & then refuse to admit the result when it happens.

This lack of youth discipline, boat people, & the disaster of the poor bush aboriginals are just the most obvious.

If your in Sydney, and want to take an interest in homeless kids, her is a link that might help you.

http://www.youthoffthestreets.com.au/

I know, on OLO I bang on about the Church, but in the case of Fr Chris Riley I certainly make an exception.

Any given night there are 47,000 kids on the streets. So the coppers would certainly kept busy taking them "home" where ever that is.

o sung wu wrote:

"Corporal punishment has all but vanished. Therefore many parents are bemused as to how and by what means, they should correct, regulate and place limitations on their children's behaviour, both in the home and in society."

The above sounds odd. Do you mean to say that corporal punishment is the only means by which parents can think of to correct, regulate and place limitations on their children's behaviour?

Deprivation of privileges, talking, making a child understand why its behaviour is unacceptable are some of the many ways parents can discipline without using corporal punishment.

John Betjeman had a humorous bit:

The Velvet Hand

I call that parent rash and wild
Who’d reason with a six-year child,
Believing little twigs are bent
By calm, considered argument.

In bandying words with progeny
There’s no percentage I can see,
And people who, imprudent, do so,
Will wonder how their troubles grew so.

Now underneath this tranquil roof
Where sounder theories have their proof,
Our life is sweet, our infants happy.
In quietude dwell Mammy and Pappy.

We’ve sworn a stern parental vow
That argument we won’t allow.
Brooking no juvenile excess here,
We say a simple No or Yes, here.

And then, when childish wails begin
We don’t debate.
We just give in.

<<Deprivation of privileges, talking, making a child understand why its behaviour is unacceptable are some of the many ways parents can discipline without using corporal punishment.>>

David I would agree with that in a "functional family" environment, where there is love and understanding, where parents show kindness and do take an interest in their children, I would agree with you. Many of these kids come from a "dysfunctional family" and for some I use the word family rather loosely. I'm not one for corporal punishment at the best of times. Many of the parents we are talking about don't give a rats about their kids.

They make homelessness sound like it is the fault of society ? Come to think of it, it is but only the fault of one sector of our society, the Left ! They have pushed & pushed & are still pushing for more & more leniency towards misbehaving youth.
let those do-gooders sort it out & pay for it. leave us out of it !

ITS AN IMPORTANT TOPIC/BUT MESSY
damm caps

police rightfully cant even talk to anyone/without a lawfull reASON
IE A CPMPLAIN FROM THE PUBLIC/or possability of danger/BUT COPS SEE DANGER IN EVERYTHING.;CONVENIENTLY SO.

THEY ARE PLAYING STINKING GAMES/of revenue raising\
but we talked of all that before/i regard the police /as policing revenue raising policy/and as protection for the elite scum asset stripping us blind while sending coppers in to bust kids.

they qare the might that seperates/the law abiding and exploited/from seeking vengence upon their faceless oppresors/who fight via moralisation of law

no im not seing the goo this ilitaristion of police ervice has achievED[AND THEIR BLACK UNIFORM goes well with thewir black hearts[if they got one]i see a lot of frightende girly gurlies with guns stunners and inflated opinions of themselves

as you know
homelesness is as simple as a copper giving a kid a warm safe place to sleep[most homes are hell holes they escaped from]..but its not use telling that you a mate

so Like many i cant posT
TRUTH AND HAVE NO ENERGY FOR THE LIES/
IF POLICE GOT REAL/THEY WOULD ARREST TRUE EVIL CRIMINALS[THE ONES PASING THE KEEP BUSY REvENUE RAISING BY NEW LAWS/ANYTIME YA SEE A COPPER YA KNOW THEY JUST LOOKING VTO GET YA IN HANDCUFFS/OUT OF VIDIO VIEUW/..OR THE TAPE GOT LOST AT DPP.[[OH SO CONVENIENTLY/TOO MANY TIMES.]

ITS A RIgged game/wherE
THEY WATCHYOU AS YOU POST
DELETE GREATCHUNKS/JUST CAUSE THEY CAN

WE ARE OVER SURVEILED/face book is intel op
gogle is intel op/so much is security agencie intel gthering
who yu talk to/what you say//

dont we have any rights?
plenty but the kiddy fiddlers running the just us system
do their moralistions very proffitably for the inbred elite lobby

lots of coppers in heaven/but far too many chose hell

interupted post

Afternoon all

It's a generational thing HASBEEN, but I totally agree with your comments. Why do our academic brethren tend to get it all so wrong ? They're educated, schooled in the discipline they've embraced, but when it comes to social matters, they tend to drift to the left why ? People who work the streets, they generally have a sound appreciation of many of the 'why's with street kids. Yet from experience, most academic strategists take little or no heed as to what these street workers thoughts or recommendations are ?

Hi there PAUL 1405 - you seem to have an inordinately good knowledge of many of the issues confronting homeless youth ? Have your ever worked either voluntarily or professionally in that field by chance ?Also, I note you're not in favour of corporal punishment ? What about a contemporaneous (hand) slap across the backside, of a child who's being exceptionally rude or defiant ? Many thanks for that most interesting link you so kindly sent us all too.

Thank you too DAVIDF for your contribution and your delightful piece of prose. I see you prefer to discipline kids by vocal remonstration and withdrawing their liberty, concessions and privileges, when kids are set on misbehaving, rather than resorting to a quick 'smack across the behind ?

