Today's $1000/week pay rise is criminal. Let's see if the Opposition & Greens are made of better stuff & reject this increase.

Jews would describe this as a "circumcision ceremony"

- The little ones are being cut while the big ones eat cakes!

Come on be fair.

They need to receive some compensation for
"Question Time," in Parliament - where ambitious
backbenchers ask questions for which the Ministers
have well prepared answers boasting about their own
and their government's/party's brilliance.

cont'd ...

It's been reported that the increase in salary
for the politicians is totally justifiable to facilitate
them coping with the cost of living increases that are
being generated BY THE CARBON TAX. The reputed
sources can't find any politicians in the
Opposition who will deny this claim.

If we don't hear the Liberals knocking that pay rise on the head they'll lose the next election.

Indy, have you checked the news lately?

"Tony Abbott defends increase in MP salary, saying he's working hard for every Australian".

justified fully by the need for the likes of Emerson getting singing lessons as well as some ethics based training.

The high salaries and perks serve two purposes. The first is attracting greedy, amoral people into politics, people who will be eager to do the bidding of the rich and powerful in exchange for personal advantage. The second is coopting the occasional incorruptible politician who slips through the preselection net. He/She soon acquires large investments to protect and expensive new hobbies, with new friends to go with them, and ceases to identify with ordinary people.

It is often argued that we need to pay market rates to get the best people, rather than relying on love of country or the desire to give something back to the community. But how is high intelligence, for example, good for us, if the politicians who have it simply use it to benefit themselves at our expense?

bonmot,
If I hear him defend this pay rise & accept it then they've lost me & many others.

Many of them urge wage control, except when it comes to themselves.

Many of them urge wage control
Chris Lewis,
this is beyond wage control, that's just blatant stealing. They are the Public Servants & we the public weren't consulted about granting them this rise or were we ?

What I really love is when retired politicians, like Richardson, make the "if we pay peanuts..." claim.
Remarkable, since he was a polly before the big pay rises.
If the higher rates are going to attract better quality, shouldn't all the existing pollies step down to make way for them?
The hypocrisy is truly breathtaking. When both the major parties have pretty much accepted neo-liberalism and even enterprise bargaining, who has a stronger, more united union front than our salary fixed politicians?
Comparisons with private enterprise is another joke, as there are some dramatic differences from the public to the private sector.
what about comparisons with other nations?
President Obama, the single most powerful man in the world, gets $400k.
US Senators and Congressmen get $172k.
I think the evidence from this experiment is already in.
When you offer more money, you attract people who are really good at making -themselves- more money.
Thanks to the amalgamations we didn't want and didn't have to have here in Qld, the average Mayor and Councillors make about 4 times as much as regional Mayors and Councillors in NSW.
Having lived in both states, I'm not seeing any value.

I find it appalling that the opposition doesn't openly denounce & reject this rise. Shame on them.
I now have run out of political parties to support.

individual,

"I have run out of political parties to support."

Hey, hey....then you've reached a "happy place". One that is surreal, but strangely satisfying.

(It happened to me some time around the last election : )

Welcome to the club, Indy.

Question for you (and others who have reached this realisation) ... now what?

<<Question for you (and others who have reached this realisation) ... now what?>>

I am not eligible to answer this question, but assuming you ran out even of all minor parties to support, what's left for you, Bonmot, is to form your own new party!

individual,

I agree with you.

Quite simplistic, Yuyu - and some would agree with you.

However, for most reasonable people, it's better to give a little/take a little.
In other words ... compromise and meet in the middle, for the common good.

The current level of political debate (at least here in OZ) is a race to the bottom - disrespect, regressive policy and negativity now appear to rule the day.

For what it's worth, some pollies really do try to steer an even keel, but they are frowned upon at best, or are gagged by their political elite - Turnbull/Rudd in the past and Dr Washer (Lib) over the asylum seeker travesty comes readily to mind.

Dear Bonmot,

Certainly, it is not feasible for most ordinary people to start their own party, so if one can give/take a little that's OK - but not when one needs to give/take too much. If you find a party that you can identify with at least 75-80% of their principles and policies, then better stick with it, which is what I do.

Yep, with you ... but there's the rub, and the conundrum we have here in Australia.

That 75-80% is nice Yuyu and that is what I do, too. However, the principles and policies (from all sides) is spun to a self-centered and selfish electorate, imho.

Who really is at fault ... the spin-ees (in their ignorance) or the spin-ers (in their self interest)?
Moreover, are the spin-ers deliberately 'dumbing down' the voters?

Perhaps that is why the electorate is becoming more and more angry - individually and collectively.

Yeah, who would want to be a politician anyway?

