With the worsening mess that the labor government have caused, continues to surface, I just hope that their loyal followers have learned a very valuable lesson this time around, as the situation, which many of them have ignored, is dire to say the least.

Now by all means, go ahead and support any form of missmanagement that effects their future, but they (the supporters) have to understand that by supporting this incompitent mob, they have in fact aided the deterioration of my future, along with others who could read between the lines.

What labor have been allowed to do is utterly disgraceful and would result in mass sackings in the REAL WORLD if not criminal charges.

Interesting to note that tax revenues are up by about 7%, despite the lies we have been fed by these fools in charge.

Tax revenue might be up by about 7%, BUT Government incompetence is up more than that thus cancelling the 7% out.

Hopefully cancelling out Labor & the Greens In September.

Yes indeed guys, we can all look forward to Abbott and the Liberals taking over the Government in September, after which there will be no more tax increases and budget deficits, and lies from politicians?

And if anything does go wrong, we can always say that it was due to the previous Government's poor ideas!

Gee, we won't have anything left to argue about on The Forum will we?

Suseonline,
Your last post exposed your mentality & maturity to the fullest. Does it hurt ?

Suseonline, it's called HISTORY my dear. Perhaps you may wish to do a little research.

On second thoughts, perhaps you shouldn't, as you won't like what you find.

Now as for Mr Abbott, if he sits on his hands AND DOES NOTHING we will be in better shape than we are with these incompetents in power.

Give me a few seconds if you can.
Rechtub has every right to his views, from my point of view it is a little, lets lie, one sided and? wrong!
Now who thinks every ALP/GREEN/INDEPENDENT VOTER is a lessor person, because they vote their way.
I hope not too many.
If most do?
This hung Parliament and Dillards knife crew, Abbott,s Doctor no trip, has for ever divided this country, Ireland style.
But no, it is not so, just as SOME Liberals voted Rudd in to power, and many ALP voters kept Howard in power.
Each Australian can think as they wish, but few, thankfully, apart from red neck radio, think as Rechtub does.
That will do me for this thread, piddling in Rechtubs pool only dirty,s an already black view of this country.

Susionline I am sorry.
Sorry that in what was to be my only post here I missed the quite dreadful remark from INDIVIDUAL.
We must under stand this, the gentleman is not a gent.
But he does his best, that was it, you come armed with an intellect.
Some clearly do not.
I wounder if I at least, need a change?
Aware my comment is one best not put, but to what end?
This thread most who will contribute to it, not all, is pure inflammatory junk!
Are we to become less than we once had been here?
Are the thoughts of voters other than our side to be constantly insulted, then why are we non Liberal even here?.
My question must one day be addressed this site, mostly due not to this section but the one above is one of this country,s best!
We play little part in that here, knowing my politics even with my unhappiness with Dillards dolts is not the mainstream here I weary of posters leaving and some who stay seemingly unable to put thought in to posts.
Susionline many who insult you Lexi and I lack the ability to comment on matters involveing thought.

Yes, Belly, your last line says it well enough.

The esteemed Mr individual rarely elucidates at any length.

90 percent of his posts involve his brief observation that people are either "stupid" and/or "morons".

That's about the extent of it from him.

rehctub and others of like mind,

Neo-liberals of the political generation of 1980 to 2007 have much to answer for.

Peter Costello was warned in 1998 that then policies would lead to a housing price bubble. The asset inflation of the Howard/Costello era priced the young out of the housing market to a significant degree.

The only reason Australians didn't suffer as much from the GFC as the USA and Europe was the prompt rescue actions of the Federal Labor Government, from September, 2008, when it rescued the private banks from default and boosted demand.

The Future Fund Costello is so fond of mentioning is a farce. Such funds, as shown by Norway, are only of value if used to buy foreign assets that can protect the domestic economy when the resource, that the fund should be built upon, is eventually depleted. The Future Fund does not have enough money to buy back the Commonwealth Bank, let alone all the other real assets that were previously owned for the Common Weal (or Common Good).

