This is the only case of forced marriage that I have seen in Australia.

Given the number of immigrants arriving here from many countries I am sure there would be many more forced marriages if they could be uncovered. I feel so sorry for a young woman forced by family to marry a much older man to settle a debt or because she was promised by her parents.

Polygamy exists, FGM is practiced here as does forced marriage and maybe other alien cultural practices. We need to enforce our laws to preserve our culture.

Multiculturalism in action! It is not all colourfull parades and beer festivals.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/family-court-rules-young-indian-couples-forced-marriage-null-and-void/story-fndo471r-1226502660802

Banjo, you are very good at innuendo "I am sure there would be many more forced marriages", "and maybe other alien cultural practices".
As you sit on the veranda of your 'Queenslander' way up there in The Deep Deep North, with a XXXX in hand, ponder the thought that the Queen of England is in a union with a man because of an "arranged" marriage, as was her son Charles involved in a most unhappy arranged marriage. Not that I support arranged marriages, seems it happens in other than the cultures you like to refer to, so often.

Paul,
You make me laugh, not with you but at you.

Being green you believe in the ideology of multiculturalism, whereby all peoples get on, no matter what their culture, and all aspects of cultural practice should be allowed.

So tell is there any cultural practices that you would not allow in our society and what are they, if any.

You know I could list a whole raft of practices that our society would find objectionable, forced marriagesis is but one.

Given the number of immigrants that come from societies where forced marriages is common, it is very naive to think that the particular practice is not carried on here. In the UK, it is estimated there are 3000 forced marriages per year and a number of what police call 'balcony deaths' of girls who either suicide or are helped off the balcony because they object to being forced to marry.

Multiculturalism: turning racism into multi-racism.

Multiculturalism = Divide and Conquer.

Banjo I agree, and with your words to my lost left of reality mate Paul.
But must add this.
I told you of my days as just a kid, nearly, working in Sydney.
Young Greeks, fresh arrivals working in a place I had a pick up at.
Said Mother insisted they go home to find a wife!
Not marry an Aussie s*&^%.
But in truth we in this country should be disturbed that the true left even womens lib, turns its head at the dreadful truth, and life, some of these women live.

Belly,
Yes, I too recall those days. I think Melbourne had the biggest Greek population outside of Athens. Some did go back and marry greek girls and some stayed there and some brought their brides back. But many did marry Aussie girls and all integrated. As did Italians and other european migrants. There was not the false and flawed ideology of Multiculturalism then.

When MC was forced upon us, the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways. According to some, we had no culture at all.

MC has failed because it divides us into groups instead of promoting one community. We need to promote integration at all levels if we want an harmonous society, where all have the same rights and responsibilities. Some migrants find it harder to adapt than others, but we have to be steadfast in our basic social standards and not accept alien practices, like forced marriage.

Dear Banjo,

You wrote: "When MC was forced upon us, the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways."

I am an immigrant to Australia and became a citizen after multiculturalism became policy. I was told no such thing. When I became a citizen I agreed to obey the laws of Australia. The two forms of the citizen's pledge follow. One includes God and the other doesn't.

Pledge 1

From this time forward, under God,
I pledge my loyalty to Australia and its people,
whose democratic beliefs I share,
whose rights and liberties I respect, and
whose laws I will uphold and obey.

Pledge 2

From this time forward
I pledge my loyalty to Australia and its people,
whose democratic beliefs I share,
whose rights and liberties I respect, and
whose laws I will uphold and obey.

Both pledges include a promise to obey the laws of Australia. Multiculturalism or not forced marriage and female genital mutilation are against the laws in Australia. Immigrants are not told they can carry on as they did in the old country

Dear Banjo,

The article was about a young man being forced into marriage and being Indian there was a fair chance he wasn't Muslim. Yet you spoke of “a young woman forced by family to marry a much older man to settle a debt or because she was promised by her parents.”

Shameless!

You also wrote that “Given the number of immigrants arriving here from many countries I am sure there would be many more forced marriages if they could be uncovered.”

Well they are well known.

“http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/an-estimated-1000-cases-of-forced-marriage-a-year-in-australia/story-fndo48ca-1226529937974”

I will wager a large proportion involve white, bitter males on the sad side of middle age, you know the type we discussed them earlier, who get into the Asian bride market. About 20 years ago one poor little thing turned up on my sister-in-laws doorstep in country Victoria, beaten, half naked and in real distress. Her well over middle aged 'husband' came and dragged her away. My sister-in-law's husband was pretty old school and just closed the door, of course he was over tens years her senior.

But you find just one case of it involving a immigrant couple and straight away you launch into polygamy, FGM, alien practices, and slamming multiculturalism.

Sorry, I think this time I need capitals.

