Elders are Live Animal Exporters.

Elders first commenced business in 1837 buying and selling sheep and cattle.

In 1937 they brought a ship load of cattle over from Bombay to Rush cutters Bay Sydney.

They had to swim the cattle across in those days.

They stampered and ended up in an area still known to this day as the Cow paddocks.

They also imported sheep from Africa around the same time and to this day nobody ever knew for sure which load carried the foot and mouth disease.

There were very strick rules brought to order as soon as this was discovered.
So strick in fact if a man was caught killing a beast to eat the penalty was death by hanging.
The old abattoir workers as the years went by started to become very concerned about ships going out of Australia with live Animals onboard.
In those days to be honest they were not so much concerned about animal welfare but their lively- hoods.

Mr Jim Dyer who now resides on the Gold coast and some of his fellow abattoir owners made an appointment to see the Prime Minister back then but not in Australia- New Zealand.

He told the Prime Minister of New Zealand that any country that allowed live exports to get out of control would do so at the destruction of the small farmers.

Mr Dyer ended up travelling to the ME and came back determined to export meat not live animals.

He purchased a ship and they used to pump the Bryan around the deck.

From their he started to export the skins and although an elderly gentleman still to this day exports skins to China.

He has returned home from seeing a shipment of animals[ cattle I think] that was an Elders operation.

That was the first time in his life he had ever thought about protesting about Animal cruelty.

He helped write this message to Elders and asks everybody to read it.

http://www.halakindmeats.com/elders.html

There are proud adds of insurance , Real Estate and even banks - but none of Live Exports.

This is a difficult task for groups such as yourselves - people are so desensitised to issues like this. Adults, let alone kids, think milk comes from plastic cartons and cuts of meat in plastic packets.

Do you really think they are going to do anything about the plight of real live animals on a ship?

I must say your post was a bit hard to understand - seemed somewhat fragmented - but I guess it is because of the pent-up passion and frustration for your cause.

I can only hope you are able to spread the word, but methinks you will be better off trying to change the attitudes of Elders themselves with the backing of the relevant government department - both here and overseas. A task more difficult I suspect given our government's attitude to jobs and the economy - Mr Howard certainly seems to have difficulty in seeing the big picture, or having a vision of what's right.

Davsav

Point Taken.

I apoligise. I guess its frustration.

Not so much with even Elders but these so called Animal Welfare Groups that have raised millions of dollars from the public over many years.

Its just unthinkable that people dont know Elders not only for their banks and real Estate Agents, Insurance but Live Animal Exports.

Sure I know its often hard to get things out through the media given the conflict of interest that involved but still.

The public have a right to know who`s involved in what.

Your also correct about trying to work in with Elders.

I have written to them over a period of the last four years but so far no luck. Although the chairman of elders has contacted me by phone over the last few weeks.

I have also written to the AWB with the same proposal and the interesting part is that they sent it to Elders to reply.

Yes it certainly would be easier however we now simply have to compete on the market.

All every farmer needs to start doing is speaking direct to the buyers overseas.

Of course the buyers overseas will be interested to gain more control and give the middle men the flick once they are comfortable that they have their own accredited Halal Men placed in Australia.

So as it was put to Elders in the first letter please get onboard or miss the ship.


Eventually the Government will be forced to deal with one Muslim group who are known trusted and very open to the public.

As for John Howard I guess hes had the Nationals to deal with as well. Not that I am making excuses for him.

I think hes smart enough to make these changes to faze out this cruelty but lacks the support and votes.

By the way you can call us a group but we really are just people against live animal exports and intensive farming.
We support good Farmers NOT oppose people eating selling or growing meat.
We ride horses own farms drink Bundy and care little for political grandstanding.

Their is only one party that has what it takes to stand up to these people, and that is

THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLES PARTY.

check out the animal welfare policy at

www.tapp.org.au

Tapp
Its good to know another Party is taking the lack of action to protect our most innocent.

Tell me would your members be prepaired to put on BBQs in regional areas to intoruce co joint ventures direct to farmers?

We would of course arrange assistance with some funding and arrange overseas guest speakers.

There is no requirement to totally understand the meat industry or farming for that matter.

Just a will to really help Aussie farmers and improve Animal Welfare at the same time.