Hi there INDIVIDUAL - Regrettably, whether it's the fault of the 'Left or the Right' of society, it impacts equally unfavourably upon us all, none are immune from street crime or anti-social behaviour, or the wretched social spectacle of youth homelessness ? And I don't see it as a role for police to move kids on, who're 'dirtying-up' the streets or public places, merely by their presence.

Hi ONE UNDER GOD - Johan, I couldn't agree with you more, when you say police should NOT be used to either gather revenue, or become societies 'broom' to sweep away all our social problems like youth homelessness ! Principally, the role of police, is to keep the Queens peace. Not as a surrogate raiser of revenue, as they're often used today ?

Dear o sung wu,

I have three children. The first two were boys. When they misbehaved I would give them a swat across the bottom. Then we had a little girl. When she was 3 she ran out on the street without any clothes on, and a car screeched to a stop a few feet from her. I grabbed her and brought her back in the house. Since she was dressed for a spanking I put her across my knee. There was no way I could lay a hand in anger on that little bottom. To be fair I never swatted the boys again either. They have grown up into well-behaved adults with each having two children of their own. Corporal punishment was apparently unnecessary. I can't imagine them being better than they are. As far as I know they have not found corporal punishment necessary with their children.

o sung wu,
Primarily the problem of youth homelessness stems from the availability of Centerlink funding for kids who decide to leave home for either real or perceived reasons.
Remember the huge public discussion that took place when the concept of parental divorce hit the media.
Strip away the truancy laws, which helped to keep the kids at school, remove the ethical preclusions of exposure to moral danger and carnal knowledge, which basically now says underage sex is the norm and not the exception, then add in the current ‘divine right of protest’ without responsibility and then, spice the whole recipe with such abstracts as political correctness and privacy claptrap, access to free legal wizardry and social conciliation and finally finish the package with inclusive social empathy and collective clemency and you have the complete platform for youth disaster

from a "dysfunctional family"
Paul1405,
I'd not be so quick to lay the blame on parents. Why do families become dysfunctional in the first place ? My guess is 95% is due to financial stress & that in turn comes from incompetent authorities. Also, the mentality that everyone owes you a living is so prevalent now & that in turn doesn't come from dysfunctional families, it's a product of dysfunctional education. The same education also gave us the dysfunctional society we are now but let's just blame the parents, it's easier than for incompetent & useless Leftie bureau rats to admit their failure in their responsibilities to those who feed them.

corperal punshment/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporal_punishment_in_the_home
http://www.google.com.au/search?q=corporal+punishment+australia&

im not into it[AND AM WARY SUPPORTING IT]
HOW HARD/is hard enough[the first people beLIEVED HAT BELTING THEM ONLY DRIVES THE PROMBLEM;DEEPER

damm caps

i would see the force BECOME YET AGAIN A SERVICE
LIKE if a vehicle is danger then a police man/can issue an order for rePar of rePLACEMENT/with the cost of a service alOne/being owed/THAT a police man or woMAN can order a hotel or hsTEL-bed/for the H homeleSS

i go further the police can pick the punnnishment
hold a trial there and then
and its recorded as the judgmenT[of course court revieuws all of it/.but by testing thE FACTS are sure and the cure fair.

police mst be like 'sherrifs'[each haS their oWN BEAT
THEIR own turf/to kep safe[not just safe/but to reprt all damages/vandaLISM/BE the eyes looking for public safety[if that roof looks unsafe/he can look or ask it be inspected and maDE SAFE

there is also the issue of best use

but the more i wriTE THE MORE GUILTY I FEEL BY Avoiding editing the damm THING

it is as it is[i can fix homelessness/witH easy enrty aces by facIAL RECOGNITION/not MUCH bigger than a bed a toilet a SHOWERS/WASHING FACILITIES/beDDING ..[built into comunities//along pathways/arround the edges of parks..etc

IINVENTED THE WIKISEED/WIKIGELD UNDER THE SUN TREATY
the basic idea with that was each kid gets a credit card/on a phone/
and 3 times a day 5 dollars is supled for meal/drink[a merket WILL CATER /TO THIS STEADY INCOME STREAM/plus a bed for the night[at 5 dollars the safe BED]CHAMBER\]/THERE ARE PLENTY OF PROJECTS NEEDING YOUTH ENERGY/BUT mate here is a clue/i attended two rainbow GATHERINGS/thatS A THING YOU MUST DO ONCE

basiclly the RAINBOW TRIBES AND AQUARIOUS PEOPLE hEAD BUSH
and juST TEACH EDUCATE PARTY AND SHARE/its ALL paid for by majic hat
that goes arround after the meals [3 times a day]...ITs like heaven/it really is.

because/you..can see
http://home.alphalink.com.au/~radnat/anstey%27s%20kingdom%20of%20shylock.html

In days of old.the feudal baronage..sallied forth;AT-WIL.. with sword and spear..to levy toll upon terrorised producers...>>

now blackwater-revenue~RAISERS-STEAL;THE WORKER WAGES

<<robber-barons>>were masters of highways..and waterways,.and in the name of their over-lordship..brutes//using;fear..exacted tribute from the toiling people...They were.the self-evident personification of tyranny.