Peter Costello appears intent on restoring the reputation of the rating agencies whose reputations were so tarnished by their participation in the toxic products which were so much part of the GFC.

Citizens need to understand that our currency issuing Commonwealth Government can never go broke in the currency of Australia. It can always afford to pay for anything available for sale in exchange for Aussie dollars and that is of particular importance in Labor's aim of reducing the 12% total under-employment now existing.

Joe Hockey is always mentioning the interest bill of $20m per day. The government should stop paying that interest to Hockey's mates in the financial sector, it is upper class welfare, and just owe the extra money it spends (over and above revenue) to the Reserve Bank which it owns on our behalf

I am not a fiscal wizard but it seems to me that the combined cost of our pointless military commitments overseas and the squandered billions doled out in dodgy foreign relief aid together with a levy on banking and telco profits would completely wipe out the budget debt and create an immediate surplus....if we have to have one.
Even a 5 percent increase in GST at the bottom end and 10 percent at the top would go along way also although if they collected all the current GST they wouldn't need any increases.
Inside taxation sources inform me that they only collect 37 percent of the GST pool and the rest is avoided.
Just check out your local cash businesses especially the ones (increasing) that do not accept efpos.

Suseonline,
Your last post exposed your mentality & maturity to the fullest. Does it hurt ?
Posted by individual, Friday, 3 May 2013 6:34:53 AM

This is a post by the Bozo who wants to set up "Boot Camps" in the Deep-Deep-North for millions of Australians aged between 19-21, no idea about the multi-billion dollar cost or the dislocation to society. No idea about the cost of his other hair brained scheme of digging hundreds of Km's of channels or ditches or some such things to stop flooding. The same bloke who thinks its okay to wiz around the country side in an old ute with 5 in the back and plenty of XXXX with a driver over the limit. A real Einstein, can't wait for his next wacko idea, will have to be a real corker to top his other crazy notions.
back to you Brains!

Paul1405,
are you Suseonline's twin ? Belly could easily be the father. Gawd, what a family :-)

Thanks for the kind words Belly, Poirot and Paul1405, but I probably shouldn't have been so sarcastic as I was in my first post really : )

As it happens, I always make it my business to ignore the inconsequential remarks of a certain individual on this forum...

When I read the title of this thread I just knew it would be the usual crowing rehctub, extolling the future virtues of the holy Abbott Government, while indulging in his usual sport of Gillard bashing.

I just couldn't help myself... sigh...

It's not your fault guys, as few, if any of you have ever been in business, so, any working life you have, or have has, has been provided to you, at huge risk to your employer, unless of cause you are/were a public servant.

One advantage of owning and running a business for so long, is that you are able to forecast what is most likely to happen, because, if you don't, you can quite easily go broke. Another situation that is somewhat foriegn to you lot.

It was quite alarming to see labor take an axe to IR when the global economic situation was looking dire, yet, they proceeded with the predicted result being a loss of confidence.

Since that day in 08, they (labor) have simply gone from one mess to another, with empt promises like, the real Julia, to down right disasters like savaging our successful border controls.

Now the outrageous part of all this is that you guys stood there offering your unconditional support for this incompitent mob, despite the obvious signs that they were loosing their way, not to mention the lies and back flips along the way.

So this is why I say, to any of you that are 40+ and therefore remember labor's last debt FEST, I just hope you have learned your lesson this time, as another five years like the past may well see us broke.

Now as for the comment about labor avoiding our crash, once again, an unconditional bail out that has come back to bite us, as the banks are literally cleaning up at our expense.

If there was any doubt as to the incompetence of this Government a boat was reported arriving with 184 people on it making the April figure 3319 welfare invaders.

Also 3 boats with over 500 people were detected in one day not sure yet if this includes the above boat.

This from an incompetent Government that Budgeted for 450 arrivals per month in April we had 3,436.

Forget the NDIS levy we will soon need to have a levy to keep these economic invaders in the luxury they now expect.