We will organise Reps to attend along with the Members.

We prefer doing a round trip of country and regional areas and hold all the meetings at hotels with some country and Western.

While our guests mostly do not drink they have no problem sipping on a juice and really enjoy meeting farmers and familys enjoying their normal activitys.

Of course we would all be most interested in invitations to see their farms, stations or meat plants.

Domestic plants are of particular interest with a view to add infustructure at no costs to the owners.

There is much interest also in vegatable farms and cosmetics[ non Animal Tested as well.

Its always good to have more people interested to turn Australia round to Exporting are products in their most vaulable form by vaule adding.

We would arrange all Halal meals forour guests. Your members should gain a great deal of knowledge by acting as Tour guides.

I think you will find it most rewarding and enjoyable.
please See>

http://www.halakindmeats.com

At the bar b q tapps going to run for you will it be little yabbie from your other thread we roast?
Rather like a lamb chop, elders are a sponsor of this site ,thanks blokes well done and best regards.
Tapp can you justify your ads on this site?
True mate is it a fair thing?
Bit bored with the whole idea a forum can be used this way.
Australian farmers are not running animal concentration camps.
In relation to exports of live animals ,yes make it better but stay realistic it will continue or you condemn farmers to go hungry.

Tap

Thanks for adding the PALE RSPCA QLD Link.

Greens, Democrats, One nation, Tap, several independents, all saying the same thing.
Stop Exporting Animals Alive from Australia, - Pluss millions of public.
Aren’t they arrogant to ignore the public and recommendations from Several Senate enquires. All the findings were to 'Ban Live animal Exports" without delay

Possibly along with most other Australians didn’t know Elders are considered the biggest live Animal exporters.

As Belly pointed out they do a lot of advertsing. Mind You they haven’t advertised that as much as their others interests.
Thanks Belly but Elders are big boys. I am sure they would expect any “ Special Treatment “To suggest so might be offensive to them.
Don’t you think? Elders Advertsie. Iadvertise- Like When We sent the Strippers to the AWB Enquiry. thatswhy its called a democracy belly.

I would encourage Elders to read the Yabby Forum it may later disclose some matters of interest to them.

Elders are rather unique in regards to their Insurance Agents as well.

I find the recruitments for commercial Insurance client’s `particularly interesting`.

We probably have more in common than they know because I don’t mind a bit of the old school myself.

Belly we are not Animal Libbers or Against Farmers. We are looking to open more Abattoirs in Australia to give more competition for better prices to farmers.

Happy to work with or with out Elders. They think the old Boys Club will never change but lets all be realistic, everything changes in time.
As for how Yabby Chooses to go that may Or maybe not be up To Him.
After All its only a story. You know pretend. Sort of Like all you people who use pretend names all over the forums.
At least Elders and ourselves let the people know Who, Or should I say Whom We are.
So There you go we have more than one thing in Common already.
Could be the start of a whole new realshonship.
Always nice To base things on Honesty.
Dont you Think?

http://www.livexports.com/cowgun.html

To Pale thanks for that will do when we get fully going

To Belly if you had noticed Pale is about Animal Welfare and i rightly pointed out that THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLES PARTY does have an Animal welfare policy and people can find that policy at
www.tapp.org.au

To say something does not always take a page but to say this party has policy and not just talk and spin.

Also about candidates and members wanted well it is up to the people and they at least know we are here and not going away, and it is ordinary people that make this country grow so why have those who have be told what to do
what to say
how to do it
but real people

so belly if you have a say about any subject that this party has a policy for i will inform the people that we have the policy and where to find it.

And people dont need to be worried about expulsion for saying the truth, or what they really do think

Belly

Thats a bit beneath the belly even for you.
The blokes harmless. He made it clear hes not registered.
Elders wouldnt stoop that low.
Now glad you mentioned those Lamb Adds.
Who do you think pays for them? How much of the public funding goes in them?
Bet you two Bob and a shilling on the side you dont know.
There has always been 50 50 funding together with the industry. Call it grants. Call it Uni progects. Call it research but if you look you will find it.
I say its a bit much using lamb considering the price has gone through the roof. Thats due to a lack of supply after filling live exports.
Dont say its due to the drought. Drought causes a glut- which should ensure plenty of domestic supply at very competative prices.