Poison Peddler!

davis f,
Firstly, MC has nothing to do with citizenship. MC was a policy, introduced by Al Grassby when Whitlam was PM and futher expanded by Frasser PM.

The ideology was that people of all cultures could come together and live in peacefull harmony. Yet what happened was that various cultures were contesting with each other to see who could get the biggest share of the funds being handed out by both State and Federal governments. It certainly did not stop the Croats and Serb from brawling and not did it stop the Lebs from hating everybody else. Each government dept. had to adopt a policy of MC and implement it. We wasted millions of dollars on the cultural activities.

Various ethnic groups were encouraged to act out their own culture, with the support of community liason officers whos salaries came frome our governments funds.

We were told it would 'enrich' our society, so I expect we should be gratefull that the girls that were gang raped in about 2000 were part of the 'enrichment process'. They got it the Leb way.

Forced marriages, FGM, polygamy, dog fighting, cock fighting and Croats and Serbs brawling are examples of unintended consequences of ill thought out policy. It is what happens when ideology is put before practicality.

Yet the stupid part is we are still stuck with a non discriminatory immigration policy and thus still importing persons from groups that have clearly shown they cannot or will not integrate.

Banjo said; "Paul, You make me laugh, not with you but at you."

Banjo as the old conservative that you are I'm surprised that you would be able to raise a chuckle. surly a laugh would be beyond you in your world of yesteryear where wild bush horses roam. Should I feel the pain of rejection from Banjo, a sad individual living in a world of hate for others that he doesn't understand and never will. People that are seen as a threat to his miserable existence.
Csteele; I've known of plenty of Aussie girls who being "up the duff" were quickly made "marry the boy" to save the good mane of the family. Well it was that or a forced backyard abortion. That was Australia not so long ago. Something Banjo didn't put to poetry.

csteele,
What you need is a reality check. I said nothing about the actual case or religon. I do not care what religon or ethnicity the plaintiffs are. The fact is that it was the first such case in our courts. In your link, the estimate put by Minister Goward is the same as I concluded by going on UK figures. This is about 1000 forced marriages per year.

It is a bit sad that you do not recognise forced marriage as an alien cultural practice. As I said i feel very sorry for the girls that are forced to marry an older man to settle a debt or for some other advantage to the family. Like polygamy and FGM it is againts our laws and this is where the commonality lies. There are other alien cultural practices we also have to guard against. All the result of the flawed MC ideology.

A few years ago, there were 3 seperate matters where our consular staff were approached for help, in some Middle Eastern country, by girls that had been sent on 'holidy' to the old country and on arrival they found they were expected to marry some blokes as arranged by the family. They objected and I believe our officials gave them assistance back to Aus. One wonders how many girls have gone along under family presure in that circumstance.

So forced marriage is difficult to uncover unless one of the parties really digs their heels in and objects. What is needed here is widespread publicity showing where help can be obtained. I know minister Goward was considering using the social networks for this purpose.

Dear Banjo,

You wrote: "When MC was forced upon us, the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways."

Please cite exactly when and where 'the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways.'

They may ignore Australian laws, but they were not told they were free to do so. Your statement remains false.

Dear Banjo,

It was patently obvious what you were trying to do with your post so do not try and slice it any other way.

Right now I have a really short fuse for such crap. It is divisive, destructive and dangerous and has to stop. It is people like you who serve this tripe up constantly that we have to watch now. In some ways it is like living with someone with Tourettes, it issues forth with little thought. When something is a rarity and a well understood condition one might sympathise and adjust, just like we have done with runner for the most part.

But unlike Tourettes this is becoming a transmittable disease with a very real risk of infecting others. Disinfecting rubbish like your opening post has become a matter of urgency.

How about rereading what you have written and think about whether the evidence you provided justified in any way the immigrant bashing you have just engaged in.

csteele you tell of your short fuse, and lay charges against Banjo, may I bring this to your attention?
You disappoint me, every time you post, some fine posters flock to support the very thing I fear most.
POLITICAL CORRECTNESS, blind to the reality's of todays world.
Forgive me for constantly thinking you are a woman.
Banjo and I are completely different in politics.
I however have zero doubt he started this thread to warn and show his concerns,as he has many times, about the fate of women, in other parts of the world and in OUR COUNTRY.
My childhood leftist days, driven to reality by such as you, left at least equality for women world wide burning within me.
Not just Muslims but many races treat females as lessor beings.
Where is your concern for them? for India's rape and tortured women.
How can the PC driven left live with the horror of life for women in Asia and the Muslim country,s.
How dare you! be silent on them but insult Banjo for highlighting a truth.
Citizens of this country and indeed the western world are being forced in to marriage.
Can you ignore that, jump over that truth, to defame Banjo?

Belly>> But in truth we in this country should be disturbed that the true left even womens lib, turns its head at the dreadful truth, and life, some of these women live<<

Belly I think these women get a touch of the "Stockholm Syndrome."