To rise against them,..destroy them,.escape their vassalage,..was to leave an open road..empty/along...which the products..of free men could pass untolled.>>

now/we tax/THE cAPTIVE-BUSINESS/
GOODS-SERvices-tax[wages as\if income]

we/the\DIS-Organised resentment..GET DECIEVED;BY A NEW-FACE

SAME*old-dis-GRACE..and/FEARS/forelorN-HOPE
ENDs..in trenCHES-FILLED.BY..new-DEAD~kids/bloody victorys..were the sole essentials..for the spontaneous development of..war-industry\war reparations[LOOTING]..in its primitive forms.
..has now become..privatization/

But the days of\primitive industry/and primitive*Radicalism are passing...[LOL][WRITTEn/1 CENTURY-AGO]..

Under the freest political institutions/exist financial oligarchies more rapacious\than the old-time baronies...They bleed,..not with sword nor spear,..but by subtle processes that leave a people impoverished,..they know not how or why.>>

cause/they..'create'..money[in*ANY/AMMOUNT]
GETTING/US-TO..WORK..for fee.

The mechanism of robbery is..[complex and impersonalREAD/SYSTEMISED]...

<<..The operators are out of sight...The public only know them>>
by/name-reputation[READ/PRESS-COB=VERAGE]..as benignant gentry distributing tracts oF charity/by the wayside.

EDITED

We see States and Nation..governed by the machinery of past centuries...[WITH/THE..same~names/..<<We have seen a Labor Government in N.S.W. upholding the absurdity of an Upper Chamber to nullify its own proceedings.]1917]..We have seen Governments of working men upholding.as rigidly as t..he most rabid Tories all the procedures, formalities,..Luminarie...and ceremonies..of obsolete forms of colisation->>

[invader/convict-government.

<<In the midst of a flood tide of economic and scientific pro­gression the legislative and administrative methods of Governments stand petrified in the chamber of dead ages.

edited/<<True freedom consists in a state of mind as well as exterior surroundings. The mind must expand as well as the machinery of production...There is mental slavery as well as physical, and slavery is not abolished because men vote for their own enslavement, contented to be well fed. The Labor policy must be radical in fact as in name. It must go to the root of things or it goes nowhere.

EDITED/<<No skin-plaster legislation, no mere policy of alleviation, will meet the position. Revolution in action and method is the one saving instrumentality, the sole alternative to a long grind­ing period of absolute slavery...[the/living-repaying..DEAD-[FIAT]..DEBT/with their life-blood/sweat[via sin-taxes]

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/enron-2-0-wall-street-wants-manipulate-state-energy-markets-just-like-manipulates-every-market.html

Good afternoon all...

It's indeed a bit unfair of CHRISGAFF1000 ! He managed to get the 'inside track', so to speak ? That is he'd obviously been exposed to the same old 'blurb' as was I, when we're both in the job !

Whereas, never a group to allow a prospect of favourable notoriety slip by, many of our enlightened social guardians determined that it was now time we unshackle our youth, both behaviourally and socially, in order they might better express themselves, in the home, in school and vocationally, then they'd done previously ? So, instead of maintaining normal parental supervision, that little duty shifted quietly across to police, to now act as surrogate parents ?

The concept of a youth being legally permitted to divorce his or her parents (as CHRISGAFF1000 has correctly asserted), is more than likely what's precipitated the burgeoning youth problem we see today. Any parent who lawfully exercises normal parental control over his offspring, can have that responsibility usurped by the youths themselves, by merely failing to acquiesce or concede to any of those controls.

Another favourite reason for divorcing the 'olds', was to lay the blame (wholly) on the 'old man' for daring to place some limits on the domestic behaviour of his adolescent progeny. By (attempting) to regulate their social activities, their language, schoolwork, and their behaviour at home etc. Any or all of these were sufficient triggers for an adolescent to simply walk out and leave.

And by so doing, there now existed a serious vacuum in the young persons lives, where there was nobody responsible for exercising any degree of normal day to day parental supervision.

Thereupon, our learned social demographers could see a serious flaw in their planning, and that would never do ? So they set to work and soon had collaboratively resolved to release our modern mums and dads from their onerous burden of parenting, and in so doing, provisionally nominated police as uncomplaining substitutes ? When you think of it, it's all worked out rather splendidly eh ?

Hi there ONE UNDER GOD...

Johan, you said in one of your threads that it's not hard for a copper to give a homeless youth a warm bed and hot meal and/or drink; or similar words ?

In the city Johan, it's almost impossible if not impractical for a uniform bloke to extend such humanity to a homeless person, short of a few bob for a coffee, a hamburger, a cigarette or similar.

However, a young person who has been identified, as being exposed to personal or moral danger, like a prepubescent young person for example, you can place them in custody for their own protection, and either take them home, or if inappropriate, place them in an pertinent and relevant young persons shelter.

In country areas the local coppers can sometimes do a little more for itinerant people ? It all comes down to available resources, how busy the shift is, number of members on duty, available cars etc.

Also Johan, you said in one of your earlier threads that you'd like to see the word 'force' removed from the police nomenclature, and substituted with the word 'service' ? Well I believe that's been tried in several States with mixed results ? I heard from a mate in Victoria Police, they're changing their uniforms altogether, giving them a darker, almost black colour and a more authoritarian look about them. Accordingly, the Premier and Commissioner down there, want their police to be more respected, but also feared by the hoodlums ?