If Rodger Fletcher can make a killing out of lamb so can others.

Tapp Just to mention that wasn’t your party I was referring to " taking the Lack of Action'

I was refering to the fact I put the co joint proposal re a policy to phase out live exports to the opposition ages ago but as usual no action.
Bernie Cavern OConners adviser said he thought it was a ‘great idea” for a policy.
They kept us waiting almost two years for the meeting.

Mind You he was probably waiting for Jake Lake Kym`s advisor, but there ‘was nobody home ‘

I can recall some of the Libbers saying how helpful Jack was. Umm yes but helpful to whom? Certainly not the animals or for jobs for Australian Regional Areas.
I was told by somebody in the know the meat Unions were told to back off Live Exports.
I don’t know why the opposition never called themselves The No action party".
Or The All Talk Party,.
The Party of missed oportunity’s
The Behind You’re Back Party.
It would made more Sense To me.

I mean they cant even come up with a policy when its handed to them from paddock to plate.



`

People against every thing until I came along your thread was nearly an empty room talking to yourself mostly it still is.
Have you any ideas how we can sell more meat to people who must not buy it under religious belief?
Are you aware costs is the factor that sells our sheep in the middle east?
Or of the impact of no refrigeration in such places?
No live exports just means another country will take our market.
You are at least aware of that?
Australians just maybe are growing further away from just cases because of people like you.
To claim the high moral ground on issues without basic understanding is counter productive.
So very much that needs true protection is without support because the wrong slant is put on issues by the wrong people.
Better more caring transport is the issue nothing else.

Belly

I thank you.
You say>
"Have you any ideas how we can sell more meat to people who must not buy it under religious belief?"

[Answer].
I beleive we can get you a better price for your meat.
, You Ask>
"Are you aware costs is the factor that sells our sheep in the middle east?"
Amswer> Yes!
Through Tarrifs that were set up years ago. Also the trade dollar kickbacks which have all been played well over the heads of the trusting ordinary honest farmer.
Your Question.
"Or of the impact of no refrigeration in such places?"> Answer Rubbish. Thats A myth.
Your Question
"No live exports just means another country will take our market?".


Answer Read this>

24 February 2006
Australian Muslims Are Against Animal Cruelty

The President of the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, Dr. Ameer Ali
today called on the Australian media not to act irresponsible in misinforming the
Australian public about the real reasons for live exports.

Dr. Ameer Ali said that Muslims are primarily concerned to ensure that the animal is slaughtered in accordance with the Islamic Shariah, and that can be done in Australia under the Australian Government supervised Muslim Slaughter Program (AGSMS) and we want the Australian public to know that we do not agree to animal cruelty.

He further said that Muslims in the Middle Eastern countries readily accept
Frozen and chilled lamb and mutton from Australia, once it is Halal certified
under the program. Last year Australian lamb meat exports to the Middle East was up 36% to a record of 14,052 tonnes, and Australian mutton meat export to the Middle East was up 24% in the same period to 36,051 Tonnes (ref. Farmonline News 1 Feb 2006). This represents the equivalent of more than 2 million sheep which were slaughtered in Australia for Middle Eastern Muslim customers.

Dr. Ali said that the Australian Muslims does not support the cruel treatment of animals prior to slaughter, that has been documented in Egypt as the Qur`an dictates that animals should be treated with kindness.

Continued Bellys Answers
. You Say>
"Australians just maybe are growing further away from just cases because of people like you."
Answer>
I am very concerned about Australians turning away from the live Export or Animal Welfare.
Thats is Why after many years we have decided to go public. To point out we are Not Animal Libbers and we DO eat Meat.

I was horrified seeing the Libbers protesting about people eating meat.
Rolling around half naked with pretend blood on them.

That type of thing turns the public off.
It gives industry Like Elders and Government amo to feed the media that ALL groups are extreme.

It plays into the hands of the industry. I cant believe others dont know that.
I suspect many animal groups are being used politically but have not worked that out.
We are not libbers and we will not be told we cant have a say when we represent the 96 percent of Australians that eat meat but want to know its humane from paddock to plate. We are the black,Sheep Of Animal Welfare groups andYes we are hated by the others. We wont be bullied.