Women are mistreated, and all religions I know of support it. Nevertheless csteele has called it right. Immigrants have not been encouraged to violate Australian law by any government entity as Banjo claimed in his statement: "When MC was forced upon us, the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways."

Multiculturalism has not been forced on us. Many Australians approve of it. English-speaking countries have previously attempted to force immigrants to behave like the English. It was called the 'melting pot'. My wife's mother came from Norway. When she was asked her religion and answered, "Lutheran" the immigration officer wrote 'Church of England' as she wasn't Catholic.

Multiculturalism does not encourage immigrants to break Australian laws. It merely encourages them to keep aspects of their culture without being shunned because of that. There is fear and hate of those with a different language, religion, nationality or nationality. It is called xenophobia, and multiculturalism is an attempt to counter that fear. Banjo exploits it.

David f,
The immigrants were told by the community liason officers they could carry on their culture as before and by other immigrants, as indeed we were told that we had to adapt to other cultures.

Nonody specificly told them they could break the law, but some do so because we fail to enforce our laws. for example, the mother and Uncle who forced the marriage in the article were not charged and to date no one has yet to answer to a court relating to FGM, yet the is plenty of evidence that FGM is practiced here.

If you had not heard of being able to carry on with your own culture, perhaps your tribe were not diverse enough for it to be mentioned. Groups that came from the UK or Ireland missed out on government grants because they were not ethnic enough.

Much time and money was spent on the big lie of 'Unity in diversity'

Yet, even soccer clubs had to change their names in attempt to reduce the violence between ethnic groups.

Dear Banjo,

You keep on. The big lie of 'Unity in Diversity'. What big lie? It's unity in some aspects and diversity in other aspects. If you were concerned about big lies how about admitting that your statement, "When MC was forced upon us, the immigrants were told they could carry on just like in the old country and it was up to us to adapt to their ways." is simply false?

Multiculturalism is a government policy that many Australians support. There has been no pressure on other Australians to adapt to the ways of immigrants. No immigrant group has been told they can carry on just like in the old country. There are three lies in your statement. The lies support your appeal to fear and hate. Stop lying.

In Australia we have a much bigger range of foods due to immigrants of non-English backgrounds. I appreciate going to Chinese, Turkish, German, Japanese, Italian, French and the other restaurants generally opened by people with those backgrounds. We buy foods of various ethnic origins. Occasionally we go to concerts put on by BEMAC (Brisbane ethnic music, art and culture). Being hard of hearing I prefer movies with subtitles. Those movies are generally non-English speaking. I appreciate those manifestations of multiculturalism. I also welcome the many contacts I have made with people from cultures different from mine. I write an occasional book review for the Journal of Asian Studies. Nobody there seems concerned that I am not Asian.

csteele,
What you and david f see is only the children in colourful costumes, beer festivals and dragon parades. You ignor the baggage that comes with some cultures. In fact you attempt to suppress and hide it.

I will continue to expose alien cultural practices whenever it comes to light. The reality is that the policy of MC has been detrimental to our community.

MC is a philosophy which fosters seperate developement. A philosophy that rates original culture ahead of national loyality. It divides us into tribes.

The only way to deal with alien cultural practice is to recognise them and insist they have no place here. All immigrants are informed about our society before coming here, so ignorance is no excuse.

To ignor alien cultural practices is to compromise our own culture.

Policy of integration will promote cohesiveness in the community.

I hope you will continue to argue because i want it exposed and talked about. I notice that Paul has yet to come up with any list of cultural practices he would not allow.

This confected outrage, Banjo, might be more easily dealt with it you could indicate which 'alien cultural practices' you decry that are not yet proscribed by Australian law?

Then there would be something tangible to lobby for.

Dear Banjo,

You don’t have a clue as to what I see.

You wrote: “I will continue to expose alien cultural practices whenever it comes to light.”

How noble of you. Let’s close all the restaurants that serve anything but witchety grubs and other staples of the diet before European settlement. In fact let's close all restaurants since they are foreign imports. Let’s get rid of such foreign imports as Christianity, Judaism, Islam and the English language.

Culture is a living thing. It changes as it absorbs alien cultural practices. English speaking people no longer paint themselves blue and worship trees as their ancestors did. Had Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Normans, Romans and many other aliens not come to England they might still be doing so.

Australians and other people are continually changing their culture. The English language contains approximately 400,000 words. French and most European languages contain about 80,000 words. English contains so many words because it has absorbed words from other languages in a way that most other languages have not. The French have tried to keep their language ‘pure’ by keeping out words of non-French origin. English is much more a world language because it has been more open to words of alien origin.

You wrote: “To ignor alien cultural practices is to compromise our own culture.”

How ridiculous! Our culture is an amalgam of alien cultural practices.