My humble opinion Johan, it's not the uniform, it's the man in the uniform that should be respected, all very idealistic, I realize ?

o;quote..<<..I heard from a mate..in Victoria Police,>>

MY FIRSt friend/is now a cop
i TRIED CONTACT/VIA..facebook\but guess hes read my sheet

<<..they're changing their uniforms altogether, g..iving them a darker,..almost black colour and a more authoritarian look about them.>>

YES BLACK IS TO SYBOLIZE SATURN[SATAN]/THE GOd of death[bUT SYMBOLOGY MEANS NUTHING..RIGHT?

LIKE WHats the idea of them marijuana leaves arropund the police shields?[ITS EVEN THE RIGHT TYPE of green]

but mate therE IS A MILIarisation/of the police seRVICE]
MORE ;ROLE PLAYING AND COPPERS SETTING UP THE PLAYS; THEY HAVE TRAINED.FOR

ITS A FORM OF BRAIN WAShing
but mate the big concern S THE THUGS THAT WERE FORMER solgers
they are two very diferent forces/providing very diferent service[LIKE I HAVE SEEM CROP SITTERS WATching the cia renditioned opiniom poppies[and well know the balack guards of black water

mate sYMBOLOGY IS IMPORTANT
AND A COPPER WITHOUT HIS NUMBER EXPOSED BECOMES A THUG

and as for hirING A COPPER HOW INSANE
HEY MATE GOT A JOB FOR YA..SAD MATE
<<..Commissioner down there,..want their police ..to be more respected,..but also feared by the hoodlums..?>>

YOU MUST BE AWARE THAts how bank-thieves AND RAPISTS FEEL
THEY WANT THE FEAR
BUT WANT THE RESPECT?

its insane
the uniform sybolizes the sTATE/THREAT/FORCE;REVENUE

<<..it's the man in the uniform that should be respected,>>

YES BECAUSE THE BLACK SUIT REAPS ITS ill fruits
pOLITITIONS IN BLACKL SEVING THE DARK FORCES
GOD FORBID COLOUR/that wakes folks up

ans waking up angry cops/is what i do

<<..all very idealistic,..I realize>>
YEAH/ME-TOO..but mate the big difference/;YOU WORE CALMING BLUE*

NOT THE SAME COLOURS THE NIGHT TIME CRIMINALS DO

Dear O Sung Wu,

The reasons for youth homelessness are many, varied,
and complex, stemming from family conflicts, economic
hardships, alcohol, drug and sexual abuse in the home,
pregnancies, sexual orientation, mental illness,
and neglect. There's the kids who are released from
juvenile correctional facilities who become homeless
because they lack support systems, opportunities for work,
and housing. A high percentage in shelters often come
directly from foster care, and so on.

The relationship between homeless youth and the police
appears somewhat uneven. In some places it's a source
of conflict and antagonism, while in other places there
are programs to improve policing on the streets - and
many of these programs are working.

One thing is certain - the situation of homeless young
people is ripe for escalation and conflict. If
homelessness continues then the chances of legal
complications will increase - raising a concern about the
inadequate support for young people in these
situations.

One thing I want to mention is the excellent work done
by the Saint Vincent de Paul Society, and of course the
Salvation Army. What is extraordinary is the range of
services offered by these organisations and the total
number of people annually assisted by these organisations
runs into millions. They represent humanity at its best!

Hello there FOXY...

Very nice to hear from you. Might I ask if it's still, all systems go for the 26th of this month ? Somewhere around there ? In any event, my thoughts are with you FOXY.

Everything you say is correct particularly with the services offered to homeless youth, as well as other homeless men and women, by 'St Vinnies' and the Salvo's.

Unfortunately, the relationship between police and most homeless people is relatively poor. In Sydney, the parks and other haunts often occupied by these people are invariable patrolled by police in 'caged vehicles' (F150 Fords). And in so doing the mere presence of a uniformed copper, seen slowly cruising around these areas, sends completely the wrong message to these people. They tend to view both the coppers and their vehicle similar to that of a shepherd rounding-up sheep, in this instance, mustering (innocent) homeless people, for the purpose of arresting them ?

Interestingly, some of the older intractable vagrants, prefer to be arrested, particularly around Christmas time and in mid-winter. They are confined to Long Bay for a month or two, whereupon they're well fed, bathed and clothed, all in readiness to once more enter their noir world of itinerancy and perpetual vagrancy. This group are quite dissimilar to that of homeless youth, and most wouldn't trade their lifestyles for quids.

As I see it FOXY, the problem with youth homelessness will become much worse. I see evidence of young people loitering around these large Shopping Malls, with the intent of making a nuisance of themselves. Until either security moves them on or the police are called. And in so doing the police are perceived as 'the enemy'. Rather than as a potential source of possible assistance ? Will this perception ever change ? Sadly, I think not.

Take good care of yourself please FOXY !

Dear O Sung Wu,

Thank You for your concern and yes my procedure is
still on (Monday 21st July). I've had all of my blood
tests and the CT Scan of my heart chambers, so fingers
crossed that this time it will be a success.
Anyway, I'm feeling very positive.

As for homeless youth? Yes, the problems won't go
away anytime soon but there's also hope -
because - there are so many other organisations
that also do a great job apart from the two I mentioned
earlier. In the heart of Melbourne's St Kilda, parts of
which are a "red light" district, the Sacred Heart
Mission provides 300 to 400 people with a three-course
lunch every day. The work is largely done by volunteers from
all faiths (and none), with a small number of paid staff.
Among them are people assigned by the courts to perform
community service orders, some of whom return to continue
the work after their sentences expire.