You Say
'To claim the high moral ground on issues without basic understanding is counter productive."
Answer>
No the Libbers walk the higher Moral Ground- We are just saying eat meat but be humane. We are the only non veg vegan group in Australia other than RSPCA. The others are all veggies mostly.
We are saying to Animals Australia and all the other groups who are controlled under their umbrella - Help Us to reopen plants if you SERIOUS about Stopping live Exports. We are saying Ok you say replace it with Carcuss, however you refuse to work with the only alternative to do just that??
You Say>
Better more caring transport is the issue nothing else.
Answer > WE support the RSPCA Policy On Animal Transport.
Animals should be transported as close as possibly from its origan to abattoirs.
We hope to assist RSPCA to making that possibly by opening many more plants or abattoirs within Australia

paleif,
"Animals should be transported as close as possibly from its origan to abattoirs"

Surely these animals appreciate the opportunity to travel far and wide. A free overseas cruise with on-board vetenary services, all meals supplied with the sea air to boot. Interaction with foreign culture, possibly a ride on a motorbike through a city taking in the sights. And if they didn't like the trip, well they don't have to worry about repeating the journey as it is one-way.

Or they can get in a truck to the local Halal abbatoir(coming soon to a town near you) and have their throat slit there . Not much of a life experience , but same outcome.

Here Is Some Great Work Done by Animals Australia. Men and Women Of Australia I call Upon You To read It.

http://www.liveexport-indefensible.com/news/020307.htm

Much more than the economy at stake
Originally Printed in The Age (Melbourne) and Sydney Morning Herald 2nd March 2007
By Mirko Bagaric and Lyn White

Read this article at the Age online
IT IS possible to make a strong economic argument as to why Australia should not export live animals for slaughter to the Middle East. Animal welfare groups are now getting far more commercially savvy and adept at taking on industry groups in their own terminology and framing their submissions in terms of Australian jobs and market imperatives.

But this time their analysis is largely wasted. Some forms of barbarity are so depraved that they are beyond economic salvation.

It demeans the human condition to even suggest that certain forms of cruelty can be condoned. Such is the case with live animal exports from Australia.

For years Australia's live export industry was happy to provide cattle to Cairo's main abattoir despite knowing that cattle routinely had their leg tendons slashed and eyes stabbed to disable them prior to slaughter. The fear and pain inflicted on animals in this process exceeds the human capacity to describe it.

Animals hurt in the same way as humans. There are not different types of suffering, only different degrees and intensities. The physiological process by which pain is generated and felt is the same in humans and animals.

The intensity with which animals feel pain or distress is no less than in humans. Anyone who has seen the cowering of a dog in response to a raised angry hand can be left in no doubt of that.

The fact that an entity can experience suffering terminates all questions regarding its moral standing. The only commonality shared by humans, who command our concern and respect, is that they can hurt. The capacity to sense pain gives humans, no matter how marginalised, pitiably deranged or behaviourally maladaptive, moral status. Animals command our moral standing for exactly the same reason.

Animals Australia Article contiuned

The inability of animals to use words to communicate to us about their level of suffering is no excuse for ignoring their terrified screams. To the contrary, this places a higher burden on supposedly morally enlightened communities to hear their screams and redress them.

This is what the Australian Government did when the revelations of the tendon slashing and eye stabbing in Egypt were aired on national television in February last year. The Government suspended live animal exports. However, this was lifted following the signing of a memorandum of understanding between Agriculture Minister Peter McGauran and his Egyptian counterpart.

The MOU contains basic requirements for the treatment of animals, in accordance with World Organisation for Animal Health standards. At the time, Animals Australia, which first exposed the mistreatment, informed McGauran that due to the amount of on-selling of Australian animals, and Egypt's lack of animal protection laws, the Egyptian Government had neither the capacity nor desire to enforce the standards. The MOU was simply a token, formal method for circumventing our most basic of moral responsibilities.

Despite this, the boatloads of animal misery and human barbarity recommenced on October 11, when a shipment of Australian sheep left Portland for Egypt.