Thank you for hoping I will continue to argue. I will as I feel multiculturalism is a much more reasonable policy than trying to avoid change by forcing immigrants to be like what’s already here. Immigrants inevitably change a society. One can try to erase the culture they bring with them. All that will do is to create fear and hate for them when they retain aspects of their culture and deprive the existing culture of the benefits that may come from their culture. I prefer multiculturalism.

Dear david f,

"Our culture is an amalgam of alien cultural practices."

Thanks for that enlightening remark. But isn't that a bit contradictory or disconnected?

You definitely won't land a job as a lecturer in anthropology at Oxford if you keep posting statements like that around.

David you say "Multiculturalism is a government policy that many Australians support".

The death penalty is a government policy in many countries, & probably more Australians support that than support multiculturalism, does that make it right?

We are all aware that multicultural policy was a ploy used by Labor to buy some votes, in the early days of vote buying policies. You know, back when they actually had some policies that were not dictated by their need to buy votes.

The fact that it succeeded in buying them some votes they would otherwise would never have received proves just how unbalanced the policy is. It had to be to win those votes.

It along with their boat people policy, really just an extension of vote buying, in reverse, [fear of upsetting some votes they have paid for], it is probably the most damaging to Oz well being of all their stuff ups.

Banjo here is something you can campaign on;

(1) Kaparot is a traditional Jewish religious ritual that takes place around the time of the High Holidays. Classically, it is performed by grasping a live chicken by the shoulder blades and moving around one’s head three times, transferring one’s sins to the chicken. The chicken is then slaughtered and eaten.

(2) Christians are nailed to crosses in a grim Good Friday reenactment of Jesus's suffering. Thousands of people watch as devoted Catholics are crucified in this gruesome annual ritual.

Would not be a good look in Hyde Park Sydney, although the chickens think its better than number 1.

"Multiculturalism is a government policy that many Australians support"

When was that policy ever put to a popular vote?

Diversity as well, when will it be put to a vote?

Why is it that Australia has to be diverse? Who benefits and how?

I am not arguing against reasonable migration numbers. But it should not be necessary to lie about the alleged benefits. It is fair enough for the electorate to expect answers on:

1. What is the impact of immigration on our population and quality of life?

2. Why do we need a higher population, and if there is a consensus a higher population is needed, what is the optimal growth per annum to avoid social problems and what is the optimal population of Australia?

Paul 1405 has arrived.
From the true left, we have Banjo from right of right too.
Paul tell me, why will the left not speak out?
About forced FGM here or in any country.
How can a bloke I respect but fail to understand davidf not cry?
YES WET Cheeks cry, about the fate of women in India/Egypt/why are the left not defending women.

You don't have to look over anyone else's fence when molestation of children and child marriage are common in aboriginal communities, and in cities too.

When will the Australia multicultural policy put the rights of aboriginal children ahead of cultural rights? There should be one law protecting all children.

paul,
Heres a better question for you.

Why do we prosecute people for holding cockfights and turn a blind eye to the cutting pieces of flesh off little girls genitals. We also do nothing about the estimated 1000 forced marriages per year.

Do you put cruelty of roosters ahead of cruelty to little girls?

You seem happy with the current situation.

Belly, I can assure you the vast majority of Australians from backgrounds that traditionally practice forced marriages, do not support that practice in Australia. Like many practices that may have been seen as 'good' in another place at another time, there is no place for that here in Australia.
Like you and the vast majority of Australians I do not support cultural practices that are in defiance of Australian law.
The most vocal in support of women's rights in this country are those of the so called left. You being a man of history know that it was the conservatives in society who have always opposed the rights of women, indeed they oppose the rights of all to equality in society, seeing themselves as have a divine right to rule.

If we guard the gates of Australian culture to keep only the traditional heterosexual, Anglican who reveres the Westminster system we would have to forget a lot of Australia’s history.

We would have to forget our iconic bush ranger, Irish Ned Kelly, our greatest military commander, Jewish General Monash, our greatest comedian, Jewish Roy Rene, our great Olympian, Yvonne Goolagong, our greatest author, homosexual Patrick White, the only Australian to win the Nobel Prize in Literature, along with his male Greek lover, Manoly Lascaris, Chinese Victor Chang, pioneer in heart transplant surgery, and the iconic Simpson and his donkey at Gallipoli if we remember Simpson was a communist. In time there will be Muslims added to the list.

Sure forced marriages and female genital mutilation are horrible abuses which should not be allowed in Australia or anywhere else in the world. Those who want to practice such things in Australia should be severely punished and deported.