What bothers me the most about politicians' salaries is that they earn them regardless of:

1) Experience
2) Qualification
3) Performance

Realistically, they aren't even selected based on merit - particularly those propped up in 'safe' seats. Keeping a low profile can be the way to go when your sole selection criterion is that you haven't stuck your neck out an irritated the rusted-on party faithfuls in your electorate.

That said, it's a free country. If I'm willing to sell my soul and my integrity, I could probably join a party and eventually run as a candidate. Alas, I don't have the capital to put myself up as an independent.

Individual,
I have been that way for years now and particularly cynical about the major parties.

My usual voting pattern is to vote for an independant so as not to give the $2+ to a major. Usually toss a coin as to the major I put second last and last.

However not this time. AS I consider this to be the worst government since Federation I will do all I can to be rid of them. It is not just Gillard or Rudd, it is the whole lot of Labor politicians. Collectively they could not run a bath.

This time my vote will go to the Liberals. No matter what, they could not be worse than the current mob.

When a minister gets shifted to another portfolio is what gets me. They know zilch about it yet they become the head honcho ??
I really think it's high time the crowd (us voters) send a direct message to these maggots.
ALP is a proven failure, no point giving them any more votes, The Coalition should be given the benefit of the doubt but absolutely no leeway. Let's push for them to denounce this pay rise or they too need to be finished off. Bob Katter's crowd may prove to be still somewhat sensible, at least more than the Greens.
I'd like people to call on Katter to denounce this pay rise. Would they do it in return for votes ? I wonder if they read OLO and take note of the many sensible comments made here.
Why not ask them to donate the pay rise for a more worthy cause than themselves ?
Perhaps use the money to provide housing for the needy ? The party which denounces this pay rise will earn substantial respect from the electorate.

Sadly, it seems that we have now achieved REALITY in our political structure, and it is now glaringly apparent that this country is now being totally manipulated by a greedy bunch of thieving, spineless, two-faced rats, who are intent on milking the system until it runs dry!

In comparison to the obscenity of the latest Parliamentary hand-outs, I myself being an ex-serviceman, received my 6 monthly DFR&DB pension
increase, calculated by the ABS and equating to a CPI increase of .01%, awarding a princely sum of 74 CENTS! I am not complaining mind you, as there are a lot of folk out there losing their jobs and their futures, thanks to the greed of our (LOL) leaders!

I myself do NOT know what the answer to our problem is, short of a complete change of the system. Political Partys` have outworn their welcome, as have the Independents, which has been proved by the absolute mess they have helped to create in our current Parliament.
The Greens should all get back up in their trees where they all belong, hugging each other and doing the usual despicable things to each other that they are noted for!

I fear for the future of this country, our children, our grandchildren and their children, and I believe that we cannot survive much longer without suffering an internal economic and political collapse, which historically occurs in similar situations across the globe, and I cannot see that we are much different, apart from being relatively slow to become enraged and to react!

Crackcup,
I'd have thought that this topic would have brought many out of the woods either being for/against the pay rise. I find the lack of participation extremely disconcerting. Would it be a reflection of our society as a whole now ? Do people support greed now to such an extent that they even accept an insanely criminal misuse of our taxes ? Are they somehow hoping to get more out of it themselves ?
I'm totally with you in fearing for the future of Australia. Are Australians really that stupid to accept this misuse of taxes without even airing their views ?
Can I get off at the next stop please, I don't want to go as far as Moronia.

Indy:
You and I seem to be fairly well aligned in our general thoughts and opinions, thus you may have noticed that I have been relatively "quiet" during recent occurrences that have been "grabbing the headlines". My silence has been due in part to my utter frustration in trying to effectively stir people into some form of action, by at least voicing their opinions in regard to this rapidly degenerating political structure that is condemning us and our children to many years of indebtdness, simply because Gillard and the Travelling Circus want to make a big name for themselves by handing out Millions of Dollars of Taxpayer`s money to every "bleeding heart"
cause that sticks it`s head up!.....I may caution that they will not win any friends on the home front, in fact their names will be held in contempt by the committed generations to come, as we follow the rest of the greed ridden nations towards the coming apocalypse that awaits every Soddom and Gomorrah type society that thrives on the principles of "Greed is Good!"

I have watched this country decline since the 1950`s, as each successive Government has introduced it`s own particular raft of insane policies, and I have noticed that some particular occurrences
are commomplace to all Governments, regardless of leaning, and that is the passage of Bills through the Parliament that COST the people dearly in some shape or form, followed by a Parliamentary pay rise!