Philip S,
I can't wait for Lexi, Suseonline & Paul1405 putting forward a proposal as to how to solve that issue. They'll probably it isn't an issue I'd like them to tell us how much they're prepared to contribute to pay for it all.

Yes Philip, incompetence everywhere you look.

They took the nice guy approach to border control, and tried to fix something that wasn't broken, now just look at the result.

They tried to stimulate the economy, by creating jobs and splashing unconditional cash around. Cash that was in many cases wasted, simply because of incompetence.

They came up with many brain fart ideas, the likes of fuel watch, grocery watch and cash for clunkers, all of which cost tax payers hard earned dollars, all wasted due to incompetence.

They then decided that it wasn't their fault, it was their leader, so they axed the most popularly elected PM in decades, in favor of the current Julia, real Julia, and the real real Julia, all of which have been a disaster.

Then, having realized they had made some huge blunders,and, they had promised a surplus AT ANY COST, decided to tax about the only Industry (mining) that was going places, another move that failed miserably, in part due to Julias haste in cutting a deal before the 2010 election.

In short, they were simply outsmarted, yet Julia couldn't see this and insisted that the MRRT would not effect mining, as in her words, investment in mining had spiked.

Of cause it did, so they (the miners) could write off debt, as opposed to pay additional tax. Der!

Tip, thier next move will be to sit out the bad times and wait for the change of government, again resulting in no tax.

In fact, if one was reading a book about our past five years, one would have to think it was fictional, as surely no government could get so many things so wrong in such a short period. Sadly though, it is not fictional, it is true, yet their followers remain loyal to the core.

It simply defies logic.

In summary, labor are out of their depth.

Poirot, sorry never intended to leave you from my list.
Just as I never intended to return to this thread.
It needs however to be said.
So I will, nothing of intellectual value ever appears in individuals posts.
His single skill is insulting his opponents.
As has been said, the truly weird wish to get every one doing national service, to fix non existent problems, is telling, it describes the bloke as lost in a world that never existed.
Rechtub is different.
In only one way, he thinks he is right.
I aware it may be against forum rules, think we feed them.
We, those capable of understanding the incoming government is not flying in, on its own wings Halos on each head!
Should look for debate and thought filed posts, even from our opponents, in threads other than these children,s minding sand boxes.

Labor was instrumenatal is selling 4 State Banks and the Commonwealth.Banks create money with the click of a computer mouse.Why would you sell off your biggest income earning asset and then borrow from these same now private Banking interests?

We are now taxed to the hilt since the private banking interests own our increases in productivity by virtue of creating the money to equal it.

The debt can never be repaid because even our inflationary money gets created as debt.Selling of energy,resources and public assets is the only way our Govts can service debt.

Once China finds new sources of energy and resources,we are stuffed.

His single skill is insulting his opponents.
Belly,
You definitely out-shine me by supporting the most incompetent political party known to man and, by doing so you are also supporting them in making many peoples' lives a misery & ruining Australia. Now that just reeks of intelligence & is really something to be very proud of . M...n!

And believe me, Belly...if there's a question as to whether someone displays intelligence or stupidity, apparently individual is a leading authority on the subject.

You can always depend on him to let you know if you qualify for "stupid" (or not:)

Once China finds new sources of energy and resources,we are stuffed.
Arjay,
They're already investing heavily in African countries for natural resources. Russia is gearing up for tourism.
I don't at this stage know of what other schemes are planned but I concur with you that this country will be ruined if we don't get rid of the incompetence that has infiltrated the whole of the public service.
The PM is waffling on about beefing up the defence forces. What for ? All the would be invaders have to do is to throw away their I.D. , jump on a boat & claim asylum here. We don't need armed forces for that .
Will the staunch Labor supporters learn anything from the situation thus far ? No !
You can stop hoping.

As for China, they are, as we speak, building a rail link to Mogolia, where the production costs of thermal coal, landed, is tipped to be arou d $22 per ton.