However, the influence is two ways. Immigrants influence Australian culture and are influenced by Australian culture. That is also true of Muslims. I know a family of Palestinians in Brisbane. There were attempts to recruit their two sons to fight in the Middle-Eastern Wars. The sons are Australians now and wanted none of it. I gave a paper at a conference held at the University of Queensland. A Malaysian who was there with his wife also gave a paper. The three of us went to the university bar after the session. After a few drinks he told me he was an atheist. If he would be open about that in Malaysia he would lose his job, be alienated from his community and might even have to serve a term in jail. He admired our academic, religious and intellectual freedom to a greater extent than I think many Australians do.

Australia can encourage immigrants to mix with other Australians by separation of religion and state. Stop government funding religious schools. Get rid of the school chaplaincy. Improve the public schools and make them places where children of any ethnic or religious background feel welcome.

Minority within a minority changes nothing.
In our country or any other forced FGM is wrong.
Forced marriage in any country, often of children is wrong.
You you disappoint me, honestly, I am an online campaigner for womens rights,away from this site.
I would think the true left can see, just how much that support is needed.
Rather than defend, automatically as csteele does, all actions of any Muslim we could look at the outside world.
India in the headlines again, why?
That country is not alone, but has seen millions of abortions, of females.
It like one child China, in India's case for cultural reasons, has promoted many more males than females.
A cultural time bomb.
Hence growing hatred for women by men who never will find a bride.
Can the left sustain the thought that defending minority's is worthy but females not?

Belly,
I can tell you why the likes of david f and paul do not like to acknowledge alien practices like forced marriage or FGM. They are so taken with the ideology of multiculturalism that they refuse to see any problems that exist. They go straight into denial and attack the person pointing out a problem. They use terms like racist and xenophobic or islamophobe for anyone that dares to point out problems.

Notice in their last posts they have at last acknowledged that some alien cultural practices are bad, but they accept that as collateral damage. The overiding ideology is more important to them. I asked the previous NSW government health minister why there had been no prosecutions relating to FGM and she replied that there were 'cultural considerations'. So you see culture and ideology comes well before consideration of pain and suffering of little girls. That is the way they think. Obviously david is far more concerned with his access to exotic foods and theatre to be critical of any aspect of MC.

At last there is to be a couple of court cases coming up relating to FGM and I will follow them closely, as they will be firsts. I support the ongoing education of 'at risk' groups that practice FGM and forced marriage but believe it needs to be supported by strong law enforcement.

People need to be made aware of problems associated with cultural practice. Only then can the matters be dealt with.

And this is a good point to interject with a riddle.

Q: What do they call a good looking Arab?

Banjo wrote: “I can tell you why the likes of david f and paul do not like to acknowledge alien practices like forced marriage or FGM. They are so taken with the ideology of multiculturalism that they refuse to see any problems that exist. They go straight into denial and attack the person pointing out a problem. They use terms like racist and xenophobic or islamophobe for anyone that dares to point out problems.

Notice in their last posts they have at last acknowledged that some alien cultural practices are bad, but they accept that as collateral damage. The overiding ideology is more important to them. I asked the previous NSW government health minister why there had been no prosecutions relating to FGM and she replied that there were 'cultural considerations'.

Dear Banjo,

The above is more justification for your xenophobia. If I had been the health minister of NSW I would have prosecuted instances of FGM.
However, you don’t just point that out as a problem.

It is reasonable to be against some practices. However, you seem to be against anything foreign. You also wrote:

“The only way to deal with alien cultural practice is to recognise them and insist they have no place here. All immigrants are informed about our society before coming here, so ignorance is no excuse.

To ignor alien cultural practices is to compromise our own culture.

Policy of integration will promote cohesiveness in the community.”
From the above it is clear that you regard all alien practices as bad. Those are the statements of a xenophobe. I do not accept the practices of forced marriage and female genital mutilation. However, I am not against all alien practices. You apparently are, and that is the attitude of a xenophobe.

Our culture is changing. We should be able to accept alien ideas, practices and attitudes depending on what they are. To reject ideas, practices and attitudes simply because they are alien is xenophobic.

Dear onthebeach,

You asked: “When was that policy [multiculturalism] ever put to a popular vote?”

Never. Australia is neither a direct nor representative democracy. The prime minister can put the country into war without a vote of parliament. If Australia were a representative democracy parliamentary approval would be necessary. If Australia were a direct democracy popular approval would be necessary. Australia is neither.

You asked: “What is the impact of immigration on our population and quality of life?”

On population it's a matter of numbers. The impact on quality of life is bad if the population increase is too great. More infrastructure is needed. Costs for almost anything go up. There is more urban sprawl, increasing pollution and destroying farmland. There is a greater carbon footprint. Species destruction accelerates with loss of habitat. New immigrants may undercut existing employment arrangements and destroy the protections for workers that unions have fought for.

I favour immigration limited to the number of people leaving Australia.

You asked: “Why do we need a higher population, and if there is a consensus a higher population is needed, what is the optimal growth per annum to avoid social problems and what is the optimal population of Australia?”