Animal Australia investigators in Cairo in late December predictably observed egregious breaches of the MOU. Australian sheep were sold by merchants from seven different locations in Cairo. Individuals were buying sheep to take home to sacrifice on the morning of a festival. In the process, sheep were thrown from trucks, dragged on their stomachs, tied up and transported on car roof racks and jammed into car boots for journeys of up to two hours.

To The Honourable the President and Members of the Senate in Parliament assembled:

The Petition of the undersigned protests in the strongest possible terms against the live-export of Australian animals.

During transportation the animals are subjected to inhumane conditions resulting in unacceptably high death rates and suffering. Upon arrival, they suffer extreme cruelty and barbarism prior to and during slaughter - practices that are illegal in Australia.

Your petitioners call upon the members of the Senate to immediately, and without delay, ban the live export of Australian livestock.

(NOTE: Signatures on this petition appear the day after signing to prevent defacing of the document by spammers.
This is the second round of the petition. Signatures from the first round were archived December 15, 2003, and can be viewed here.)
Signatures from this round are loading, below.

Date Name Country Comments
2007-04-08 Sophie MacGillivray Australia
2007-04-08 julia deasley western australia Surely it must be possible to set up slaughter houses in Australia, where the slaughter of animals can be controlled by our laws, but undertaken by the religious groups in question. That way all interests are served.
2007-04-03 Catherine Pauly France
2007-04-03 Eddie Knipe England Putting it bluntly - pretty sad state of affairs.
2007-04-01 Sharleen Williams Australia It is disgusting
2007-04-01 Deirdre Williams Australia IT IS A DISGRACE
2007-04-01 Barb Daviduk canada help us help those that do not speak whether animal or child
2007-04-01 Lisa Stapleton australia
2007-03-31 wong thao usa the animals did nothing wrong to deserve punishment they should stop this at once
2007-03-31 Tommy LY Australia
2007-03-30 Dianne Laing United States This trade is heartless and cruel; please end this inhumane treatment towards animals.
2007-03-29 melony arslan united kingdom
2007-03-29 Sue Drake-Brockman Australia
2007-03-27 Britney Hungar

2007-03-27 Jen Australia Please, please, please end this practice. I used to holiday in the town where the animals are exported from - but now I find it hard to visit now I know the fate of the ships often seen in the harbour. It makes me feel sick. I love Australia and our society, but this issue is just a black mark on our country.

2007-03-23 Justin Stevens US I am studying environmental science and intensive farming is hurting the world

2007-03-22 hollie kunica england CRUEL

2007-03-21 karly weisbord australia This makes me sick going to throw up this is so inhumane.They actually skin the animals and open them up wen they r still alive they break there necks and fracture there skulls and (curse) society and whoever condoned this as acceptable behaviour~

2007-03-21 Lindsay Rich United States ITS WRONG!

2007-03-21 Debbie Barnes Australia

2007-03-19 Ghazala Anwar New Zealand Please ban the inhumane practice of live (and slaughtered) animal export. We as a human race need to leave behind the practice of animal exploitation and opression in all its forms. How we treat animals is an indication of how we are willing to treat other human.

2007-03-18 katrina hunt australia

2007-03-15 Ashleigh Grigsby USA 2007-03-14 Kim Donnelly Australia
2007-03-12 Boni Japan

2007-03-07 Sanja Djorem Slovenija Be human, be moral,Stop!

2007-03-06 Mell Cook Australia Think about how YOU would feel if these terrible things were being done to YOU

2007-03-06 Tibor Breznan Canada
2007-03-02 Robert Brown United States
2007-03-01 George Jackson U.K This Practise is cruel
2007-02-24 Sandy Slatter-Raguse Australia This is such a cruel thing to be happening and needs to be stopped now.

2007-02-23 flora chapron france

2007-02-23 Tracey Moore tasmania im doing a project on the tasmanian feedlot. AND I WANT TO ALL TO STOP RIGHT NOW. its just not on. its worng. I hate the thought of it. its just. bad

2007-02-22 Sam Kahlert Australia

2007-02-22 Christy Llewellyn Australia Live export must stop NOW.
2007-02-22 Rebecca U.S. thats really wrong dont they have any better things to do then kill animals cold hartless bas*ard

Elders Live Animal Exporters.