Our cost is about $150 per ton, before shipping and that includes coaking, which subsidizes thermal.

I have a mate who works at Peak Downs mine, who is one of 900 who just got the chop. It was suggested the employer laid much of the blame on the mining tax, and the effect it will have on future profits.

It has also been suggested they will wind down and wait for a change of government.

Belly, while you have lived the dream, I have created the dream for many, largely from sticking my neck out and risking everything, creating jobs along the way.

Now when I was making $300K + per year, back in the 90's early 2000's it was worth the risk, however nowadays, the returns are simply not there to warrant the risk.

Back then, it was thought acceptable that two week turnover,(gross) would pay a years rent, whereas today, it's more like 15 to 20 weeks gross turnover.

Furthermore, many businesses have been shafted in the IR department, resulting in loss of work and very low returns for owners, not to mention unsaleable businesses.

Quite simply, the ducks are no longer in a row when it comes to small retail, which by the way is ome of our largest employers. Or was.

So Belly, you may well accuse me of being I'll informed, but not when it comes to running a small Retail business.

Dear butcher,

you said;

“Back then, it was thought acceptable that two week turnover,(gross) would pay a years rent, whereas today, it's more like 15 to 20 weeks gross turnover.”

What on earth are you on about?

Gross turnover?

Want to try again?

I have run small businesses for most of my life. You mate have been posting such rubbish for a long while now I really have serious doubts about your claims to have done so yourself.

And all this banging on about how terrible the Labour Government has been. We were one of only a few countries that had the number of small businesses actually climbed, not fell, through the GFC. Not only that more of them were exporting than ever before.

The latest figures on Small Businesses are from the 2010-11 period. http://www.innovation.gov.au/SmallBusiness/KeyFacts/Documents/AustralianSmallBusinessKeyStatisticsAndAnalysis.pdf

Every business demographic grew during that year. Businesses employing 1-4 people, 5-19 people, 20-199 people and 200+ people all saw gains. Contrast this to other countries which have seen steep declines across the board and one can only conclude your constant whinging about this government and small business is pretty damn hollow.

How with some civilty can I tell Indy, or for that matter Rechtub, the brighter of the two what I think.
First in the rough and tumble of this site, show me one contributor from my side of the fence who insults so often.
Tell me I am that person and I will use my reserves.
This thread infers ALP voters are lessor.
A truth not to be chalenged, we have shared this site with interesting folk.
We in my view should never name them by name, but some seemed to need mental health issues looked at.
Some threatened some put words in to deeds.
As rude/stubborn and what ever you chose to call me, or any who ever posted here, look no further than indy for a great black hole in the understanding others rights to differing views part of his brain.

This thread infers ALP voters are lessor.
Belly,
No, your vote counts as much as mine so don't worry you're not seen as lesser. Going by who we support I'm actually the lesser one because I support an outfit that does less damage to this country & its people.
What you call understanding is nothing more than participating in the greedy grab, hangers-on mentality that is so prevalent on your side of politics.
I support cutting the immoral salaries of those on the public purse. No-one, under the present economic circumstances should be on more than $150,000PA. Let the ex PM's live off their Super like everyone else. It's insane to give these people free offices, free travel, free secretaries or whatever they're rumoured to get. No-one can convince me that old codgers like Goaf & Mal & need what they receive. They probably can't even spend half of it, so who are we actually paying that money & what for ? Even Hawke, Keatinge & Howard are still on way too much money & benefits. I wonder what Rudd is on now.
I have no problem with ex pollies getting a decent pension but I draw the line at an indecent one.
If only the electorate were aware of how much some of these public servants cost us & deny us.

csteel, I must confess that I should have elaborated and targeted Retail, rather than just small business, as many small businesses have boomed, riding on the back of mining. My appologies.

As for gross turnover, that relates to sales, before any expenses comes out.

My last butcher shop is a prime example of greed from landlords, as my rent was around $130,000 per year, and my sales were about $$11,000 per week, so it took about 13 weeks turnover to pay the rent.