I don’t think we need a higher population. Real estate interests, Kevin Rudd and others who choose to ignore the fact that Australia is largely semi-arid with a supply of fresh water about 3% of what is available in the US which has a similar area. Possibly Australia is overpopulated now. An optimum population size depends on what people want for a life style. My guess is about 15,000,000. However, the question is unanswerable without defining the life style for that population.

Your questions have nothing to do with the thread, but it is a matter I am interested in. I belong to the Stable Population Association which is promoting a stable population. SPA recognises that if we settled on an optimum population size it would probably be politically impossible to achieve. Therefore we advocate that it should not increase.

www.PopulationParty.org.au is the address of the Stable Population Party.

David, where have you been all these years?

Haven't you noticed we have spent a few hundred years sorting out what we admire, & incorporating it into our culture. Most of us are quite happy with our culture, & have no desire to incorporate "alien practices" into it. We most certainly are not prepared to make changes to ours to accommodate anyone else's culture

A wider choice of restaurants is pretty poor compensation for a viciousness that has come into our culture with this incorporation of these alien practices. Have you not noticed the growth of knifing, & glassing since the introduction of some of the more recently introduced rubbish. This type of activity was never seen anywhere in Oz 40 years ago. Its introduction I find hard to see as an improvement.

Our culture is changing you say, but mate that is our problem. None of the changes are desirable, except to people with a bored palate. They may be interesting to the inner city chattering classes, & academia, isolated from the worst aspects of these changes, & more interested in what some foreign academic thinks of them, that those who pay their salaries. To the majority they are simply an unnecessary expense, & an addition to the waiting time for hospital treatment

Dear Hasbeen,

Knifings, glassings and other instances of horrible behaviour seem to be increasing. At least they get reported more frequently in the papers. As far as I know most of it is done by our own homegrown yobbos.

Possibly some of it would be eliminated by not having any professional sport and not subsidising football clubs and other haunts of hoodlums.

Judging only by your stated views Banjo, you are a little right of right.
And we know I am ALP forever, with joy after Gillard.
You myself and by far the majority of our country men and women, think much alike on this subject.
It is not racist to be appalled at the treatment of Muslim women here and at home.
To actually be shaken, by the increasing rapes in India, to know, as I think I do, driven by the dowry costs, that drives female Abortions there and in neighboring country's, it will get worse.
A blind loyalty to the now dead, multiculturalism.
Post war migration worked,European migration has.
But inflicting a lie,multiculturalism is a lie, by both sides of politics on us.
Then branding MAINSTREAM Australians racist, for HATEING the pain even deaths on young girls, in the name of a God that I can find nothing to say he called for it.
But every reason to believe both the covering up, FGM, and other practices are to give men power over women.
The left is without morals.
And with out reason to exist.

david f, "As far as I know most of it is done by our own homegrown yobbos"

You must live in a bubble not to be aware of the ethnic drive-by shootings and the strong arm takeover of OMGs by the same criminals.

Belly,
It may surprize you but I think myself as being middle road, I have even voted Labor in the past, not always and certainly not this time round. You know my feelings about the present mob and I will judge the next government on their merrits and performance.

The ideology and philosophy of MC was a mistake by both major parties and i hope you are correct in that it is extinct. We can do without government promoted differences. Our culture will change by the people acceptance of things they like.

When I refer to alien cultural practices, I mean repugnant matters, not just because they are new or foreign. forced marriage and FGM are glaring examples here. There are many alien practices in many cultures that I will fight to prevent introduction of here. Like in a brawl between two Sri Lankan mobs in Sydney resulting in a home invasion where acid was poured over a bloke. Acid attacks are a feature in some Asian places and we should note it not tolerate any more of it. Repugnant. The courts should be particularly tough on that.

Again MC in action, but culture is no excuse.

Dear onthebeach,

I don't live in a bubble. Hasbeen brought up glassing and knifing. That comes mainly from the barroom scene which is part of the regular Aussie culture of getting pissed and unreasonably argumentative. Alcohol has little place in Islamic culture. Alcohol also fuels a lot of domestic abuse.

David the carrying of knives had been introduced by importation with the new cultures you so like.

When I was a boy, & well after that, arguments were settled with fists among those inclined to physical settlement of such things. Those involved would often end up drinking together.

Any Ozzie bloke who pulled a knife in an argument would have been beaten with in an inch of his life, & that would have been by his friends, to "educate" him in gentlemanly behavior. All "men" shunned such a coward’s weapon as a knife. Glassing is an extension of this use of weapons, which would have been abhorrent to Ozzie men just a generation ago.

As I don't like WOG food, I can see nothing that has been of value come into our culture with any of the more recent migration.