Father Chris Riley, as you know founded and developed
Youth Off the Streets (YOTS) in Sydney. His organisation
is non-sectarian and open to all comers. Father Riley has
almost 150 staff and over 800 volunteers.

"Have your ever worked either voluntarily" yes O Sung Wu I have had a bit. What Foxy said about YOTS is spot on, do a fantastic job, but its a help not a cure for kids on the streets. I don't know how some kids make it to be teenagers, given they never had a "home" life.
Indi, in Sydney you meet people who are dysfunctional with lots of issues, as you do in any disadvantaged community, they lack education and motivation, their lives are in crises mode constantly, they continually make bad decisions, bad choices, their life skills are non existent. they have little in the way of material or mental resources. These people can't look after themselves little own look after a child. I often put it this way," Its like standing on a railway track with a train bearing down at you at 100mph, a normal person would get out of its way, but some people just stand there and let it happen." They just can't make the right decision, well so it often seems. Then you'll meet someone with a kid,a young girl, although not perfect by any stretch, really is trying to make a go of it, but 2 steps forward 1 step back.
Drugs, crime, homelessness are the end results of this life of theirs. Put simply homelessness doesn't make you dysfunctional, dysfunctionalality makes you homeless.
None of this is a job for the police. Law enforcement is their game, social issues are not what they are on about, or should be on about. But often the police are the only ones there in a crises situation, they are forced to act, no choice.

A friend of mine is a youth counsellor in Sydney, does it a couple of nights a week, done it for years. He is tough, you don't get too many chances with him, you constantly stuff up and your off the program. He tells me he can't afford to be soft, gets you nowhere. When he talks with a kid he really lays it on the line. Gets a set pattern going on how he will approach the problem, and once that pattern has been set he don't deviate. Gets results, sometimes, short term, long term, sometimes never.

Dear Paul,

Your friend sound like a very capable person.
I imagine despite his "toughness" he's also
compassionate and fair

Paul,

<<A friend of mine is a youth counsellor in Sydney, does it a couple of nights a week, done it for years. He is tough, you don't get too many chances with him, you constantly stuff up and your off the program. He tells me he can't afford to be soft, gets you nowhere>>

Soooooooooo Paul, you do have some conservative friends, ay!

I mean, your friend acts and thinks like a typical conservative (he’s probably even a closet member of the LNP) …after all, if he was a Lefty-Greenie his MO would be : you can stuff –up 10,000 times and keep coming back for more tax-payer –funded --Christine Milne hyped handouts.

Hi PAUL1405...

Something you did say resonated with me, and was quite valid I thought - the analogy of the approaching train ? To me, it's as though some young people have this 'self destructive' mechanism within them. It's little wonder there are some many younger folk suiciding ? Hopelessness, abandonment, loneliness, drug addition, no prospects etc.

People of my generation (I'm in my mid seventies) often say, '...if the youth of today had to confront the hardships we had to face...' ? Well in my opinion, I believe it's much tougher for young people of today to successfully embrace daily life, than we did of my generation ! Sure my family were dirt poor, but we managed ?

However many of todays young people have to face a monumental barrage of daily confusion ? Many don't have role models; dysfunctional or single parent families; burgeoning crimes of violence; a culture of weapon possession and carriage; abandonment of school discipline; poor career prospects; ridiculously easy access to alcohol and drugs; and so the list goes on ! It's little wonder some just give up and either become feral, or sadly end their confused lives.

A hell of an indictment of our society. As you quite rightly state PAUL1405, it's most definitely NOT the role of law enforcement to regulate, control, or care for these 'lost' young people ? Often though, it's police who by necessity have to pick up the pieces.

o sung wu,
What happens when your role model turns out to be gay like Ian Thorpe.
All those wasted years trying to be just like him and bingo thorpedoed.

G'day CHRISGAFF1000...You're a bit of a pessimist I think Chris ?

Your earlier days in the job (early seventies), did you ever work the infamous '4 Wheels' (police habeas) ? Carting our hapless clients from boob to the Courts, and in the afternoon, back to boob again ? If so, you'd probably remember the functions of 7 wing, at the Bay ? The place was packed solid with thorpedoes. How times have changed ? These days, you can't even speak ill of them, less you run the risk of ending up in court !

Apropos role models...You identify and then select the 'role model' that most closely corresponds with your own aspirations, if at all possible. The trouble being, good role models are few and far between. So if it's competitive swimming that 'floats your boat', then the thorpedoe might be the only viable option available ? If swimming is your goal, then all you need do, is concentrate exclusively on swimming and not be involuntarily manipulated into exploring, more nefarious or other egregious pursuits ?

Should we continue to ignore many of the issues associated with rebellious and defiant youth, society may well pay dearly. They gather in packs around the larger suburban Shopping Malls, where many of the shoppers feel intimidated. Therefore it's only a matter of time before some of these young miscreants erupt ?