Back in the mid 90's, my rent was just $15,000 per year and my sales were about $30,000 per week. Happy days!

In the early 2000's, my rent was $50,000 per year and my sales about $28,000 per week.

IN 2008 my rent was $100,000 per year and my turnover was about $15,000 per week.

Another problem we now face is a change in the law whereby directors are now personably liable for debts, even if they havnt provided a personal guarantee, another change that makes doing business just that much less attractive.

Like it or not, small business today has a greater chance of failing, than succeeding, and that's a real worry.

I often say, the best way to assess a small business (retail), is would you buy your own business.

Chances are, not many would.

If there is such a thing as GROSS TURNOVER there must also be a thing called NETT TURNOVER. Wouldn't it be GROSS PROFIT and NETT PROFIT TURNOVER = SALES in a butcher shop.
Small business can't have it all their own way. Ripping off taxation like they do and expecting an easy ride on IR and regulation as well.

Just to further clarify, the term gross turnover, means all sales, including any that are external to the shop, eg, caffee, pubs, clubs etc.

Sorry for any confusion there.

Paul, as far as small business ripping off the tax man, yep, it does go on, I am the first to admit that.

As for what you consider To be an easy ride with regards to IR, I consider two grown adults, coming to an amicable arrangement to be a fair system, as not everything has to revolve around dollars.

Like it or not, labor have caused a lot of grief between employers and employees, much of which has eroded mutual respect between the parties.

Paul while you and I can never agree on politics, we do in part on attitudes.
However if you care to, look back at our swapped words the night before Rudd won the right to lead the country.
And be knifed by his own side.
We actually wished each other luck, and I not knowing it would be so, probably handed out your HTV not knowing it was for the last time.
I want you to consider this, your humor, stirring, does not transplant to print.
It is built in to Aussie mens culture, but even when face to face it leads some times, to war.
This thread is reason enough to re look at your style.
We both targeted or was it more likely returned fire?
The expressed view we are in some way unthinking in the poling booth.
The quite silly view, unless we vote as butcher does we inflict pain on our country.
IF only we could tell!
But in truth unlike your more mischievous posts, this one while ROTFL! funny is not meant to be so!
I having fired many volley across my sides bows,and yours, am concerned that the intellectual value of some threads is near zero.

Ok, so let's change direction a bit, and let me ask you labor supporters, those of you that intend to vote for labor again, why would you do that, when you know full well that it is they, who are responsible for the mess we are are in right now.

Sure, there was the GFC and sure, one of the contributing factors of the MRRT failure was a drop in commodity prices, however, also remember, tax revenues for the Feds are up, not down.

I would also like to remind the likes of Belly, who obviously hates Gillard, that she is still the leader.

Remember, the definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and expect a different result.

small business ripping off the tax man, yep, it does go on,
rehctub,
There's no bigger ripping off the tax payer than the Public Service so, don't feel too bad.
The worst component being the pollies & their benefit schemes. And, no their followers haven't learnt any lessons.

Have you noticed rechtub and his lad indy, are putting them selves up as having understanding others do not?
Loath me if you want, but judge me on my posts.
I and few if any others have never refused to target my side.
And could if asked do the same for rechtubs side.
Indys seems to have died out in South America after fleeing Germany .
The thought, that Labor at its lowest point in history, sadly dislike it or not this is that time, still about 45% will not vote Liberal side of the fence this time.
And these two? time and again question the decentsy of every one of those 45%
Look every morning , gird you loins to be horrified, at the previous days posts, from t5hese two, tweedle dum and tweedle dee.
Without hesitation I could name the last six PM s, just bet these knowledgeable blokes would need ten days.

but judge me on my posts.
Belly,
It might come as a real surprise to you but your posts are all we CAN judge you on.
And you have the gall of accusing me of throwing insults ? Just look at the words in your post here. Talk about hypocrisy & lack of sense, dead in line with union thuggery. The kind that brought this great country to its knees. Actually you're doing us a great favour by exposing your mentality before the election so that the young gullible voters can see what you lot are made of. I do recall saying in one of my posts quite a while back that the real mentality of Labor will surface since the announcement of the 13 election. I wish I could be so right every time.