Dear Hasbeen,

I am an immigrant to Australia - one of those people you apparently are excited about. I am from the United States and am English speaking. However, I am nonetheless an immigrant.

I generally don't use such terms as wogs. I find such words offensive. I hear my homeland denigrated in Australia, and I don't like it. I am unhappy with chaplains in the schools and subsidising private schools. That is against the law in the US. I am trying to do what I can do democratically to change the law so those things are illegal here. That is my right as an Australian citizen. There are some things I don't like about my homeland, but separation of church and state is something I like.

However, I like to try new things like foods of another culture. Bangers and mash are from another culture. So are meat pies. I like both. I eat apple pie with a fork rather than a spoon. An Australian friend asked me how I scoop up custard if I don't use a spoon. Until she served apple pie with custard I never heard of such a thing. However, I tried it, and it tasted good.

Although I think footy is a silly thing to get excited about I like many things about this new culture in Australia. I don't appreciate the bar scene and have only been in them if I have to urinate and there is no other place near by. That separates me from the Aussie culture in that way. Sobeit.

You, of course, have a right to reject the food and other aspects of a difficult culture. Nobody is forcing it on you. I think you are missing out on something good, but that is your business.

First, can the leftist PC followers here note.
The thread refers to a court case, charges have been laid.
Is that bigoted anti migration support, mentioning that.
As Banjo admits his sin,once votering for my side, can I tell a truth?
I always am the first, in real life to welcome and try to build bridges with any Muslim I come in contact with.
A truth here, it must be from within that comunity, not out side, that change comes.
And it will not, EVER , come from a belief we are the enemy's of their God, in our country.
It will not come if generation after generation of these people inflict forced marriage and FGM on each female generation.
To stop, it is true,women enjoying sex.
As strange as it sounds, Muslim Migration to the west is social engineering.
Both an attempt to breed understanding in both sides.
And a betrayal of the very idea all can live together while in our country we are the ones asked to change.
And the truth, we would be killed for doing that in the country,s they came from.
Why do some come?
If we are so bad they want to turn our country in to one like the one they left?

Dear all,

I'm sorry to be the one who has to tell you this but multiculturalism is here to stay so everyone is just going to have to adapt to living in large scale societies marked by social inequalities reckoned along lines of race and ethnicity.

The multicultural city (eg Sydney) mirrors the multicultural nation which in turn mirrors the multicultural (globalised) world we live in today. At the moment there are overt congereis of different practices which seem hard to assimilate. But don't worry Belly et al one day you might learn to like someone arranging a marriage between you and someone like Elle McPherson or last year's Miss World winner. Multiculturalism could have its upside!

Dear Belly,

You wrote: "If we are so bad they want to turn our country in to one like the one they left?"

Apparently you have bought into the fear and hate. If they were satisfied with the country they left why would they have left it? There is no reason to think they want to turn this country into a country like the one they left. If they were satisfied with the country they left they would not have left it.

You also wrote: "Both an attempt to breed understanding in both sides.
And a betrayal of the very idea all can live together while in our country we are the ones asked to change."

Please tell me one way in which you have been asked to change.

You are buying into crap.

Dear david f,

I didn't know you could read Belly. I'm still waiting for English subtitles.

david f,
Seeing you are from the USA, you may be interested in the article of this link, below.

It is typical of growing concern about alien cultural practices being introduced into Western countries. Similar reports keep coming from UK and Europe and, I think, Canada as well. Australia is no exception to the growing incidence of alien cultural practice.

http://frontpagemag.com/2013/dgreenfield/200000-girls-in-us-at-risk-of-female-genital-mutilation/

Dear Banjo,

Let's get serious and see how much you really know.

Who conducts FGM and why is it done?

You have 5 minutes to respond if you know the answer.

Dear Banjo,

I already made it clear that I was against FGM. I would like to see it abolished all over the world.

People do come in to other countries and do not respect local customs. They even kill off large numbers of the original inhabitants as the English did in Australia and others have in many places at many times. The English even adopted the doctrine of Terra Nullius and declared the land empty which gave the inhabitants no rights to their land. They put other Aborigines in missions and foisted their nonsense religion on them. Multiculturalism is a tremendous improvement on that. However, the alien cultural practices of the English were not all bad. They have great literature, art, science, mathematics, engineering etc. (Ignore the cooking.) What bothers me about you is that you so easily slide in condemning all alien cultural practices. If you just condemned FGM I would be in total agreement with you. However, you condemn alien cultural practices as such. That makes you a xenophobe.

However, I have played a part in uniting Muslims and Christians. One thing that unites people is finding a common enemy. I have attended a couple of atheist conventions in Melbourne. We were picketed by both Muslims and Christians. There was a casino next door to the convention centre, but neither Muslims nor Christians were picketing that. They were more interested in getting after us non-sinners who didn't buy either mumbojumbo or any other kind of mumbojumbo for that matter.