"Soooooooooo Paul, you do have some conservative friends, ay!" Yes SPUD, I do indeed, even a couple of Liberal Party members who I am friendly with. But I don't have any from your party. My mate, wrong he's a rusted on Labor voter, so his politics seem to indicate. But you never know in the secrecy of the polling booth, you never know. There could be you SPUD, potting a great big NUMBER ONE, right next to the name BOB BROWN, THE GREENS, we'll never know. I could vote for The Socialists Workers Party, but don't get too excited.

o sung wu,
Fortunately I missed the 'transport' brigade but I do remember '7 wing'.
When I was in "Fraud", remembering that "kite fliers" made up half the courts work,now its not even a crime, we had a callout to '7 wing'
We actually went in to the place through the woman's prison and the wing was apart of their gaol but walled off.
It seems that the government of the day were having drivers licenses and vehicle registrations printed and processed right through to the mail out there in a workshop attached to 'wing seven'
I housed the overtly gay and protected prisoners and apparently they had a pretty good lifestyle.
Anyway the temptation was too much I suppose and they started printing licenses and registrations to order.
A bogie taxi license cost a couple of hundred quid and a new rego for a stolen car around the same.
The racket went on for years until it came unstuck and we got the brief.
A couple of guards got locked up and the workshop shut down and they were all moved to Cooma

Yes CHRISGAFF1000... 7 wing infamously housed the 'cattery'. All of whom were on protection as you say. Times have changed appreciably, and so must I. No longer is the term 'non-associate' applied to those who previously would've tenanted 7 wing, as it's no longer a crime. The crime now, if anyone was injudicious enough to publically voice a derogatory remark concerning their sexual proclivities, they'd hit you with a writ of such proportion, you'd be lucky to retain your shirt.

Mate, it's for this reason that I no longer understand this enlightened culture, in which I scarcely exist ? What was once wrong, is now right - albeit a physiological abomination and to some, including myself, a complete anathema !

Dear chrisgaff1000,

You wrote, "What happens when your role model turns out to be gay like Ian Thorpe. All those wasted years trying to be just like him and bingo thorpedoed."

Thorpe's fame is due to his swimming - not his sexuality. It is reasonable that one can try to set Thorpe up as a role model in excelling in swimming or in other ways one finds Thorpe admirable. Regardless of sexuality one can still be a role model. There are women I greatly admire. Mary Ann Evans (aka George Eliot) is one of them. She is a great role model to me in her independence of mind. However, my admiration for her does not mean that I want to be a woman.

Your admiration of Thorpe is not wasted unless you admired him for being heterosexual.

It's a complicated problem with many and varied causes, usually a combination of several.
Most of them stem from some simple errors, the main one being the current ideology that children are just small adults, and should be treated as such. Strangely, we don't accept that in the area of sex, but hold it as true in other areas.
Then we have the "modern" approach of education by entertainment, which while it can and does work well with some kids, fails miserably as a general approach.
Add to that the wholesale rejection of discipline of any kind, replacing it with an emphasis on "rights", it's a guaranteed recipe for disaster, a disaster we are now living with.
The final straw, as I see it, is the Ïndustrialisation"of parenting, the use of childcare, which prevents real bonding between parents and kids, and leads to young adults with little empathy for others or any concept of family or long-term awareness/planning.
All of these are a side-effect of modern consumerism and it's concentration on instant gratification, and the associated growth in the use of credit.
Unfortunately I personally have no answers, I suspect we and our grandkids are just going to live with this until society inevitably implodes, which it will.

Good evening to you G'DAYBRUCE...

You are indeed quite perspicacious when it comes to identifying most of the origins, and resultant failures of many of today's homeless youth. As some have stated herein, most of these young people will not accept even a scintilla of personal discipline, or try to adopt any of the acceptable social mores demanded by the community at large. Preferring instead to overtly exhibit almost an insurrectionist profile towards both the public and police equally.

It was your last sentence that really astonished me; when you said, inter alia '...I personally have no answers, I suspect we and our grandkids are just going to live with this until society inevitably implodes, which it will...' ? What a miserable, depressive prediction for the future, both for our country and our community, unhappily I believe you're right G'DAYBRUCE, sadly ?

Thank you for your insightful contribution, I appreciate it.

O..ol mate..alex was talking arroUND THE ONE HOUR..27 minute mark
http://rss.infowars.com/20140718_Fri_Alex.mp3

and i thought thats right; the thing is criminals
visualize..their crime..but a 'detective'..needs envision
so many more imaginary-ones..just to solve the real..'one'..and spiritualy that has a cost.

unrelated/a flash-back

is this..a spade..or shovel/job?

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=15786#273211

i..replied it here

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=6122&page=0

what have the servants of satan/done while we sleep?
http://home.alphalink.com.au/~radnat/anstey%27s%20kingdom%20of%20shylock.html

or better how can police police the lawbreaker/directing themto police policy...[read revenue raising keep busy-work]

LIE UPON..LIE UPON..LIE
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2013/11/28/israels-threat-to-us-all-becomes-obvious/

security..for corporations
http://rinf.com/alt-news/breaking-news/the-war-on-democracy/

http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/2013/12/01/never-again-means-just-that/

what laws..do settlers..
in dark/places..live under?

talmudc law?

http://www.biblestudysite.com/factsarefacts.htm
quotations;..from the Soncino Edition
of the Talmud,(Book]

SANHEDRIN,..55b-55a:.."What is meant by this?...

Rab said:..Pederasty with a child
below nine years of age..is not deemed
as pederasty..with a child above that.

