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The Forum > General Discussion > Legitimate Self Defence and the Catholic Church

Legitimate Self Defence and the Catholic Church

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With the number of attacks on citizens and recent murders in mind, I thought that I'd have a look at what the major Christian church has to say on self defence.
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

Legitimate defense
2263 The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. "The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one's own life; and the killing of the aggressor.... The one is intended, the other is not."[65]

2264 Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one's own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow:
If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful.... Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one's own life than of another's.[65]

2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for someone responsible for another's life. Preserving the common good requires rendering the unjust aggressor unable to inflict harm. To this end, those holding legitimate authority have the right to repel by armed force aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their charge.[66
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 8:19:43 AM
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Y'know, you're right. I bet Jesus wanted us all to have handguns.
Posted by TurnRightThenLeft, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 10:34:35 AM
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...And which institution would not turn off the lights of the Vatican in WWII, allowing bombers to line-up their runs?

I also find it convenient the Churches allow for self-defense to be extended to nations and authorities. The other convenience is that clerics are exempted, as not to take them away from their contemplation of god.
Posted by Oliver, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 3:26:18 PM
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TRTL,
He did let His disciples have swords, the major defensive weapon of the day.
He even advised them to go and buy one if they weren't already armed.

Oliver,
Which places were the bombers going to bomb? (a bit off topic but interesting none the less).
Not all countries exemp the clergy from war service, generally in the English speaking world they are; but then some volunteer as Padres and not a few have been decorated for bravery and others have lost their lives.
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 6:23:24 PM
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"Not all countries exempt the clergy from war service."

-- I did not know that. Interesting. What about volunteering? Did any priest carry a gun in WWII, Korean or Vietnam and actively fight? Do you feel they should/should not?

--- Vatican in WWII. I have seen references to the Vacican having its lights on on TV war documentaries. I will have quick look, to see if I can come up with some more specific information. [The point was the consequences of the alleged [for now] actions.
Posted by Oliver, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 9:07:12 PM
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re WW2 and Vatican--Can't remember the precise details from a non-fiction book re the relationship between the Vatican and Germany while Italy was under German Occupation-- Apparently, there was an understanding with Germany that the Vatican Area/property would be off-bounds to the occupying forces which indeed happened. This gave speculation that Pope Pius was silent about rumoured? atrocities due to the Vatican's situation??!! From memory??Rome was bombed by the Allies. The fact that the Vatican survived means that the Allies must have also left the the Vatican alone-- however, can't recall those details. The Allies made several attempts to 'liberate' Italy, which eventually happened. I seem to recall that at times, resistance people, patriots etc accessed refuge in the Vatican, as their fate was woeful if captured. Altho a little off-topic it was a serious and relevant complex politico-religio wartime situation, which still attracts debate.Someone can correct any wrong details, please.
Posted by digiwigi, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 11:24:50 PM
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