....Without hesitation I could name the last six PM s, just bet these knowledgeable blokes would need ten days.

Yes, it's called AGE Belly, and sometimes it does come in handy.

As for me, I only became interested in politics in the late 70's, however I do remember Gough, Frazer, Harke, Keating, Howard, Rudd and of cause the knife wielding Gillard.

Before Gough, I think it was Haden, or something like that, and I believe he went on the become gov gen.

DID I PASS THE TEST!

Continued

Continued by Rehctub

I admired two of these, Hawke, my all time favorite and of cause Howard, the man who led the most successful party of the past thirty odd years.

Now unlike you, I don't vote for a party, at any cost, I vote for who will do the best job, and so far, I have been on the money with Howard and Hawke.

In fact, if Hawke were to run again, he would almost get my vote, except the party he ran is nothing more than part of history, as labor leaders are now little more than puppets.

Another difference between us is that while I spent the largest portion of my working life, creating jobs, your agenda was to protect them, often at any cost and with little regard to the risk takers.

Now while this may not be a bad thing, your lot often set about to protect the lower end workers.

Now even that fine, but to insist they be paid the same rates, simply lowered the bar, as efficient workers felt duped, so productivity took a dive, as good workers went backwards, amd who could blame them.

Then, your lot again faught fior UN fair dismissal, resulting in casualization of the workforce, bringing along kaos and mayhem, with many finding borrowing fir a home very hard, without permernant employment.

So take a bow!

Howard wound these laws back, for most small employers and guess what, the country boomed, only to see Rudd/Gillard come along and take an axe to IR, resulting in loss of confidence.

If you care to remember, I told you personally this would happen, as usual, you fobbed me off.

So now I've answered your question, without insult, perhaps you could do the same and answer mine, that is, why on earth would you, or anyone for that matter vote for more of the same, in the form of Gillard and Swan, who, without doubt are the worst in modern history.

Now on the other hand, if you disagree that they are the worst, please explain why you think that way.

I'll give Gillard credit in one respect, she has held together a minority government for nearly 3 years, no mean feat in itself. She has achieved this despite a number of major obstetrical's, not the least ALP factionalism, which I do believe lead to the downfall of Rudd. To factionalism you can add a scandal or three, Thompson for one, very poorly handled by Labor. Politically, I find Gillard is not all that savvy, the NDIS funding, she handled that badly, something that was a lay down mazaire she almost botched it.
Labor has also copped plenty from sectional interests and the conservative media, some has come at their own cost as they have made themselves easy targets at times. Gillard as the upfront spokesperson has not been all that good at the hard sell of policy.
A saving grace for Gillard and her government has been the generally lackluster efforts of Abbott and his people to be a strong opposition with positive policies, Abbott does lack creditability with many voters and it will be a factor come September, not saying the coalition can't win, at this stage I expect them to romp in.
Politically there is not a huge gulf between Labor and Liberal, take away some of the grandstanding by both sides, and unless you are so one eyed, you would not see a huge difference, more on inferences of policy, rater than a blatant difference of policy. On about 70% of what comes before parliament both sides agree. I do do not see much radicalism from either Labor or the Coalition.
As I said at the beginning of my post Gillard has done well to last so long. I don't know how, but she has.

Politically there is not a huge gulf between Labor and Liberal
Paul1405,
The whole country is well aware of that & no-one's really on about that. Where the BIG difference is is in competence. Labor has absolutely none & the Coalition has some.

Yes Indi, and the libs also have history on their side, something that is very hard to discredit.

So I'm assuming once again that my mate Belly, once challenged, has taken his ball and run off to another thread.

The truth often hurts Belly.

Yep, looks that way.