(footnotes)"..The reference is to..
the passive..'subject'/..*victim..of sodomy

UNDER NINE

do you get that joe?
now lets go younger

[is/this..what the settlers are doing in the deserts

YEBAMOTH,60b..*...Rabbi.Ramanos who conducted an/inquiry..and..'found'..in it

the daughter of a..'proselyte'..
who was under..the age of three years[and one day]...,

and Rabbi declared her/eligible*
to live with a priest."

(footnotes)"..A proselyte..under the age of three years
and one day may...be married by a priest...

*And was married..to a priest.

(i.e.,permitted to continue/to live with her'husband'."]

(Book)

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp%3Fdiscussion%3D3071%26page%3D0&sa=U&ei=Mk6eUp36Ks2ZlQWzn4D4DA&ved=0CBgQFjAJ

Child sacrifice

http://rt.com/news/173976-mh17-crash-questions-ukraine/

Hi there ONE UNDER GOD...

In the last part of your thread, you allege a Rabbi had given his assent for a little girl of three years and one day of age to cohabit with a priest ? Further this Rabbi also gave this priest permission, to marry this small (female) child, and in fact they did so ?

Johan, have I got this right ? If it is, as you've accurately and correctly represented, both the Rabbi and this 'priest' should be locked up forever and the key thrown away ! What possible advantage could anyone have with a tiny little, three year old girl ? Other than some sort of bizarre de facto parental relationship ? But marriage, never !

ITS FROM THe TALMUD[a holy texts in the holy lands]
thus many practice..that law in the dark places..
just as the muslims the jews have their secrets.
thats why they make statutes/to police
so the others get left alone..

homelessness is easy solved
but not everyone deservs a full ;home'
every story has two sides[kids are used even today to clear debt
FORCED TO WORK/..MAKING SAY BRICKS TILL THE DAY THEY DIE]..bEEN IN THE OLD DAYS KIDS WERE SENT TO SERVE THE PAY-earner's jail time]im even sure that there are people ..in jail being payed to seve time
but it all seems so much like gossip

Dear oug,

You are not quoting from any edition of the Talmud. You are quoting from an antisemitic website which has made up quotes. Go to a library which actually has a translation of the Talmud, and I am sure you will not find anything such as you have cited.

dafkid;quote..<<.Dear oug,..You are not quoting from any edition of the Talmud.>>

prove it
[see the clever thing is evil people hide their secret books]

<<..You are quoting from an antisemitic website>>

and its what their saying[and your not refuting]

<<..which has made up quotes. Go to a library which actually has a translation of the Talmud,>>

give me a web site narc

<<..and I am sure..>>

yes of course your ;'sure'..<<.you will not find anything such as you have cited.>>

give me a web link
you did in the end last time and i pointed it out to you on your own link..its stood for years;mossad would have gotten rid of it long ago.

it sPEAKS FOR ITSELF.SEE THE LINK
PICK OUT WHAT YOU REFUTE/GIVE ME THE SOURCE
YOU KNOW ACTUALY PROOVE SOMETHING..rather than just poopooing..your sure*[because you cant face the truth of what these sinners are killing for kiddy sex in the desert*[get that you athiest secularists;supporting religious zealotts grooming kids in the deserts

its sick'
its a death cult/refute this mfdavidian

[not gods mozaic..law..like in./.the bible

(Book)

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp%3Fdiscussion%3D3071%26page%3D0&sa=U&ei=Mk6eUp36Ks2ZlQWzn4D4DA&ved=0CBgQFjAJ

Child sacrifice..was practised in ancient times..as offering to the Ammonite god Molech..a worship of natural fertility..*which was forbidden*by the laws of Israel. See Leviticus 18:21; 20:1 - 5; 1Kings 11:7; 2 Kings 1717; 21:6; 27:10; Jeremiah 32:35; Ezekiel 16:21.

[is/this..what the settlers,,[under..THE ATHEIST[secular]..star..are doing..in the deserts..of/the..lampstand..[the/fox/in..the hen-house?]

http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=2994&page=0
http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=650
tell me...ever heard..of the/clean hands doctrine?

Dear oug,

If you want to accept garbage as truth you will accept garbage as truth. Rather then rely on garbage websites go to the source.

[Deleted for abuse.]

Dear oug,

Your insults are not appreciated, and I have no desire to insult you. There are many hate websites on the net. They are no substitute for going to the original source. One may also question the formation of the original source. Because material can be found on the web or in print is not reason to believe the information is valid.

I know you believe in an afterlife for which there is absolutely no evidence. I doubt that you will adopt a skeptical attitude to the information you receive in other areas.

Material that you find on the web may or may not be true. if you go from a biased website to another website with the same bias you will probably get similar lies. No matter how many times a lie is repeated it remains a lie.

Calling names is no substitute for reasoned argument based on verified information.

daviES QUOTE..:<<..Your insults are not appreciated,>>

OF COURSE NOT..[BUT..AT LEAST/THEY GIVE
YOu...something to say...but lets look at the rest of it aNYWAY?;..eh?

<<...and I have no desire.to insult you.
There are many hate websites on the net...>>..

CLEVER*ONE..SON..lol
compare/my name changing with hate sites;;lol way to go devio$

<<..They are no substitute for going to the original source.>>

my origonal sourCES SUGGEST THE NAMES

<<>One may also question the formation of the original source.>>

OH THE FORMATION/OVER\THE INFORMATION;..LOL
SO IF I WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH ABOUT NATZIES ASK THE NATZIES[OR ASK YOU?]