This country cannot afford these ridiculous Parliamentary pay increases, especially at this time when we have a National Debt that is fast reaching Bankruptcy, we are now drowning in Asylum Seekers that are costing this country dearly, and at the same time handing out Billions of Dollars to foreign countries that DO NOT need this Foreign Aid, which is some cases is being used to purchase weapons of war, or being misappropriated by persons well positioned in the appropriate government!
(continued)

Indy: (continued):
I have simple desires in life, ....I want to restore this country to a country where each and every individual has to work during his or her lifetime to provide for the future, to restore the lost values of respecting our elders, and treating each and every individual as we would like to be treated, and try to irradicate the principle of greed and profit being tantamount to everything in life!....unfortunately I believe I am urinating into the wind and am wasting my time and energy,...however it needs to be said, and whether it is distasteful or not, we have to grab reality and stop cow-towing to the UN, which is indirectly bleeding this country dry!!

I can see 3 separate concepts here:
Representatives,
Leaders,
Bosses.
Can our parliamentarians truly be called 'Representatives'? While the 'average' wage continues to soar in this country (driven from the top), the median wage -that which 50% of Australians make less than- remains stubbornly below $40k.
Our primary representative now makes about 12 times more than the people she is supposed to represent.
The theory is, we elect one of our peers to represent our wishes, our desires and our goals, both for ourselves and for our children, in the national forum.
Our parliamentarians are no longer our peers, they show no interest in our wishes, and they show far more concern for their own children than ours.
Does your representative's child go to a public school, or a private one?
Does your representative have to wait years for a hospital bed, or an operation?
And does your representative have to worry about job security, on a day to day basis?
So, not representatives, but Leaders?
Apparently not. Our pollies do not set their own wage levels (directly), and they certainly don't ask us, their putative employers, how much we think they should be paid.
Instead of leading, they follow the marketplace, and the standard prices for 'similar positions', despite the fact there are no similar positions in the private sector.
This strategy can have only one conclusion: a ever widening gap between rich and poor; between haves and have nots.
Is this where we want to be led? Is this the result we are paying our representatives to achieve?
So, rather than representatives or leaders, our parliamentarians have placed themselves squarely in the position of Bosses. They want, not only to act like bosses, but be paid like bosses. They already socialise mostly with bosses, now they want to be peers with bosses. They already share the bosses' lifestyle and better; now they want to share the bosses' tax bracket.
Who do our representatives represent?
Must working class Australians now form a union, to represent us against our representatives?

Another $250 Million to be thrown at the Afghanistan fiasco!

The so-called war in Afghanistan was a lost cause, long before "Silly Old Uncle Sam" decided to become involved. The British, Russia and many other nations have realised the folly of involvement in hostilities in this Godforsaken piece of desolation.

Our involvement and presence in Afghanistan was engineered by the US elite, sanctioned by the UN to supposedly free the Afghanis from the shackles of the Taliban, as so-called pay-back for their (Osama Bin Laden`s) allegedely masterminding the Manhattan Twin Towers destruction.

We should NOT be their regardless of petty politics, but because we are, it is now costing us valuable lives and millions of dollars that we can no longer afford, whilst at the same time creating more Asylum Seekers who use the opportunity to seek solace in the arms of the ever-welcoming do-gooders and bleeding hearts, who seem intent upon creating a chronic state of divisiveness across the whole country, as we ricochet from one contraversial issue to another, whilst pandering to the whims of these "insurrectionists"!

Enough is enough, let us have a Referendum on these issues now. before we sink any further into the morass of insanity!

I think an extremely saddening & sobering fact is that none of the Government opposing parties have reject the pay rise. I have always believed the Conservatives would somehow be conservative but my believe has been shattered. There is no doubt that it was Labor who got us into this & the Coalition will get us out of it again but deep down they're brushed with the same tar. They still have a chance to show themselves as better before the next election, let's pray they wake up their last ounce of integrity for the Nation's sake.

Watching the 'Fog of War' the other night I thought it was instructive to learn Robert McNamara left one of the highest paying jobs in America, the CEO of the Ford Motor Company to become Secretary of State under JFK. He first went to his family and explained it would mean a dramatic change in lifestyle as the pay was only about $75,000 per annum, but they turned out to be fully supportive and he took the job. The notion of service, have we lost sight of it?

The notion of service, have we lost sight of it?
csteele,
I hope Tony Abbott gets to hear about this.

I think that looking at how much they are getting, they are not actually on the high side of things. But that is just their basic pay and that would not account for how much they get for allowance which is actually where they wreak havoc. I am not saying that they go straight to their pockets, as it would not be fair to put judgment on them just like that. But in most cases, you just don't know which side you are going to fully take.