Time's up Banjo! You can stop looking around for someone who can tell you the answer.

Dear Banjo,

I hate giving answers away but let me give you a clue.

Think, FGM for women by women.

There you go, I've gone and done it again!

Dear Banjo,

You have expressed concern with alien cultural values. Would FGM be any more acceptable if it were not an alien cultural value?

Drink driving is a practice that many Australians engage in. It is not an alien cultural value. Is it any more acceptable because it practiced by many Australians, and other Australians aren't bothered by it?

Being an alien practice does not make that practice either good or bad.

david f,
One of the meanings of the word alien is repugnat, so it does not necesary have to be foreign.

Yes I consider drink driving alien and also the binge drinking that seems to affect our young of both sex's.

We have enough bad habits and practices of our own without importing still more.

Would you like to see honour killings, child brides, incest and pedophillia become part of our culture, like it is in some countries.

What about dowry deaths, kerosene burning or acid attacks?

What about some culinary delights like dog meat, spiders, maggots and human placenta? would you like to add all these cultural practices to the ones we already turn a blind eye to in Aus.

Not all introduced or foreign practices are bad, but there are many that are. We have to be aware they exist and prevent them.

Simply making them unlawfull is not enough as we have seen with polygamy, FGM and forced marriage. The laws have to be enforced!

Dear Banjo,

One of the meanings of alien is indeed repugnant. If you had used word, repugnant, there would be no misunderstanding. The primary meaning of alien is simply foreign. I, for one, do not find something repugnant merely because it is foreign. Do you?

I agree with you that merely making something unlawful without enforcing such laws is pointless.

You wrote: "What about some culinary delights like dog meat, spiders, maggots and human placenta? would you like to add all these cultural practices to the ones we already turn a blind eye to in Aus."

Yes, I would turn a blind eye to them. They are repugnant to me, but I see no reason to prevent others from eating that stuff if they want to. How would it hurt you if other people ate those things?

Dear Banjo,

You brought up the subject of eating certain foods that are repugnant to you. Those you mention are also repugnant to me. One of them was dog meat which I would not want to eat. In the US I worked with someone whose father was an American Indian who liked dog meat. On an occasional Sunday her mother would cook some dog meat as a special treat for her father. what harm was done except to the dog?

We had what was called the 'Great Experiment' in the US called Prohibition where the government banned liquor. It was horrible. As long as people don't drive or operate hazardous machinery while they are under the influence it should be their own business. What people eat, wear, believe or think should be no business of the government as long as they do not try to force it on other people.

I am pretty circumspect in my habits. I have not had an alcoholic drink this year, have never taken non-prescription drugs, rarely eat meat and don't gamble. However, I am for legalising drugs and prostitution, eliminating laws against blasphemy and eliminating all penalties on acts which do not hurt others.

As the great philosophy Jimmy Durante said, "Why doesn't everybody leave everybody else alone?"

FGM forced by older women on screaming and afraid children is not morally sustainable Mr opinion.
Saying it is done because of religion, not the truth a cultural thing to suppress women is too.
Using a thread about the forced marriage of a woman in our country is far from the once caring left of center.
Human Rights only for some? only for men?
Are we divided on the rights of women depending on what country they live in.
Must the left confront the right on every issue regardless of the right side of an issue.

Belly said;

“Using a thread about the forced marriage of a woman in our country is far from the once caring left of center.”

This is completely indicative of the bigoted, poison spreading, right-wing in this country. The thread was about the forced marriage of a MAN in our country and anyone who took the time to read the link in the original post would have known that.

But instead they leap on constructed stereotypes to bang out their message with total disregard for evidence, truth or balance.

Again, the victim here was a man and probably not Muslim. But why let that get in the way of a good hate session?

If there was no hate csteele you will make it up.
Lies are just as deadly in the middle east as ak47s.

There are forced marriages occurring in Australia. However, this is hardly likely to spread into the wider community. Indeed. women from this background are taking a stand against this practice. Within the next generation or so, hopefully it will be an anachronism.

These two sites provide an excellent overview of the situation.

Four Corners – Forced Marriages
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MP-SYo4U4bE

SBS
http://www.sbs.com.au/insight/episode/overview/457/Arranged-Marriage

Years ago at university I raised the issue of FGM at a feminist meeting, but was howled down as being insensitive to cultural mores.
Horse feathers! FGM can result in death or disabling conditions which leave women (and their unborn) at further risk during pregnancy and childbirth; quite part from denying them their rights as sexual beings. The British banned the practice of Suttee. Whilst the latter ensured death, the former practice certainly laid the card of death on the table. PC ideologies have no place when addressing morbid practices.

As with forced marriages, I am confident that these women will also take a stand against such practices. Our culture is more likely to influence these women, rather than seeing their traditional practices seep into our way of life