\<<..Because material can be found on the web or in print is not reason to believe the information is valid.>>

YES[THIS WORKS BOTH WAYS]
IF YOU REALLY THINK..SIMPLY OPINION WILL REFUTE MY LINKS PLEASE TRY REFUTE..JUST ONE..SEE THAT THERE ARE REASONS FOR MY BIAS
BUT YOUR REASONING SEEMS BASELESS..[lest you not know a least two coppers are looking at the proof

you havnt given anything but heresay*

<<..I know you believe in an afterlife for which there is absolutely no evidence.>>

oh right..so your a heathen[lol]..just trying to help gods people get their land back?

how much of a usefull idiot are you
no god/yet your killing for god

sick puppy is as my guides advise

<<..I doubt that you will adopt a skeptical attitude to the information you receive in other areas.>>

lol
[please guys dont let him in on the joke..lol

haahaahaahahahahahAAAAAAAAAAAA

haah

<<..Material/..same bias you will probably get similar lies.>>

yes and your point?
all my links lie/and all your nuthings = truth?

<<..lie is repeated it remains a lie.>>

no matter how many nuthings..you say re nuthing
thats not lying...cause your not saying anything

<<.Calling names../based on verified information.>>

throwing the sukker punch twice

lol
this is the best you got?
here chew on this
http://home.alphalink.com.au/~radnat/anstey%27s%20kingdom%20of%20shylock.html

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/enron-2-0-wall-street-wants-manipulate-state-energy-markets-just-like-manipulates-every-market.html

IT MUST BE GREAT..TO HAVE THE MOSSAd-MANUEL THINK FOR YOU
its by the bOOK/but its clear..from your time stamp/you never read nutin

really pathetic/thanks for revealing..nothing
[yes i was wrong..to name call..on a friends thread
but the topic..needs get rid..of the bull shhh secret

PLEASE NOT THAT HE REVEALS NUTHING..RE TOPIC
he could have talked about these communes they establised world wide kubootz..where they steal the works effort as they steal their kids minds/bodies;souls..despite a law saying no slve may be enslaved beyond the pardoning year..[7 years max]..there are fragments of goodness

fr mine govt should cover all our insurance means..[ie car home life job etc insurance/we pay a small money transphere tax of say 2 percent[and all other taxes go away[except for death duties/on dead corperate entities and or trusts..[anything given defacto personhood via ovt act/or private averments

maximum life term for any buisness mus be 25 years
too much value gets hiddn away because it might fix things
[we cured cancer a century ago[see reiche microscope harmonics

anyhow i see the future being cops on the eat leading arround group of people..community protection.not poicing..that every one is obligated under customry law to affer shelter to ayone..INDEED[that refusing a police order to give bed and breakfast orderd by policeman become a Statutry crime[punnishable by antisocial fine[of coursE indemnity comes with the order/with the order comes the cost

payed in full by coin[revalued back to its traditional base values[stolen out of hard coin by hyperinflating the fiat paper supply underpinning the paper values

[recall one penny DRINK..refund half peny after ya drunk the drink]
or bying a penny bunger and a pennies weight..in sweeties]

NOTE..NOT NOT
so a coke now costs 1 to 2 dollars[thus real undeflated value of a penny=a can of coke..we swapped our commonwealth sense in pence away
to decilmaliseD criminal treason by the debasement of the queens coin

but im venting

there are no big problems
when we fix them as they arise
for want of a talk/the kid was lost
for want of the kid the marriage was lost
for want of a father the kids got lost..lost lostlost
govt should be there for repair..instant pain minimisation

hi maaam..we here to fx it
immediatly..have a nice day*;
whenever we meet a cop they help us anyway

i got helped to be a carreer crimial because i le a plant..grow
lol was chargedcwith cultivating [lol]..a plant.only god can make grow

plus did jail for possing a fIXTURE [A PLANT INTHE GROUND IS A FIXTURE [OWNED BY THE LAND]..INSANTY..A LAW THAT DEEMS A PLANT A DRUG
A FIXTURE AS IF A FGABLE//CRIMINALISATION AS GOCR SEVICE?..no its immoral policing/policy..JOBS JOBS JOBS =REVENUE MORE CASH COWS..MORE MATES PRIVATISATIONS.

TALK ABOUT GIVING THE GUARD DOGS A BONE ER

Dear oug,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Protocols_of_the_Elders_of_Zion tells about one item of the hate material you have been spreading.

david f,
Your protagonist has been judiciously isolated for a month. I doubt it will slow his crusade down but it is a start.

Dear chrisgaff1000,

A protagonist (from Ancient Greek, protagonistes, meaning "one who plays the first part, chief actor") is the main character (the central or primary personal figure) of a literary, theatrical, cinematic or musical narrative, who enters conflict because of the antagonist. The audience is intended to mostly identify with the protagonist.

I would rather be the protagonist and he the agonist.

How did you know of his isolation for a month? It is rather sad since so much of his time appears to be taken up by generating those long posts.I hope he finds something else to give him joy during his isolation.

david f,
Your are quite correct in your interpretation of a protagonist.
I actually played the part of the common man in "A Man for all Seasons" who was the protagonist identifying with the audience.
As far as the subject is concerned be blessed for a while anyway.
Remember the devil also moves in mysterious ways.