The following messages are for you

2007-02-21 Romi Rivera United States Subjecting any animal to forms of abuse, which this most definitely would be considered a form of abuse, is cruel and inhumane. If we as humans are able to lend a hand against such unjust ways towards creatures, which we share this world with, even if it is as simple as signing a petition, let us come together and create the world in which we live! Spread the word, spread awareness! ~

2007-02-21 Sunshine USA I am against anything that is against animals.Animals are a big part of me.I dont like when they are disrespected.

2007-02-20 Stuart Ulrich Australia For australia for the economy not for self interest

2007-02-20 Andrea Hudson Australia (enter comments here)I am utterly appauled and disgusted that the Australian Government still allows this horrific cruelty to be inflicted upon any animal. Peter Dutton should be ashamed of himself. We went to him pleading, to have live animal export banned - he just laughed and said that he has seen cruelty being a policeman and that nothing will be done about banning it.

2007-02-19 Ann de Jersey Australia Allowing these terrible acts of cruelty to animals is as the same as allowing Hitler to run extermination camps.

2007-02-19 will goodfellow australia

2007-02-15 brittany wallace united states this world is so crule to animals and we ned to put a sop to it

2007-02-15 natalie canada pleeeeeeeeeeease stop

2007-02-15 Nadine Robbert Lang Lang, VIC, Aus


2007-02-09 jessica eldridge austraila

2007-02-08 jodie australia i think that live exports are completly inhumane and unesersary, all this could b changed. animals are like us they have feelings and a heart and they alsofeel stravation and de-highration please take this into consideration these animals do not deserve to b treated like this


2007-02-08 pauline mendoza australia (Please make me feel proud to be Australian, not ashamed)

2007-02-07 Andrea Van Rullen Australia


2007-02-07 Crystal Foster Wichita, KS, USA STOP

2007-02-05 Ted Borden USA This is an important matter that needs to be addressed by the Australian Government

REBECCA NORTON AUSTRALIA There is no need for this cycle of death to continue.


Barbaric custom for the sake of profit. Such cruelty and prolonged suffering. Why cant we send the meat frozen after being killed in Australia then at least the poor animals have not had to endure weeks sometimes months at sea standing in their own excrement. Salty sea air.

poor water and food supply and little comfort for sleep. At the end if the animal survives only to be met by illiterate non caring humans who have no value half the time for human life let alone poor animals at their disposal

Maria UK Let this be a step towards a better life for animals

2007-01-11 patricia shrigley uk if your going to eat them let them have a nice life and painless death
,


2007-01-04 Julie HALL Australia To all those who have the brains and heart to take action on this torturous matter - I salute you!


2007-01-03 PANKAJ BUCH INDIA ALL ANIMALS ARE HAVING THE RIGHT TO LIVE WITH DIGNITY AS HUMAN BEING. AS IT IS NATURAL RIGHT.IT IS ALSO CONFIRMED BY UNO IN ITS INTERNATIONAL CHARTER.PLEASE BE KIND TO SPEECHLESS ANIMALS. THANKING YOU. PANKAJ BUCH

2007-01-03 Mitchell Best Australia It would seem that out of sight out of mind,mentality is prevalent here I judge my leaders on how they look after all creatures humanely and we are wanting.

2007-01-02 Kate Nattrass USA The horrible suffering these animals endure must be stopped as it is a reflection of our own lack of compassion, integrity and ethics to allow these things to occur in a world where alternatives exist.



2006-12-27 Stephenie Skinner United States These sheep are treated horrible, this needs to stop !

Thea Donk Nederland Please stop the live export of animals,please, please, please

H.C. Donk Nederland (enter comments here)
2006-12-23 NARESH KADYAN INDIA THE METOD OF HANDLING ANIMAL IS WRONG.

Sophie Thomas England This must end now. Sick, disgusting and very, very cruel
Josefine Sweerman Netherlands I demand you to stop this appalling behaviour! No wool is worth this you low lifes.

Rojo
Sorry for the delay in my reply to you.
No I dont think the animals would be upset about not going on a ship or - a ride on the back of a motor bike in the ME.
This is what awaits them after the cruel shiiping according to reports. Please click on RSPCA web site below.
http://www.rspca.org.au/campaign/liveexport_evidence.asp